Coronavirus

[Uptherams]

45 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Might just be me but, after the last few days of doom and gloom, I sensed a return of the good old 'British Spirit' this morning on the school run.

Hopefully yesterdays messages from the Prime Minister and Queen have regalvanised the country.

Think the media have their part to play now. I wont go as far as calling them.out and out scare stories, but maybe a bit more balanced reporting would not fo amiss right now.

 

They do. I don't understand why the media are shaming people for still going out to pubs, etc. This is the heard strategy the CMO was advising. I don't understand all these bitter comments about how these people are being selfish and that they need to think of the vulnerable. Those that are at higher risk should be isolating and are. The more people who get it over the next 10-12 weeks, the more likely those most at risk can leave their isolation in 3 months time. The media doesn't know these people's circumstances. It doesn't know if they are avoiding family and friends that are high risk. 

[Sith Happens]

7 minutes ago, smiths_tavrn said:

News from Italy.

More than 99% of Italy’s coronavirus fatalities were people who suffered from previous medical conditions. Average age of death 79.5. Median age 80.5. More than 75% had high blood pressure, about 35% had diabetes and a third suffered from heart disease. I think this maybe slowly beginning to unravel. Hopefully we can start getting to the truth.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-18/99-of-those-who-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says

I still struggle with what you are trying to say. Yes we all know those most at risk are either elderly or have underlying conditions.

So take my Dad for example. Hes 81, takes medication for high blood pressure but that helps control it. If he gets Covid 19 the official line will be he was 81 with an underlying condition....but so what? Its still not the underlying condition that kills him its the Virus.

It really seems appalling we should be shrugging our shoulders when its these at risk people dying just because well they gonna die one day from their condition so may as well be now.

[richinspain]

1 minute ago, smiths_tavrn said:

How can you possibly be sure it's the virus that killing people and not the underlying conditions? Even if it was the virus (unlikely) then by that logic any virus on the planet could be lethal.  Why single out Covid 19 for special treatment? Why not the common cold? Would you like people with colds to self isolate? If that's the case we're on lock down for ever, from cradle to death. Well there wouldn't be life for very long under that scenario because zilch would be produced. 

I don't think that the images of convoys of Italian military lorries transporting the dead to other towns because the funeral services can't cope are implying that this is just like any other virus.

[Ghost of Clough]

1 minute ago, smiths_tavrn said:

How can you possibly be sure it's the virus that killing people and not the underlying conditions? Even if it was the virus (unlikely) then by that logic any virus on the planet could be lethal.  Why single out Covid 19 for special treatment? Why not the common cold? Would you like people with colds to self isolate? If that's the case we're on lock down for ever, from cradle to death. Well there wouldn't be life for very long under that scenario because zilch would be produced. 

Which part of this do you not understand? The risk of death from Covid-19 is much higher than the common cold and it's also spread much more easily than more 'deadly' viruses. Fortunately, we have vaccines for most viruses

[Sith Happens]

6 minutes ago, smiths_tavrn said:

How can you possibly be sure it's the virus that killing people and not the underlying conditions? Even if it was the virus (unlikely) then by that logic any virus on the planet could be lethal.  Why single out Covid 19 for special treatment? Why not the common cold? Would you like people with colds to self isolate? If that's the case we're on lock down for ever, from cradle to death. Well there wouldn't be life for very long under that scenario because zilch would be produced. 

Without wanting to come across rude....i trust the experts...the Chris Whittys of this world rather than some fella off the DCFC Fans forum.

[Wolfie20]

4 minutes ago, smiths_tavrn said:

How can you possibly be sure it's the virus that killing people and not the underlying conditions? Even if it was the virus (unlikely) then by that logic any virus on the planet could be lethal.  Why single out Covid 19 for special treatment? Why not the common cold? Would you like people with colds to self isolate? If that's the case we're on lock down for ever, from cradle to death. Well there wouldn't be life for very long under that scenario because zilch would be produced. 

The 'common cold'  and flu viruses are 'human to human' strains so we have inbuilt levels of resistance to help fight viral attacks. However, Covid-19 is an 'animal to human' strain which means our immunity is not able to resist attack with the same effectiveness.

To me and I'm not a medical scientist, this is a logical explanation of the current situation - no one has to automatically accept it so feel free to continue to believe what you believe, which in my opinion is without any substance whatsoever.

[GboroRam]

35 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

They do. I don't understand why the media are shaming people for still going out to pubs, etc. This is the heard strategy the CMO was advising. I don't understand all these bitter comments about how these people are being selfish and that they need to think of the vulnerable. Those that are at higher risk should be isolating and are. The more people who get it over the next 10-12 weeks, the more likely those most at risk can leave their isolation in 3 months time. The media doesn't know these people's circumstances. It doesn't know if they are avoiding family and friends that are high risk. 

It seems that the government are caught between two strategies, as we are being told to distance ourselves socially. Yet there's talk of a herd immunity. Which is it? Are we distancing ourselves or not? 

With the official line being to promote social distancing, I'm not surprised at the shaming of people still going out. 

[Shipley Ram]

https://newsthump.com/2020/03/19/further-football-postponements-sees-desperate-sky-sports-secure-exclusive-rights-to-asda-cctv

[Coneheadjohn]

Busy but not as busy this morning,99.9% of people lovely,.01% unhappy because they can’t push people out of the way.

Got most things in,very depressing talking to all the NHS staff,absolutely shattered with no supplies.

[i-Ram]

20 minutes ago, smiths_tavrn said:

How can you possibly be sure it's the virus that killing people and not the underlying conditions? Even if it was the virus (unlikely) then by that logic any virus on the planet could be lethal.  Why single out Covid 19 for special treatment? Why not the common cold? Would you like people with colds to self isolate? If that's the case we're on lock down for ever, from cradle to death. Well there wouldn't be life for very long under that scenario because zilch would be produced. 

Your total insensitivity to other individuals concerns is beginning to hack me off.  Paul has genuine concerns regarding his father, and I also know he has his own health issues that put him in a higher risk category for this virus. Trying sharing your opinions in a less antagonistic way, or do me and others a favour and go and post elsewhere.

[DarkFruitsRam7]

Can you get banned for rank ignorance and stupidity?

[GboroRam]

10 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

Can you get banned for rank ignorance and stupidity?

I've been trying for years but never managed it.

[A Ram for All Seasons]

 

[Uptherams]

19 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

It seems that the government are caught between two strategies, as we are being told to distance ourselves socially. Yet there's talk of a herd immunity. Which is it? Are we distancing ourselves or not? 

With the official line being to promote social distancing, I'm not surprised at the shaming of people still going out. 

This is a huge social experiment and the government and CMO know this but people get outraged as if they are just a pawn when they are trying to manage the situation. They can't and don't expect people to adhere to strict rules...yet. People will ultimately make their own decisions and the CMO and government knows this. People are self isolating, people are distancing themselves from others and washing their hands more and others are largely carrying on as normally as they possibly can, making smaller changes. No single approach is right or wrong. It is dependant on your personal circumstances.

Broadly summarised as the flatten the curve approach, which is the strategy. They don't want an unprecedented amount of people becoming severely ill, which is why they are advising people to be cautious. If in a months time for example, the data shows this to not been effective enough, then they'll take stronger steps. 

Data from Italy is already showing how little risk there is to people under 40, who have no pre-existing illness/condition. The trouble for this group, for example, is preventing them from unnecessarily over running the health service, in the form of them not just staying at home and riding it out if they get ill. How many people, at the first sign of having breathing difficulties, are going to think they might die and need to be in ICU, when the reality is they are going to be completely fine. 

[GboroRam]

1 minute ago, Uptherams said:

This is a huge social experiment and the government and CMO know this but people get outraged as if they are just a pawn when they are trying to manage the situation. They can't and don't expect people to adhere to strict rules...yet. People will ultimately make their own decisions and the CMO and government knows this. People are self isolating, people are distancing themselves from others and washing their hands more and others are largely carrying on as normally as they possibly can, making smaller changes. No single approach is right or wrong. It is dependant on your personal circumstances.

Broadly summarised as the flatten the curve approach, which is the strategy. They don't want an unprecedented amount of people becoming severely ill, which is why they are advising people to be cautious. If in a months time for example, the data shows this to not been effective enough, then they'll take stronger steps. 

Data from Italy is already showing how little risk there is to people under 40, who have no pre-existing illness/condition. The trouble for this group, for example, is preventing them from unnecessarily over running the health service, in the form of them not just staying at home and riding it out if they get ill. How many people, at the first sign of having breathing difficulties, are going to think they might die and need to be in ICU, when the reality is they are going to be completely fine. 

I'm not disagreeing with any of that. But with the government offering guidance, why would you be surprised when people not following it get criticism? I suspect you are 100% right, but nobody is able to admit it. So while ever the official line is to stay away from the general public, there will be a lot of suspicion and criticism of those who refuse to follow it.

Why was the guidance not to isolate over age 70, or even over 40? It would have made this much more sensible. Was it down to a lack of available data at the time of the announcement? I don't get it.

[ramit]

41 minutes ago, Shipley Ram said:

https://newsthump.com/2020/03/19/further-football-postponements-sees-desperate-sky-sports-secure-exclusive-rights-to-asda-cctv

Toilet paper is the new hot commodity

Buttcoin

[Zurich Ram]

My decision to "social distance" was somewhat influenced on Monday evening in the pub, when , judging by how long it took the hot tap to run hot, and what I personally witnessed, every time I went for a slash (which, post-prostectomy, is pretty damn regular) I was the only male in there who was actually washing their hands. Jesus Christ, how many images of people gasping their last breaths in Italy do you need to;

a)  stop being a dirty bar steward and wash your ducking hands

b) give up the boozer for a week or 2, if it helps delay and suppress the peak infection rate  

Oh, and whilst I'm mid-rant, what's the point of limiting items to 3 of anything, if people are still going to be buying 2 more of anything that they would otherwise have bought?

[Mucker1884]

1 hour ago, Van Cone De Head said:

Busy but not as busy this morning, 99.9% of people lovely, .01% unhappy because they can’t push people out of the way.

 

 

Ahem... (Covers mouth, washes hands)...

 

 

... And what, pray, were the other 0.09% getting up to?  Not on their 'phones were they?  ... Booking night classes at maths school, perhaps? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Note to self... Get help... Pedantry out of control. 

[Bob The Badger]

1 hour ago, smiths_tavrn said:

News from Italy.

More than 99% of Italy’s coronavirus fatalities were people who suffered from previous medical conditions. Average age of death 79.5. Median age 80.5. More than 75% had high blood pressure, about 35% had diabetes and a third suffered from heart disease. I think this maybe slowly beginning to unravel. Hopefully we can start getting to the truth.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-18/99-of-those-who-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says

Dude get a grip.

You sound like you think it's okay because these people died because they had underlying medical conditions and/or they're older.

This is nothing like what happens with the flu.

Hospitals deal with the flu every year and they don't get overrun like this.

The truth it out there that a lot of people are dying and many of them very quickly.

The truth it out there that hospitals are running out of PPE.

The truth is out there that the mortality rate dwarfs the flu.

The truth it out there that rates are rising dramatically in every country outside China and South Korea.

The trust is out there that China have said they fear another wave and that's why they are arresting people who go jogging. They are under total lockdown in many areas.

If Boris did that in the UK, people would be in uproar.

Now you may have all the compassion of a scorpion with a raging hangover and not care that this is capable of obliterating an entire generation because after all, they had a good innings, but some of us do care.

It Feels Like a War Zone’: Doctors and Nurses Plead for Masks on Social Media

'A generation has died': Italian province struggles to bury its coronavirus dead

[Tamworthram]

Just now, smiths_tavrn said:

 

No one's being insensitive. Your accusation of insensitivity is just a smear to bully and shut down any other opinion than what's coming from the media hacks., which you and many others have bought into. The official reasoning and actions have to be 100% correct in your opinion.

Do the daily live press conferences and briefings taking place around the world count as media hacks? My primary concerns aren’t driven by what I may read in any of the “news” papers but from what I’m hearing directly from scientific and medical advisers, the WHO etc.