Palestine

[Archied]

39 minutes ago, Alph said:

I mean I'm not naming names it's all in the thread. But we did get into this conversation after bcn said enough is enough when Hamas return hostages and stop voting a terrorist organisation to run their country. 

My response was to tell him that basically it's nothing like that simple or one sided. 

To which you said "Whilst I agree and understand your post I do question whether it does anything other than perpetuate division and a partisan feel ( I’m sure you don’t do this purposely)"... then applied that to the protests. 

I thought it interesting you pulled me up and have issue with the protests. I'd say the division is created by the governments position when the public opinion is to demand an immediate ceasefire. 

Can you repost the original that I replied to with the above quote from me and I will check what it was that I felt was divisive , it seems a long while back and you have posted so much since then simply because there’s some bits I don’t see the same as you that it feels like being snowed under and I don’t remember the post I replied to or the one you were replying to ,

fact is in my opinion waving flags of one side or the other and arguing back and forth on who did what to who first is divisive and partisan in the current situation as I’ve stated you are welcome to your view 🤷🏻‍♂️

Edited March 6 by Archied

[Alph]

11 minutes ago, Archied said:

Can you repost the original that I replied to with the above quote from me and I will check what it was that I felt was divisive , it seems a long while back and you have posted so much since then simply because there’s some bits I don’t see the same as you that it feels like being snowed under and I don’t remember the post I replied to or the one you were replying to ,

fact is in my opinion waving flags of one side or the other and arguing back and forth on who did what to who first is divisive and partisan in the current situation as I’ve stated you are welcome to your view 🤷🏻‍♂️

To be honest would it actually resolve anything? I'm not wanting to fall out and I don't think we'll agree on this!! 🤣

[Archied]

8 minutes ago, Alph said:

To be honest would it actually resolve anything? I'm not wanting to fall out and I don't think we'll agree on this!! 🤣

Definitely don’t want to fall out and chances are we are 90  % in agreement, just had a look on your profile as I was interested in your age because it often has a bearing on how we see things , I’ve got a quarter of a century on you and if you had got me into a debate over the PLO when I was your age I may have come across very differently to you , age and life can tire you out a bit to the point that you find these constantly repeating horrors sickening and you just want to say duck the past , duck the old rights and wrongs , just ducking stop now 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Alph]

18 minutes ago, Archied said:

Definitely don’t want to fall out and chances are we are 90  % in agreement, just had a look on your profile as I was interested in your age because it often has a bearing on how we see things , I’ve got a quarter of a century on you and if you had got me into a debate over the PLO when I was your age I may have come across very differently to you , age and life can tire you out a bit to the point that you find these constantly repeating horrors sickening and you just want to say duck the past , duck the old rights and wrongs , just ducking stop now 🤷🏻‍♂️

I'm 38 and angry enough already. If I get more fed up over the years.... Oh god. 

It's a heated subject so naturally small disagreements can get heated. But I don't actually like falling out with people! 

Cheers Archied. Messed my day at work up though. Got nothing done! 

[Archied]

17 minutes ago, Alph said:

I'm 38 and angry enough already. If I get more fed up over the years.... Oh god. 

It's a heated subject so naturally small disagreements can get heated. But I don't actually like falling out with people! 

Cheers Archied. Messed my day at work up though. Got nothing done! 

You get less angry if your lucky ,, the downside is you get more cynical, don’t worry about falling out , im never gonna storm off, get abusive and call you names , we are both obviously sensible enough to stand our ground , give our opinion but most importantly be able to agree to disagree on points , it’s that quality that gives a little bit of hope in what can often seem like a cess pit of a world at times 😀👍

[Alph]

34 minutes ago, Archied said:

You get less angry if your lucky ,, the downside is you get more cynical, don’t worry about falling out , im never gonna storm off, get abusive and call you names , we are both obviously sensible enough to stand our ground , give our opinion but most importantly be able to agree to disagree on points , it’s that quality that gives a little bit of hope in what can often seem like a cess pit of a world at times 😀👍

Very true. Especially online. It's hard to reason with people online and we end up just shouting at each other. 

Also what's good is that we get our news from outside the mainstream but at the same time it's really easy to only get news from the bias you want to hear. End up with 'news' that reinforces our views. You can switch off opposing views. Get to be correct 100% of the time. Then we take to (anti) social media to bombard the opposition with our convenient facts. 

I need to try to switch off to this conflict tbh. It's been OTT since October 7th. Quite unhealthy. I see it as one of the great injustices. Maybe it would do some good if I just worried about whether Joshua will beat Ngannou or if I can cut my grass this weekend. Not spending hours I don't have to spare clicking constant updates! 

[Stive Pesley]

Does this help lighten the mood?

 

[Comrade 86]

25 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

Does this help lighten the mood?

 

She was simply using his pronoun. Nothing to see here 😂

[Ram-Alf]

Crazy 🙄 What next 🤷‍♂️

https://news.sky.com/story/pro-palestine-protesters-target-lord-balfour-painting-at-trinity-college-in-cambridge-13090043

[Comrade 86]

7 minutes ago, Ram-Alf said:

Crazy 🙄 What next 🤷‍♂️

https://news.sky.com/story/pro-palestine-protesters-target-lord-balfour-painting-at-trinity-college-in-cambridge-13090043

If only our politicians and few on here were so quick to condemn the ethnic cleansing we're witnessing in Gaza as they are a painting being damaged. 30,000 dead, that's ok, a damaged fookin painting, argh, outrage. 

Honestly couldn't make this s*** up.

[Archied]

1 hour ago, Comrade 86 said:

If only our politicians and few on here were so quick to condemn the ethnic cleansing we're witnessing in Gaza as they are a painting being damaged. 30,000 dead, that's ok, a damaged fookin painting, argh, outrage. 

Honestly couldn't make this s*** up.

I’m with you on some of the sentiment but also aren’t we a bit tired of people using the deaths of people now to allow them an excuse to behave like txts , it’s just pure criminal behaviour and I will wager the person who did it will fall within a certain predictable demographic that we see doing this stuff for any and numerous given reason , ffs try to do something positive, something original , maybe something anonymously that’s not more about grabbing five minutes of fame and showing everyone what a brave and virtuous person you are and more about the poor people dying , they certainly arnt raising awareness of people dying in the gazza , anyone who is decent enough to care is more than fully aware already and if it’s supposed to be done to point to earlier historical political rights and wrong in the region ( material targeted) then they can duck off in my view because as I say that means nothing until the killing is stopped first and foremost 🤷🏻‍♂️
I kind of wonder who’s worst , the kind of people who don’t give a duck about what’s going on or the kind that want and need to make it all about themselves 

Edited March 8 by Archied

[Ram-Alf]

1 hour ago, Comrade 86 said:

If only our politicians and few on here were so quick to condemn the ethnic cleansing we're witnessing in Gaza as they are a painting being damaged. 30,000 dead, that's ok, a damaged fookin painting, argh, outrage. 

Honestly couldn't make this s*** up.

I have to agree with the Politician comments, But slashing at a painting is a little churlish...but they made their point and got the coverage 

 

[Comrade 86]

8 minutes ago, Archied said:

I’m with you on some of the sentiment but also aren’t we a bit tired of people using the deaths of people now to allow them an excuse to behave like txts , it’s just pure criminal behaviour and I will wager the person who did it will fall within a certain predictable demographic that we see doing this stuff for any and numerous given reason , ffs try to do something positive, something original , maybe something anonymously that’s not more about grabbing five minutes of fame and showing everyone what a brave and virtuous person you are and more about the poor people dying , they certainly arnt raising awareness of people dying in the gazza , anyone who is decent enough to care is more than fully aware already and if it’s supposed to be done to point to earlier historical political rights and wrong in the region ( material targeted) then they can duck off in my view because as I say that means nothing until the killing is stopped first and foremost 🤷🏻‍♂️

Frankly Archie, I couldn't give a tuppeny f*** about the painting, nor, with respect, what you think about the idiots who damaged it. My sole focus is the mass slaughter of civilians in Gaza. A painting or, 30,000 dead, 100,00 injured, 10,000 buried and rotting in rubble and 2 million displaced and starving? In terms of where my focus lies my attention, it's not a hard call and a damaged painting ain't gonna change that, not now, not ever.

Enjoy your evening.

[Archied]

14 minutes ago, Comrade 86 said:

Frankly Archie, I couldn't give a tuppeny f*** about the painting, nor, with respect, what you think about the idiots who damaged it. My sole focus is the mass slaughter of civilians in Gaza. A painting or, 30,000 dead, 100,00 injured, 10,000 buried and rotting in rubble and 2 million displaced and starving? In terms of where my focus lies my attention, it's not a hard call and a damaged painting ain't gonna change that, not now, not ever.

Enjoy your evening.

As I say we are pretty much on the same page , I was replying to a post on here regards people who in my opinion are far more interested in themselves than people dying , I also don’t give a shxt about a dusty old painting which begs the question why do these kind of self publicising attention seekers care about said dusty old painting , just because I have and express an opinion on a post regarding them does not in any way detract from what I think is far more important,

we probably disagree on the actions and motive of those involved in this frankly minuscule in relative terms to what’s going on but that’s fine , don’t make either of us right or wrong just a different opinion on a news story today 🤷🏻‍♂️,

enjoy the boxing 👍

 

[Archied]

Ok , I’ve tried to steer clear of the politics of this situation because frankly I don’t believe it’s helpful at this point but let me make it plain , anyone of my age , from my political background/ upbringing, with half a brain cell could not fail to know that the Palestinian people have been treated despicably by the western world for many many years ,at this point though I only care about how the hell we stop this ducking killing , since the 7 th there have been countless needless heartbreaking deaths on both sides,,, the numbers of deaths on either side are totally uneven because Isreal has the upper hand in the power balance , if hammas had the upper hand then that would be different again , still just adds up to innocent deaths

you get to my age and you just get sick of the bloody madness 🤷🏻‍♂️
I don’t feel the need to convince anybody of anything or think I’m anymore right or wrong than anybody else , I’m just giving an opinion on what I see 

Edited March 8 by Archied

[uttoxram75]

1 hour ago, Archied said:

Ok , I’ve tried to steer clear of the politics of this situation because frankly I don’t believe it’s helpful at this point but let me make it plain , anyone of my age , from my political background/ upbringing, with half a brain cell could not fail to know that the Palestinian people have been treated despicably by the western world for many many years ,at this point though I only care about how the hell we stop this ducking killing , since the 7 th there have been countless needless heartbreaking deaths on both sides,,, the numbers of deaths on either side are totally uneven because Isreal has the upper hand in the power balance , if hammas had the upper hand then that would be different again , still just adds up to innocent deaths

you get to my age and you just get sick of the bloody madness 🤷🏻‍♂️
I don’t feel the need to convince anybody of anything or think I’m anymore right or wrong than anybody else , I’m just giving an opinion on what I see 

With you all the way Archie. Its nowt to do with politics to want to stop people killing each other. Well, it is politics i suppose due to the fact that all politicians of our main parties want the slaughter to continue.

Most non-politicians probably think we should do what we can to stop it.

[Archied]

34 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

With you all the way Archie. Its nowt to do with politics to want to stop people killing each other. Well, it is politics i suppose due to the fact that all politicians of our main parties want the slaughter to continue.

Most non-politicians probably think we should do what we can to stop it.

I watched a U.K. politician being interviewed the other day ( can’t remember his name ) they got on the subject of the U.K. providing financial support for Ukraine and the public poss tiring of that , he proceeded to explain that that money was not just gifted to Ukraine, it was used to spend in U.K. manufacturing weapons , it provided jobs in U.K. and produced tax therefore being good for the U.K. economy, now whatever anyone may think on the rights and wrongs of Russia Ukraine conflict these politicians are getting so stupid / arrogant that they now openly state what most of us already knew / know but at least they used to have the sense to pretend and not blatantly tell us how good for us people being killed on other shores was for us 😥

Edited March 9 by Archied

[uttoxram75]

8 minutes ago, Archied said:

I watched a U.K. politician being interviewed the other day ( can’t remember his name ) they got on the subject of the U.K. providing financial support for Ukraine and the public poss tiring of that , he proceeded to explain that that money was not just gifted to Ukraine, it was used to spend in U.K. manufacturing weapons , it provided jobs in U.K. and produced tax therefore being good for the U.K. economy, now whatever anyone may think on the rights and wrongs of Russia Ukraine conflict these politicians are getting so stupid / arrogant that they now openly state what most of us already knew / know but at least they used to have the sense to pretend and not blatantly tell us how good for us people being killed on other shores was for us 😥

Exactly mate. Rich people profit from war. Poor people die. That's why they do it.

[Crewton]

Then again, some people want the resources to oppose an invader, but they can't have them because it might make rich people richer. I suppose the alternative is to have those weapons supplied by a State-owned arms producer so that everyone not directly involved in fighting for their nation, culture, identity and so on can be reassured that no-one is getting rich.

TBH I don't think the people who want and need those weapons cares about our principles.

[Alph]

3 hours ago, Archied said:

Ok , I’ve tried to steer clear of the politics of this situation because frankly I don’t believe it’s helpful at this point but let me make it plain , anyone of my age , from my political background/ upbringing, with half a brain cell could not fail to know that the Palestinian people have been treated despicably by the western world for many many years ,at this point though I only care about how the hell we stop this ducking killing , since the 7 th there have been countless needless heartbreaking deaths on both sides,,, the numbers of deaths on either side are totally uneven because Isreal has the upper hand in the power balance , if hammas had the upper hand then that would be different again , still just adds up to innocent deaths

you get to my age and you just get sick of the bloody madness 🤷🏻‍♂️
I don’t feel the need to convince anybody of anything or think I’m anymore right or wrong than anybody else , I’m just giving an opinion on what I see 

 

Ceasefire. It's been the logical and correct stance for a while. Forever actually. 

Why can't they say Ceasefire? "Because we want a ceasefire that lasts". 

Er... Wtf? It makes zero sense. Because Hamas or at least a version of Hamas will rise again.

So whatever side of the argument you are on or whatever solution you think you have, you are pissing in the wind if you think a brutal military campaign leads to peace. (From either side)

A temporary ceasefire stands more chance of leading to a long term ceasefire. It just does. Knowing Hamas will repeat their actions so instead supporting Israel's ethnic cleansing is putting Israeli lives a priority over Arabs. It's a lie the government has told us about why we need to continue this war. So either they're stupid or they think people are. 

Obviously the steps taken to keep extending the ceasefire do become complex and contentious. But supporting a ceasefire is a no brainer. I have a hard time accepting the view that with just a bit more killing we'll see the benefits in the long run. 

Edited March 9 by Alph