Electric Vehicles

[Comrade 86]

On 15/04/2024 at 11:42, Stive Pesley said:

Looks like I was right, as reports are now suggesting that Tesla are binning their mass-market affordable Model 2 plans

Seems that their tanking share price is focusing their minds on cracking self-driving, rather than mass market production of a standard drive EV - as long term, it's self-driving that will win the market (and up the share price)

Recalled another 2 million cars in February. Affected 2.19 million Tesla vehicles, including the Model S, Model X, Model 3, Model Y, and the 2024 Cybertruck. More software issues, apparently, but font related this time. Yes, really!

All 4,000 Cybertrucks sold to date have, this week, also been subject to a separate 'total recall' (sorry, been dying too use that), due to accelerator pedals snagging on interior components. It's odd, as one might sensibly assume that something this obvious (and homicidal) would have been uncovered in testing. 

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

On 22/09/2023 at 14:35, Stive Pesley said:

Thanks for the replies, and for the avoidance of doubt, I'm only asking about the charging infrastructure as a problem I want to see solved - rather than being a grumpy old git suggesting that EVs will never work because (shakes fist)

I hate owning a car anyway - petrol or electric. I just want the cheapest option available to me, with the least hassle. Does anyone actually make an EV yet that isn't a willy-waving "big car"? Feels like car design in general has been increasing the size for a long time. When you see "big cars" from the 70s and 80s now, they look tiny in comparison to the massive cars that everyone seems to have these days (what my wife calls "fat bloke cars")

 

 

There's loads out there,mini EV,fiat 500 EV,Mazda mx30,mg4,id3,cupra born....

All great small cars and reaching price parity new but especially 2nd hand with traditional ice cars.

The mg4,which is a superb car,is already cheaper new than a new ford focus or golf but is similar size and with a 7 year warranty against their paltry 3 years.

No brainer if you can charge at home (around 250 miles of range for £5 of electricity on the cheap tariff we have)

 

Edited April 21 by kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong

[Stive Pesley]

1 hour ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

All great small cars

The mini and the Fiat 500 maybe, but all those others look big to me. Probably just because generally cars seem to be trending towards the ugly big blocky thing, and no longer compact and sleek. Even hatchbacks seem designed to look like 4x4 these days

As I said - I'm not a fan of cars anyway 😂

[Sport Billy]

Manufacturers will likely switch to making EVs even without government mandates. It’s just where the market is heading. It's kind of wild to think about how fast things are changing and how much different the car scene will be in just a few years. If you're still on the fence about traditional engines vs. electric, there's a useful article on diesel and gasoline engines that might help you weigh your options: https://www.a1autotransport.com/diesel-vs-gasoline-engines/. Breaks down some of the key differences between the two, which could be handy when you're deciding what kind of vehicle is right for you.

Edited April 22 by Sport Billy

[TimRam]

2 hours ago, Sport Billy said:

Manufacturers will likely switch to making EVs even without government mandates. It’s just where the market is heading. It's kind of wild to think about how fast things are changing and how much different the car scene will be in just a few years. If you're still on the fence about traditional engines vs. electric, there's a useful article on diesel and gasoline engines that might help you weigh your options: https://www.a1autotransport.com/diesel-vs-gasoline-engines/. Breaks down some of the key differences between the two, which could be handy when you're deciding what kind of vehicle is right for you.

For me it's not the engines but the batteries. After a few years of use the life left is still an unknown and unclear how long would be left before expensive replacements are needed. It's that unknown which puts me off.

[Tamworthram]

4 hours ago, Sport Billy said:

Manufacturers will likely switch to making EVs even without government mandates. It’s just where the market is heading. It's kind of wild to think about how fast things are changing and how much different the car scene will be in just a few years. If you're still on the fence about traditional engines vs. electric, there's a useful article on diesel and gasoline engines that might help you weigh your options: https://www.a1autotransport.com/diesel-vs-gasoline-engines/. Breaks down some of the key differences between the two, which could be handy when you're deciding what kind of vehicle is right for you.

That doesn’t seem to be a very balanced article. 
 

Diesel engines are more efficient but diesel is more expensive at the pump. Diesel engines emit less CO2 but a higher level of other air pollution. Whilst not as bad, diesel engines are still noisier (I think) and whilst diesel engines may be need less maintenance I believe the cost of such maintenance is higher for a diesel.

Another article I found seems to suggest the “best” type of fuel may depend on the sort of journeys you generally do.

Regarding electric cars, the two things that still put me off at the moment, despite improvements, is the purchase cost and the range.

[Archied]

8 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

That doesn’t seem to be a very balanced article. 
 

Diesel engines are more efficient but diesel is more expensive at the pump. Diesel engines emit less CO2 but a higher level of other air pollution. Whilst not as bad, diesel engines are still noisier (I think) and whilst diesel engines may be need less maintenance I believe the cost of such maintenance is higher for a diesel.

Another article I found seems to suggest the “best” type of fuel may depend on the sort of journeys you generally do.

Regarding electric cars, the two things that still put me off at the moment, despite improvements, is the purchase cost and the range.

I’ve long been of the opinion that electric vehicle s are part of the solution but not THE solution to the future and this massive pressure to make them the be all and end all , forcing people into them is going to come back and bite , not bite those doing the pushing and making very big bucks but those who can least afford it who are being pushed ,,, diesel anyone ?

Edited April 22 by Archied

[Stive Pesley]

15 hours ago, Tamworthram said:

Regarding electric cars, the two things that still put me off at the moment, despite improvements, is the purchase cost and the range.

Add to that the availability of charging capacity. Not too bad if you have a driveway and a home charge point, but even then you've got to work out your options for long journeys. So you plot a charging station, arrive there and it's already being used. Wait 30 minutes for a free charger and then wait another 30 minutes for yours to charge. Suddenly your journey has taken an hour longer, and you've eaten a whole packet of krispy kremes

[David Graham Brown]

E-fuels are also being developed, this may be a good alternative to EVs’. No expensive battery replacement needed, to state the obvious.

[cstand]

Great video about Tesla cars if anyone is thinking of buying one.

Quite shocked on the mega miles people are racking up in these EVs.

Just read the very complementary comments section from real life owners in the you tube video. 

New battery technology upgrades as well.

https://electrek.co/2024/04/24/tesla-expects-4680-battery-cells-cheaper-than-suppliers-end-of-year/

 

Edited April 25 by cstand

[Stive Pesley]

I see Elton has promised more undeliverable stuff in an unachievable timeline to try and stem the tanking of the share price. And investors seem to be lapping it up as usual. How many times does he get away with this move?? It's astonishing. Fair play to him!

[BaaLocks]

On 22/04/2024 at 14:48, TimRam said:

For me it's not the engines but the batteries. After a few years of use the life left is still an unknown and unclear how long would be left before expensive replacements are needed. It's that unknown which puts me off.

I've got a Chevrolet Volt - gives me about 35 miles of electric charge and then a petrol engine. Run it locally, largely, and ten years on two points to note:

- Currently tracking at about 96mpg, we use it for long trips but happily use only electric on most runs

- Ten years / 80k miles on I see very little fall off in the range or charging time. It might drop off to nothing one day soon but seen less to nothing worth writing home about to date

Definitely thinking about the BYD Atto for our next car, they get a bit beaten up for having a limited distributor network but if you live near one that becomes a moot point. I'm not too deflected by YouTube clickbait warriors, or about the reports that Tesla Cybertrucks are being withdrawn because the accelerator is sticking on many.

[cstand]

Tesla and Lexus are top when it comes to customer satisfaction in the luxury brand of cars. 
That’s an incredible achievement in a short space of time to be up there with Lexus.

One my neighbours just bought a Tesla she loves driving it, she is a driving instructor so loves driving cars.

https://insideevs.com/news/683064/tesla-lexus-top-customer-satisfaction-study/amp/

Edited April 25 by cstand

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

On 22/04/2024 at 14:48, TimRam said:

For me it's not the engines but the batteries. After a few years of use the life left is still an unknown and unclear how long would be left before expensive replacements are needed. It's that unknown which puts me off.

Batteries are proving to be outlasting the rest of the car with very few failures being revealed.

Every EV comes with an 8 warranty at the very least but they are expected to last much,much longer than that.

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

On 25/04/2024 at 13:43, BaaLocks said:

I've got a Chevrolet Volt - gives me about 35 miles of electric charge and then a petrol engine. Run it locally, largely, and ten years on two points to note:

- Currently tracking at about 96mpg, we use it for long trips but happily use only electric on most runs

- Ten years / 80k miles on I see very little fall off in the range or charging time. It might drop off to nothing one day soon but seen less to nothing worth writing home about to date

Definitely thinking about the BYD Atto for our next car, they get a bit beaten up for having a limited distributor network but if you live near one that becomes a moot point. I'm not too deflected by YouTube clickbait warriors, or about the reports that Tesla Cybertrucks are being withdrawn because the accelerator is sticking on many.

We have a plug in hybrid but will be changing it for a polestar 2 or ioniq 5 later in the year as we found we use the petrol engine side so rarely (and it's so much better to drive and cheaper in EV mode) that we decided to buy a full EV next.

[BaaLocks]

2 hours ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

We have a plug in hybrid but will be changing it for a polestar 2 or ioniq 5 later in the year as we found we use the petrol engine side so rarely (and it's so much better to drive and cheaper in EV mode) that we decided to buy a full EV next.

Yeah, our thought it is to keep one of our two cars as petrol so we can do the occassional long run without having to charge and then have the other electric. Your point on driving experience is a very good one for two reasons - plug in hybrids are terrible in petrol mode (ours makes all sorts of noises unrelated to the speed of the car as it charges the battery to the needed level - not sure if it is the same on all plug ins but for the Volt you never actually 'use' the petrol engine to drive the car, the purpose of the engine is to then charge the battery - if that makes sense). Second point is that the drive experience of an electric car - torque, no gear change, response - knocks any petrol engine into a cocked hat.

[TimRam]

If you are in a shunt what's to say the batteries have not been compromised.

2 hours ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

Batteries are proving to be outlasting the rest of the car with very few failures being revealed.

Every EV comes with an 8 warranty at the very least but they are expected to last much,much longer than that.

Do you have links regarding the first part? Just need education on the batteries used in cars. Every one I've used in many devices does not last years with the same power after many recharge cycles. Is it true an ev could be written off even if an accident is "slight" due to the unknown state of batteries?

[Stive Pesley]

2 hours ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

Batteries are proving to be outlasting the rest of the car

I was just reading Elton's latest brain-fart though. He's decided that Tesla can somehow harness all the compute power of the Teslas sat on driveways while not being driven, as some sort of grid computing network... to do "stuff"

Aside from this maybe annoying the owners who have charged their car for travel, and not for waking up to find it needs charging again because it's been doing "stuff" all night - this will also surely reduce the battery life long term. Or at least totally invalidate current battery life projection figures

Still - it gets the investors excited and maybe props the share price up a bit longer eh?

[Gaspode]

As a slight aside, I've just been trying to book a UK holiday - out of the dozens of self-catering properties I've looked at, one (only 1!) mentioned that they had EV charging available....

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

1 hour ago, Stive Pesley said:

I was just reading Elton's latest brain-fart though. He's decided that Tesla can somehow harness all the compute power of the Teslas sat on driveways while not being driven, as some sort of grid computing network... to do "stuff"

Aside from this maybe annoying the owners who have charged their car for travel, and not for waking up to find it needs charging again because it's been doing "stuff" all night - this will also surely reduce the battery life long term. Or at least totally invalidate current battery life projection figures

Still - it gets the investors excited and maybe props the share price up a bit longer eh?

I wouldn't bet against him,I know I haven't got a space rocket program!