No pressure but...Bielik is the key

[Stripperg-ram]

1 hour ago, DCFC_Sloth said:

Not sure why so many are being quick to remove Davies from a back 3. Bielik was rash when played at CB previously, so I think having Curtis’s leadership in there would be very useful, especially if we plan to be changing formation mid game. I don’t think Wisdom, Evans, or Te Weirik have done enough to be picked ahead of Davies, and I think he’s a real key element in that back three for us right now. 

A back three of: Clarke Davies Bielik, seems to have all the ingredients we need to play that formation successfully. 

I agree with this. I’d see Bielik in the Thorne role in a 4-3-3.

I think Curtis Davies has been a great signing/servant to this club. Emotionally articulate and intelligent. A good leader and considering how much we chop and change the back 4 (and therefore consistency is tough to come across) he’s been pretty solid in defence. I always thought it was a bit unfair to automatically give Rooney the armband, taking it off CD. Seemed a little abrupt and unwarranted.

[i-Ram]

8 minutes ago, Stripperg-ram said:

I think Curtis Davies has been a great signing/servant to this club. Emotionally articulate and intelligent. A good leader and considering how much we chop and change the back 4 (and therefore consistency is tough to come across) he’s been pretty solid in defence. I always thought it was a bit unfair to automatically give Rooney the armband, taking it off CD. Seemed a little abrupt and unwarranted.

I can think of 32 reasons why it was done though.

[Stripperg-ram]

5 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

I can think of 32 reasons why it was done though.

Yeah,  no I get that. And I understand that it’s not just the politics - Rooney has proved himself as a captain before. I just get the sense with Curtis, that although he’s no Igor, he’s the kinda player in 5 years we’ll look back on his time with us fondly. He seems like a committed professional and a consistent place in the team, as captain or not - he’ll deliver. 
MTW - the jury is still out.

Wisdom is a better Right Back

Evans is Utility.

and for me Bielik (going back to the thread) is a DM in the Thorne mold.

[Jubbs]

I have already had debates on here in the past regarding Bielik, but I'm going to say my thoughts again.

Bielik is immense. He's an absolutely dominant DM at championship level and was one of, if not, the most dominant DM's in the league last season pre-injury. There is a dilemma about where he'll play when he comes back and who he replaces. For me, even though he's been fairly solid, he has to replace Davies. I'll explain my reasoning:

Davies has to be the middle CB, he would get exposed for his poor passing and lack of pace in either LCB or RCB in a back 4 or 5. He plays well in the middle because he can command from the middle and not be exposed for his passing as Marshall distributes more to LCB/RCB. 

Bielik would be wasted at RCB as he needs to have the freedom of going forward and bringing the ball out, if he plays RCB, him going up would prevent the Byrne going forward as often as he'd need to cover for Bielik's progressive runs and carrying the ball forward, either that or we concede a lot from out right hand side instead.

Imo we should play Bielik in a dynamic middle CB/DM role. When defending, he drops into CB as part of a back 5, when attacking, he slots into the DM spot so he can bring the ball forward and provide the cover for breakaway or the ball gets passed back to him for him to distribute again. This means we won't have to drop Shinnie/Knight in the CM spots as well.

[BucksRam]

Interesting thought of Bielik being a replacement for Davis.  My view from before his injury was he is a far better DM than CB and I think that's his best position from the little I've seen of him.  My memory of him at CB for us is that he was less than comfortable there. Maybe wrong, my memory isn't what it was.  

[Orphanram]

41 minutes ago, Jubbs said:

I have already had debates on here in the past regarding Bielik, but I'm going to say my thoughts again.

Bielik is immense. He's an absolutely dominant DM at championship level and was one of, if not, the most dominant DM's in the league last season pre-injury. There is a dilemma about where he'll play when he comes back and who he replaces. For me, even though he's been fairly solid, he has to replace Davies. I'll explain my reasoning:

Davies has to be the middle CB, he would get exposed for his poor passing and lack of pace in either LCB or RCB in a back 4 or 5. He plays well in the middle because he can command from the middle and not be exposed for his passing as Marshall distributes more to LCB/RCB. 

Bielik would be wasted at RCB as he needs to have the freedom of going forward and bringing the ball out, if he plays RCB, him going up would prevent the Byrne going forward as often as he'd need to cover for Bielik's progressive runs and carrying the ball forward, either that or we concede a lot from out right hand side instead.

Imo we should play Bielik in a dynamic middle CB/DM role. When defending, he drops into CB as part of a back 5, when attacking, he slots into the DM spot so he can bring the ball forward and provide the cover for breakaway or the ball gets passed back to him for him to distribute again. This means we won't have to drop Shinnie/Knight in the CM spots as well.

I agree with nearly everything you’ve put in that post except for the first bit about his performances pre injury. I thought his performances were very mixed and not from game to game but usually within each game. Some of the stuff he was doing as you’ve rightly said put him above any other players in this league in the CDM role but at other times his decision making was getting him and the team in trouble. I really like that you can see he has got that ego and has that strut where he looks like he thinks he’s better than everyone else on the pitch, but you’ve got to channel that in the right way. There’s too many good players in the championship these days to get away with over confidence. If he balances some pragmatism with his undoubted ability, he will be the key player for us this season. 

[Rampage]

53 minutes ago, Jubbs said:

I have already had debates on here in the past regarding Bielik, but I'm going to say my thoughts again.

Bielik is immense. He's an absolutely dominant DM at championship level and was one of, if not, the most dominant DM's in the league last season pre-injury. There is a dilemma about where he'll play when he comes back and who he replaces. For me, even though he's been fairly solid, he has to replace Davies. I'll explain my reasoning:

Davies has to be the middle CB, he would get exposed for his poor passing and lack of pace in either LCB or RCB in a back 4 or 5. He plays well in the middle because he can command from the middle and not be exposed for his passing as Marshall distributes more to LCB/RCB. 

Bielik would be wasted at RCB as he needs to have the freedom of going forward and bringing the ball out, if he plays RCB, him going up would prevent the Byrne going forward as often as he'd need to cover for Bielik's progressive runs and carrying the ball forward, either that or we concede a lot from out right hand side instead.

Imo we should play Bielik in a dynamic middle CB/DM role. When defending, he drops into CB as part of a back 5, when attacking, he slots into the DM spot so he can bring the ball forward and provide the cover for breakaway or the ball gets passed back to him for him to distribute again. This means we won't have to drop Shinnie/Knight in the CM spots as well.

Davies just passes the ball to Bielik. Hey presto.

[RamNut]

i don’t think there is much to chose between wisdom and Evans tbh. 
evans has better passing. Neither are quick. Similar in the air. 
Davies brought discipline to the back line but you will still see wisdom wander off and push forward leaving a big hole. 

see Huddersfield’s goal.

again blackburn - without Davies - Evans, te wierik and wisdom were all over the place. Te wierik and wisdom were both pushing up. For Blackburn’s goal scored by Armstrong we were effectively playing one at the back. 

The central one of three is effectively the sweeper who provides the extra line of defence but if is also free to break forward. This is the role played by Kevin Vogt When hoffenheim came. He was outstanding and ran the whole game from that position.

Stimac played that role but you can’t imagine him abandoning it to play midfield in a change of formation.

bielik is a bit of an unknown. Whether he can run the game Vogt-style or marshall the defence like Stimac or Davies remains to be seen. Like others, I’m not sure if he is too reckless and lacking in discipline to play anywhere in central defence, but we’ll see. 

 

[Sparkle]

Where do people think Belick will play? 

Davies has not only captained the side in Rooney absence but against Norwich Huddersfield Watford and Forest we have conceded 3 goals in total which has a lot to do with him so he stays in my team thanks 

when Belick did start as a central defender he was actually poor and not so great when he played in front of the defenders which may well have been because everyone else was poor but what has he done to earn a place in the starting X1 

[Jubbs]

11 hours ago, RamNut said:

Like others, I’m not sure if he is too reckless and lacking in discipline to play anywhere in central defence, but we’ll see.

I've proved this before in another debate, the idea that he lacks discipline is a myth. He had 1 red and 3 yellows in 20 championship games. For a CB/DM that's nothing. His stats compared to others in both positions, he was in the top end of pretty much every stat.

[Jubbs]

2 hours ago, Sparkle said:

what has he done to earn a place in the starting X1 

Be our best player before his injury.

[Taribo]

1 hour ago, Jubbs said:

Be our best player before his injury.

Except he wasn’t. Not over a full game anyway, the highlights reel is misleading, for every 1 bit of good play there was 4-5 slow lumbering tackles, positioning errors and jogging around the middle of the park. Don’t get me wrong he’s young and I really want him to succeed but he’s not quite the answer just yet. 

[Jubbs]

4 minutes ago, Taribo said:

Except he wasn’t. Not over a full game anyway, the highlights reel is misleading, for every 1 bit of good play there was 4-5 slow lumbering tackles, positioning errors and jogging around the middle of the park

Sorry. but that's just wrong. There's opinions and there's being wrong.

The highlights shown are not misleading as they are all backed up by stats. The eye test backs up the stats and the stats back up the eye test. 

Few things:

11 minutes ago, Taribo said:

for every 1 bit of good play there was 4-5 slow lumbering tackles

He was 95th in the league for fouls per game. 95th. He made one bad tackle vs Charlton and suddenly "mistimed" every tackle he ever did for us.

 

12 minutes ago, Taribo said:

positioning errors

What are you on about? His positioning was excellent as a DM, he knew exactly when to push and when to stay back. Again, at CB he was fine positionally.

 

13 minutes ago, Taribo said:

jogging around the middle of the park

So you want him to constantly be sprinting everywhere he goes, box to box all the time, constant moving. Messi, the best player of all time, constantly walks around and knows exactly when to sprint/pick up the pace. Clever players don't constantly sprint all the time unless it is their role to do so. Eustace was a good player for us, did you ever see him sprint? 

[Taribo]

Sorry, definitely not going to argue but we’ve both got opinions which are the opposite end of the spectrum. I take your stats and opinions but it’s not changed my mind - but I do hope I’m wrong!

x 

[DCFC_Sloth]

22 hours ago, NottsRam77 said:

Bar pace 

I wasn’t that impressed with him at the back ... thought he was rash and didn’t read situations particularly well... not when u compare him to Curtis or Clarke 
 

I see him long term as at the base of the midfield basically direct competition with bird with either a runner like knight around him or two infront of him in a midfield 3

basically we will look to phase Rooney out Or our reliance on him 

Is argue that for a defender Clarke isn’t slow, and now is Bielik, so I don’t think we would be especially exposed in that area.

I do however, agree about his long term place in the team and would love to see him as part of a midfield three. He has the attributes to be an absolute monster there. I assume our future is Bielik with two of Knight, Bird and Bird and that is a mouth watering prospect!

I remember against Hull away last season when he tackled a player, beat two more and played an pin point diagonal to the left wing. There is a really dominant centre mid in him just waiting to be unleashed.  

[Anag Ram]

My main worry with Bielik is the tackle he does from behind in which he wraps a long leg round an opponent to get to the ball.

Not only is this a risk in the box, but also an injury risk if he goes over on it when extended.

However, I think he’s an excellent signing.

[dabber]

47 minutes ago, DCFC_Sloth said:

Is argue that for a defender Clarke isn’t slow, and now is Bielik, so I don’t think we would be especially exposed in that area.

I do however, agree about his long term place in the team and would love to see him as part of a midfield three. He has the attributes to be an absolute monster there. I assume our future is Bielik with two of Knight, Bird and Bird and that is a mouth watering prospect!

I remember against Hull away last season when he tackled a player, beat two more and played an pin point diagonal to the left wing. There is a really dominant centre mid in him just waiting to be unleashed.  

Well they do say that a Bird in the hand is better than two in a midfield three.....?

[EulogyForEvolution]

I can see the team being something like this when he's available:

                         Marshall 

           Te Wierik  Bielik  Clarke

Bryne                                      Buchannan
                  Shinnie    Knight

      Jozwiak                       Lawrence

                         Waghorn

That would easily convert to a 433. I agree that Bielik will be absolutely key to this working. 

Sibley and Bird will find their way into the team when Shinnie and Knight fall out of form or need a rest. 

I'm guessing Rooney will deputise upfront when Waggy or Kaz aren't available or firing. 

I'm still backing Dutch Mike to find his way back into the team soon. He had a bad start, but so did everyone!

[Mostyn6]

Bielik looks committed, but clumsy to me. Not sure he’s gonna be that good. Doesn’t seem an intelligent footballer. 

[Rolleston]

Bielik, slower than Huddlestone, what a waste of money