Matej Vydra - Signed for Burnley

[Mostyn6]

6 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Disagree, Vydra was invisible as the lone striker, he is a number 10....

stop getting sucked in by myths of football, and form an opinion based on what actually happens on a pitch.

You appear to be confusing the role of a "target man" in a hoofball side with a "lone striker".

A "target man" needs certain attributes.

A "lone striker" in itself can be different from a target man. Aguero for example can play as a lone striker but not as a target man. 

If you are saying Vydra cannot play the target man role effectively, I would agree, but please stop this nonsense about him not being able to play lone striker, if he was invisible, it's cos that role needs supporting team-mates and service, at ANY level, to be successful.

Does he have pace? YES, vision? YES, technique? YES, Skill? YES, attitude? YES, intelligence? YES, energy? YES. Bingo, he can play the role.

[Duracell]

Vydra’s oustanding attribute is his finishing. He’s good linking up with a centre-forward as well. In everything else, he’s okay.

Playing him on the wing in the system we have means he doesn’t have a great deal of use for his best attribute, some use for his second best attribute but far more use for the other attributes where he’s not a great deal better than simply ordinary.

However, it’s nonsense to suggest he’s of no use to us (though, to be fair, I’m not sure I’ve seen anybody claim that). I’m actually NOT convinced his best position is a number 10 as he gives the ball away quite cheaply, though a few were guilty of that under Rowett. 

I can see him having a place as a highly-attacking CM to replace Mount in a stretched game if MM is looking leggy. I can see him playing as one of a two up front if we went for a different formation. Possibly as a wide player,  but only if he was playing more as an “inside forward” with license to get into the box, and a full back on his side providing width. We’d be very exposed on that flank though.

Last season suited Vydra right down to the ground. In a team not particularly interested in keeping the ball and looking to break on the counter, all he needed to do was follow a break and finish. And there are very few better at that.

The system was set up for goals to come from him, and we won’t be set up that way anymore. It’s natural that he’ll score fewer this season and he’s far from a garaunteed starter. Made heaps of sense to try and sell while he’s the reigning Golden Boot winner and before it’s clear to other clubs he’s not as important to us anymore, a factor bidding clubs will use to drive the price down relative to this summer.

[Ambitious]

10 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

We have until the end of August to see if he moves with a view to a permanent transfer in our league and also the several European leagues shut after our window shuts on the 9th and probably some wierd leagues like China 

As soon as it means we’re unable to replace him, I don’t think we would entertain it without a massive bid. As Lampard mentioned, he’s a good player, he’s our player. 

[Rample]

I thought when we hit 200 pages he'd just leave, or is that not how it works?

[roboto]

Not bothered either way if he leaves or not right now. If he does go, it seems like Waghorn is the plan and I can’t say that I’m too bothered about him either.

If he stays then we can’t be sure he won’t work in Frank's system. A lot of people writing him off as a lone striker, but from what I’ve seen, the centre forward role so far looks very flexible and could see him roaming the pitch with two wide forwards cutting inside and/or switching positions.

Think of it as a low budget version of Messi, Neymar and Suarez. Without the world class skill, theatrical rolling over or biting opponents.

I think Vydra could work well in that sort of system and Marriott seems very similar to him but sacrificing some finishing skill for a bit more energy in his game. Bennett and Lawrence work well out wide cutting in and by the looks of things, so do Jozefzoon and Wilson.

[Comrade 86]

Not sure why folk keep insisting that Vyds can't play under Frank. Much is being made of our 4-3-3 formation but it seems to me we only stick to that when the opposition have the ball. Seems massively fluid when we're in possession which I think might actually suit Vyds. Equally, those who say Vyds can't or won't press might be surprised what a man will do if offered the chance of another season in the premiership. I think Matej would relish the chance to silence the naysayers so write him off at your peril, I'd say. For those desperate to see last season's Golden Boot winner playing for a competitor, be careful what you wish for. It might just turn around and hoof you square in the nads!

[StringerBell]

42 minutes ago, BurtonRam7 said:

Still struggling to comprehend how, after years of crying out for a 20 goal-a-season striker under Clough, we have the Championship’s top scorer nowhere near the first team entirely of our own accord. I think that’s one of many reasons why I call ******** when people suggest we haven’t moved forward since Clough left.

I don’t disagree with our decision to attempt to force Vydra’s sale, and I would probably take anything upward of £10 million (even if it does sting to see the price that others go for). However, if he doesn’t leave, surely it would be worth a try putting him in one of the wide forward positions as competition for Lawrence/Jozefzoon/Wilson/Bennett/etc?

I know he’s been poor whenever he’s played there since joining, but on those occasions he was simply thrown into an underperforming team whilst he himself was incredibly low on confidence. If he really worked hard to get back up to speed with the rest of the boys and put in the graft on the training pitch to learn how to play the position, I could see him being effective at drifting around, picking  the ball up in pockets and doing something special - just as he did on many occasions last season.

I think we as fans become too narrow-minded when we see a player have his best run of form in a specific position under a specific manager and a specific style of play. For example, just because Tom Lawrence looked handy behind the striker for a few games last season doesn’t mean he can’t be a key player for us out wide this term. By all means, his best moments for Ipswich came from the flanks. As another example, this time in terms of the importance of a player suiting a manager’s philosophy and the mood of the team, would you rather see Will Hughes out wide in an exciting, free-flowing Mac 1 team or in the middle of a turgid, hoofball Pearson team. Professional football is far from the linear nature of FIFA 18, and is a deeply complex sport in which the finest margins matter hugely.

I didn’t watch he Watford of a few years back too closely myself, but am I correct in saying that Vydra played in a wider role in that team, and scored a hatload in the process? I don’t think he should be defined by one season with a semi-successful side last year when his previous season was one of huge turmoil in which he played under 3 different managers and was thrown into a multitude of different roles, all whilst a certain thread on here stating that he should never wear the shirt again was supported by some.

He had already been written off by many prior to last season before proving people wrong. I would be wary of making the same mistake again.

Ironic as I think keeping Vydra as a supersub is pure FIFA 18. I appreciate you're saying play him, but most peoples observations point to other players we have playing out wide being better at Vydra at doing that.  So if we hold on to him I expect him to be on the bench.

Vydra is a better player than Weimann. Yet last season I was happy Weimann was playing instead of Vydra when we went 343. And that's despite Weimann being a peculiar wide player himself.

It's a big gamble holding on to a player we might be able to fetch a lot of money for on the basis he might be able to play a different position, despite looking like he can't actually play that position.

[Cam the Ram]

If we were planning to sign Waghorn after Vydra left then we're not miles away from the FFP limit by the looks of things. Hopefully we can bring in Evans, get some of the fringe players out (easier said than done) like Jerome, Butterfield, Anya, Martin, Blackman etc. and hold onto our key players, then it will have been a bloody brilliant window

Best of luck to Frank choosing the front 3 from Vydra, Marriott, Nugent, Thomas, Bennett, Wilson, FloJo and Lawrence. Nice problem to have though

[Kernow]

I actually think he'll still go, even if it isn't to Leeds. West Brom are close to selling a striker, Boro may be in the market. There are still going to be sides interested in him and teams will get more desperate for a player like him as the window draws to a close.

As others have mentioned, he can still go out on loan with an agreed fee right up until the end of August. He can also go abroad. We seem to be planning for life without him and signing players on the basis that he'll be going, so it might even be a case of having to lower our asking price to encourage more bids if we really do need to sell to fund our current dealings.

[SaffyRam]

Don’t know if anyone’s posted this from Twitter?

[t'oldu]

Will DCFC now stop playing hard ball and accept it's over??

[RamNut]

Vydra is a good player and could adapt.He played as central striker for Reading against us in the famous match at PP after which Mel entered the changing room.

i suspect we will try again to force a sale to whoever prior to 9/8. And thereafter try to organise a loan.

If not it makes it a bit interesting with Marriott.

 

 

[Carnero]

11 minutes ago, Cam the Ram said:

If we were planning to sign Waghorn after Vydra left then we're not miles away from the FFP limit by the looks of things. Hopefully we can bring in Evans, get some of the fringe players out (easier said than done) like Jerome, Butterfield, Anya, Martin, Blackman etc. and hold onto our key players, then it will have been a bloody brilliant window

Best of luck to Frank choosing the front 3 from Vydra, Marriott, Nugent, Thomas, Bennett, Wilson, FloJo and Lawrence. Nice problem to have though

I believe that @Carl Sagan, who's seems to have fairly decent contacts, said that Derby are quite relaxed over the Vydra situation and are under no pressure to sell - hence the not budging over the 11m fee - and that if he's sold the money can be spent on the team (Waghorn).

[Rab a dab doo]

Listening to Franks Sky interview if something is going to happen with zVyds  its will be in the next few days.

The Ipswich also commented on leaving Waghorn out of their team say they didn't want injured in case anything develops with a move.

Stand by for situation to be resolved soon.

[LB_DCFC]

19 minutes ago, Cam the Ram said:

Best of luck to Frank choosing the front 3 from Vydra, Marriott, Nugent, Thomas, Bennett, Wilson, FloJo and Lawrence. Nice problem to have though

The thing is, i can genuinely see Vydra being bottom of that list for Lampard, for the meantime anyway. If he hasn't trained with the 1st team properly this pre season, it's going to take time for him to get up to speed. Just look at Marriott, he's trained all pre season and played in friendlies and he wasn't even close enough to fitness for the bench. You could be 8 to 10 games into the season until vyds is deemed fit enough to play, especially if he's injured now, which has been the message from the club throughout pre season. Then you have players in form and players who have gotten used to the system and, in some ways, have had the system built to suit their strengths, so will Vyds immediately get back into the side? I doubt it (unless there's injuries). You've then gone from an £11m asset to someone who isn't in the side, and thats concerning. I appreciate vyds and what he's done for us, but I still see this summer as the best time to sell (however if he scores a hat full and fires us to the PL, I wouldn't be against that either!)

[EnigmaRam]

4th choice striker and 6th choice winger but yeah let’s keep him!! Let’s watch his value plummet.

[Sparkle]

16 minutes ago, Kernow said:

I actually think he'll still go, even if it isn't to Leeds. West Brom are close to selling a striker, Boro may be in the market. There are still going to be sides interested in him and teams will get more desperate for a player like him as the window draws to a close.

As others have mentioned, he can still go out on loan with an agreed fee right up until the end of August. He can also go abroad. We seem to be planning for life without him and signing players on the basis that he'll be going, so it might even be a case of having to lower our asking price to encourage more bids if we really do need to sell to fund our current dealings.

He may well still be sold and I do expect it to happen I only hope a premiership team pick him up at the last moment 

15 minutes ago, SaffyRam said:

Don’t know if anyone’s posted this from Twitter?

The fact that he keeps turning up at games when he is clearly not involved tends to indicate that he would very much like to stay 

[Jimbo Ram]

39 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

Invisible under other managers and different personnel alongside him but my point was with this set of players and the way we are playing he could be successful- we have obviously planned to use nugent short term and Bennett occasionally with Marriott expected to force his way in there. Talk of number 9 or number 10 stuff is a nonsense he is a goal scorer and give him the chances and he will put more away than anyone else we own 

It's not nonsense. When has Vydra scored a bagful of goals as a lone striker? At his best for Watford he had Deeney upfront with him, that is different than having midfielders supporting him. This isn't an anti Vydra stance, I like him but don't see how he would fit in to the system under Frank....

[RamLad1884]

We clearly didn't play with a 'target man' yesterday, or last Saturday for that matter. 

Our striker is expected to be in the right place to score and will be expected to chase the ball rather than wait for it to come to them (ala Martin under mac 1).

If Frank can train Vydra to play that style then he could very much be a decent striker for us again. 

[Sparkle]

3 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

It's not nonsense. When has Vydra scored a bagful of goals as a lone striker? At his best for Watford he had Deeney upfront with him, that is different than having midfielders supporting him. This isn't an anti Vydra stance, I like him but don't see how he would fit in to the system under Frank....

I think you my of missed my point about now and not the past