Derby County v Brentford F.C.

[BobbyD]

20 minutes ago, Mr Tibbs said:

There's plenty in this thread alone that are critical yet balanced. That's surely what we're on about, not another over the top thread from months ago? Did that thread not spark a decent debate despite it's ridiculous opening post? 

Surely stating that "all Sam Winnall did was win a penalty" isn't far from the truth? Constructive or not. Why fabricate it? Same with the Lawrence stuff. People are frustrated and calling him out for his mistakes which he is making over and over. He will come good I'm sure, but he's hardly getting death threats on here. 

You've got your own beliefs and opinions which you clearly state but why should people who have polar ones not be taken just as serious? Just because you disagree with them? We're second and doing a fine job but that doesn't make everybody untouchable, criticism free. There's loads of genuine posters who are picking bits here and there and putting decent thoughts forward, they're not being overly negative. Forget the odd over the top post, nobody takes them seriously. 

 

Fair enough, I guess a lot of it just depends on your general outlook and approach to life. I thought I had stated my case and provided various arguments in support of that. I don't see the reasoned arguments coming the other way I'm afraid.

The Sam Winnall comment provides a classic example  :

My view :

• thats "all" ?? He's a striker, his job is to get goals. Thats what he's done. How is it "all" ?
• He's had at least two other really good shots on goal
• He looked lively and always looked to be positive and create things
• He's held up their defence and made it difficult for them when they had the ball
• He did his fair share of defending corners and Brentford's attacks
• He has fully contributed to a good performance and result

The other view as I perceive it  :

• He's pretty well done nothing since he came on
• And winning a penalty is almost by the by

How is that  in any way conceivable as constructive or  fair or even justified by a coherent argument ?

Until people properly justify their opinions then how can they expect to be taken seriously ? Surely, isn't that what reasoned debate is all about ?

 

 

[Ramarena]

11 hours ago, Seaside Sam said:

none then

If you say so, it's pretty irrelevant.

[Sith Happens]

Suppose saying all winnall did was win a peno is like saying Carson did naff all apart from make a couple of top drawer saves.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Its always going to be hard for some people. Because Winnall doesnt really look to be or have proper standout quality,  unlike Martin sometimes, who's been sent jogging, he's going to be seen as abit of a downgrade to some folks. He may very well be much more effective in our system, but some will try to only compare the individual with the individual, rather than the team and the situation. I'm guilty of it abit, even on the subject of Martin and Winnall. was thinking to keep it all to myself though as he's scored a few and been pretty involved. won a penalty yesterday. with a really nice turn to get the ball out of his feet too. 

[Mistaram]

3 hours ago, Paul71 said:

No I will admit the level of negativity has dropped off somewhat of late, an unbeaten run will do that (although dont forget certain posters almost obsessive criticism of Chris Martin, but now he has gone too).

It was still absurd after a handful of games, likewise suggestions we didnt deserve to beat Hull, nevermind beat them 5-0. The criticism of Mel for offering a free season ticket  if we got promoted and so on.

The negative knee jerk posts will be back as soon as we lose a game (which we will).

Paul your right there " the negative knee jerk posts " They don't wait till we lose drawing a match will do for them just look at the Bristol and Millwall results You bet when we lose one the bottlers ones will be out in force 

[VulcanRam]

Just a word about Lawrence as I see from flicking through the thread he's attracting his fair share of debate,

What really impressed me was his running off the ball. He made some good runs behind but wasn't  found, and likewise found good space out wide without being passed to.

There doesn't seem to be much point playing him on the right as he has no left foot and he's not like Anya was, heading for the byline at every opportunity.

I thought yesterday was one of his better games, and showed signs of improvement. When he moved to the right he looked more dangerous. His corners were better.

He still looks a little nervous and rushed with the ball at his feet, especially with his crossing, but you sense it's coming. 

[Phoenix]

2 hours ago, Paul71 said:

Suppose saying all winnall did was win a peno is like saying Carson did naff all apart from make a couple of top drawer saves.

One big plus about Winall is that we got shut of Butterfield for the season.

[Van der MoodHoover]

13 minutes ago, VulcanRam said:

Just a word about Lawrence as I see from flicking through the thread he's attracting his fair share of debate,

What really impressed me was his running off the ball. He made some good runs behind but wasn't  found, and likewise found good space out wide without being passed to.

There doesn't seem to be much point playing him on the right as he has no left foot and he's not like Anya was, heading for the byline at every opportunity.

I thought yesterday was one of his better games, and showed signs of improvement. When he moved to the right he looked more dangerous. His corners were better.

He still looks a little nervous and rushed with the ball at his feet, especially with his crossing, but you sense it's coming. 

Not been this season yet - but going to reading. 

So I'm just asking - which of these comments is right?  

Looking forward to seeing lawrence btw 

[PistoldPete2]

6 hours ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

A lot of the opinions expressed on match day threads are attention-seeking attempts to look like clever analysis. It's football. It's never going to make anyone look clever. I am especially fond of the critical team selection posts but I also have a soft spot for the why-didn't-the-manager-do-such-and-such stuff after another convincing victory. There's very little that's 'constructive' in any of it, other than attempts to construct an image.

Carry on with the 'discussions' (read back and you'll see they are nothing of the sort) and I'll carry on with the sarcasm. You'll have to have me banned to stop that.

It's a forum... You are going to get opinions , many that you don't agree with. I don't think its about image or people trying to look clever. Yes some opinions are overly negative and so on but especially on match day people who have been to the game are entitled to a rant . It does seem odd when we've won 3-0 I agree though, but even the manager would look at that and see where where we can improve. 

[Mr Tibbs]

3 hours ago, BobbyD said:

Fair enough, I guess a lot of it just depends on your general outlook and approach to life. I thought I had stated my case and provided various arguments in support of that. I don't see the reasoned arguments coming the other way I'm afraid.

The Sam Winnall comment provides a classic example  :

My view :

• thats "all" ?? He's a striker, his job is to get goals. Thats what he's done. How is it "all" ?
• He's had at least two other really good shots on goal
• He looked lively and always looked to be positive and create things
• He's held up their defence and made it difficult for them when they had the ball
• He did his fair share of defending corners and Brentford's attacks
• He has fully contributed to a good performance and result

The other view as I perceive it  :

• He's pretty well done nothing since he came on
• And winning a penalty is almost by the by

How is that  in any way conceivable as constructive or  fair or even justified by a coherent argument ?

Until people properly justify their opinions then how can they expect to be taken seriously ? Surely, isn't that what reasoned debate is all about ?

 

 

 

Of course it is but not everyone is going to put their two penneth in such detail. Statements like that will be littered throughout the forum and I don't think that comment is that bad. In my opinion your description there has absolutely glorified his performance out of context but that's your thoughts and not mine, we all see it differently. I thought he was ok but didn't have the same effect as Jerome playing the lone striker. Nice turn for the penalty but other than that was there much to shout about? He was just ok, certainly not a poor performance but I don't think it was anything other than ordinary either. I didn't think the ball stuck as well, I thought we lost that bit of pace in behind, we lost our aerial threat and an in general drop in being an absolute nuisance to Brentford's back line which Jerome certainly was. Does that say more about Winnalls performance or Jerome's? Probably Jerome's. They're different players with different attributes. 

For what it's worth I find Winnall a bit of a weird one, he's come up with some really important goals to win us valuable points which I have no doubt he'll probably carry on doing so in the next 16 games. But would I start him if all our options are fit? Definitely not from what I've seen of the Vydz/Nuge partnership and what we've seen from CamJam so far. Still a very good thing to have a player like Winnall at our disposal though, he'll have his uses. 

[Owen87ITK]

On 04/02/2018 at 09:42, Waffle said:

One thing I found really strange yesterday is that you can see @OwenB87 and the rest of the Ramstv team in their studio but due to the lighting and projection on the wall, it looks surreal, like an animation.

I'm actually a cartoon character, hence the outfits. 

[VulcanRam]

13 hours ago, HantsRam said:

Not been this season yet - but going to reading. 

So I'm just asking - which of these comments is right?  

Looking forward to seeing lawrence btw 

Sorry Hants, thanks for pointing this out - when he moved to the left the second bit should have said! Had a good shot and laid in Winnall for the penalty.

[Van der MoodHoover]

Just now, VulcanRam said:

Sorry Hants, thanks for pointing this out - when he moved to the left the second bit should have said! Had a good shot and laid in Winnall for the penalty.

Cheers Vulcan - hope he comes good at the Madewjski for us. Almost a local game for us down here

[thederbyram]

On 03/02/2018 at 23:27, eddie said:

You will never forgive Wassall?

What an ass.

Oh Christ 

Surely you understood the sentiment...

[SKRam]

Finally trawled (a positive trawl) through the thread after my first game in waaay too long. First impression was, its been too bloody long. Missed the smell of a live game and atmos. We do have some big units out there! My seat was Toyota West Stand Lower and very happy I was with it too. Decent folk around me and I’ll try and get same seat next time. South stand bounce is terrific, my Middlesbro mate loves it. I’m a fan of this seasons kit compared to previous I’ve seen too (always white socks please... I know that’ll set a few off on the black v white debate)

Enough comments in this thread re game, will add though, as with any sending off it can alter the pattern of a game. Two quick goals settled us after that initial first twenty when they did have a decent chance, so not a worry if they were contemplating defending with all ten behind the ball. Efficient performance I thought and we have lots of players who can give us plenty more, so excited about that. Confidence as always a massive factor, that goal diff could be a huge point at the death and I can see that Villa game being ‘The Game’ of the season. Must be a candidate for tv which would mean a switch and not be popular with those going. Definitely do my best to get over again when shifts allow. 

A few scowls from Brum fans when passing at Sheffield station but nothing was said, tempting as it was to say thanks for Gary. Couple of pints pre game made it all in all a very rewarding experience . These are good days Rams, plenty to do still but let’s enjoy and saviour this game, which provides us with all these emotions. Oh You Wonderful Rams!! 

[angieram]

38 minutes ago, SKRam said:

Finally trawled (a positive trawl) through the thread after my first game in waaay too long. First impression was, its been too bloody long. Missed the smell of a live game and atmos. We do have some big units out there! My seat was Toyota West Stand Lower and very happy I was with it too. Decent folk around me and I’ll try and get same seat next time. South stand bounce is terrific, my Middlesbro mate loves it. I’m a fan of this seasons kit compared to previous I’ve seen too (always white socks please... I know that’ll set a few off on the black v white debate)

Enough comments in this thread re game, will add though, as with any sending off it can alter the pattern of a game. Two quick goals settled us after that initial first twenty when they did have a decent chance, so not a worry if they were contemplating defending with all ten behind the ball. Efficient performance I thought and we have lots of players who can give us plenty more, so excited about that. Confidence as always a massive factor, that goal diff could be a huge point at the death and I can see that Villa game being ‘The Game’ of the season. Must be a candidate for tv which would mean a switch and not be popular with those going. Definitely do my best to get over again when shifts allow. 

A few scowls from Brum fans when passing at Sheffield station but nothing was said, tempting as it was to say thanks for Gary. Couple of pints pre game made it all in all a very rewarding experience . These are good days Rams, plenty to do still but let’s enjoy and saviour this game, which provides us with all these emotions. Oh You Wonderful Rams!! 

Always good to hear a perspective from someone who doesn't get to many games because they usually remind us of everything others used to enjoy about going to live games but have now become so accustomed to that they take it for granted. 

We should all try to watch each game as if it is our first (or first for a while)!

[BobbyD]

17 minutes ago, angieram said:

Always good to hear a perspective from someone who doesn't get to many games because they usually remind us of everything others used to enjoy about going to live games but have now become so accustomed to that they take it for granted. 

We should all try to watch each game as if it is our first (or first for a while)!

Yes, quite.

Breath of fresh air once again

Doing this might remind some that the role of a supporter is to support (strange as it may seem). Not to sit in judgement, look for fault and to publicly air such faults  no matter what the big picture looks like. Which is not supportive at all. 

[SaintRam]

12 minutes ago, BobbyD said:

Yes, quite.

Breath of fresh air once again

Doing this might remind some that the role of a supporter is to support (strange as it may seem). Not to sit in judgement, look for fault and to publicly air such faults  no matter what the big picture looks like. Which is not supportive at all. 

Exactly.

Many a football fan took great exception at that one owner who described supporters as 'customers', despite a huge number of fans developing the customer mentality of complaints. Somewhat hypocritical. 

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

1 hour ago, BobbyD said:

Yes, quite.

Breath of fresh air once again

Doing this might remind some that the role of a supporter is to support (strange as it may seem). Not to sit in judgement, look for fault and to publicly air such faults  no matter what the big picture looks like. Which is not supportive at all. 

They all think they are pundits just waiting to critique. Its a kind of showing off really.