Vydra looking Menacing ... when will he start?

[RadioactiveWaste]

33 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

So lets see, you're all suggesting changing the way we play for one player? And that player isn't even Martin! ROFL.

No dafter than changing things just for Martin or to get BJ and GT playing as 2 holding midfielders.

Just like the idea that we could, not saying we should off the back of 8 games unbeaten.

Ultimately I think Needles is right, just the wrong player through no fault of his own. (Anya's injured but always been versatile, so he could cover the JR/Ince positions and might be useful still)

[Daz_The_Ram]

5 hours ago, HantsRam said:

That's exactly the sort of thing. I agree that I think you'd perm 2 from ince/bent/vydra in the front spots to allow some rotation. And there are still people who don't seem to fit anywhere such as blackman and baird but that's a minor point.

In terms of getting the most out of the current personnel might be worth a go.

Mac was assistant under TBE when we played a similar system so he's not completely unfamiliar with it. Or indeed wedded solely to 433.

Apart from the fact that Baird is having a stormer at right back just now, and has earned the right to keep the shirt regardless of whether Christie is fit or not. I agree with regard to Blackman though. Struggling to see him having a future here.

Why on earth is anyone talking about changing a winning side so drastically? Eight unbeaten, dug a top result out on Saturday. Leave it alone for goodness sake.

[rynny]

3 minutes ago, Daz_The_Ram said:

Apart from the fact that Baird is having a stormer at right back just now, and has earned the right to keep the shirt regardless of whether Christie is fit or not. I agree with regard to Blackman though. Struggling to see him having a future here.

Why on earth is anyone talking about changing a winning side so drastically? Eight unbeaten, dug a top result out on Saturday. Leave it alone for goodness sake.

I don't think people are saying we should be changing, just that if we needed to look at another option it is one that we could adopt. 

[RoyMac5]

38 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

No dafter than changing things just for Martin or to get BJ and GT playing as 2 holding midfielders.

Except in Martin's case we know what we might get. My point being lots of folk being against changing things just for \martin. Pearson's signings are fish out of water...

[Norman]

This thread reminds me of religion.

A small group of people have got an idea which they think is right, they then massage each other's egos, relatively unchallenged. Their idea becomes fact and a load of bullshit is born.

Anya and Vydra are deemed useless in this formation, when one hasn't been fit to play in it yet, and the other is learning the role. 

Seriously?

[Van der MoodHoover]

31 minutes ago, rynny said:

I don't think people are saying we should be changing, just that if we needed to look at another option it is one that we could adopt. 

Spot on mate - all hypothetical and I guess based on an assumption that mac cannot retrain all players into 433 roles and we can't buy the ideal players.

To @Norman - no,  this is not some religious crusade that all should be changed. But remembering the interminable criticism of  "no plan b" for when our 433 is snuffed out, no harm in considering possible alternative strategies. 

[Kennington Ram]

26 minutes ago, Norman said:

This thread reminds me of religion.

A small group of people have got an idea which they think is right, they then massage each other's egos, relatively unchallenged. Their idea becomes fact and a load of bullshit is born.

Anya and Vydra are deemed useless in this formation, when one hasn't been fit to play in it yet, and the other is learning the role. 

Seriously?

Spot on. We got Vydra near enough on transfer deadline day and he's now played under 3 Derby managers, each of whom set the team up differently.

Chris Martin took a little time to learn his role and how to play in the team when Clough initially loaned him... A summer later and he was among the best in the league.

[Daz_The_Ram]

1 hour ago, Norman said:

This thread reminds me of religion.

A small group of people have got an idea which they think is right, they then massage each other's egos, relatively unchallenged. Their idea becomes fact and a load of bullshit is born.

Anya and Vydra are deemed useless in this formation, when one hasn't been fit to play in it yet, and the other is learning the role. 

Seriously?

 

46 minutes ago, Kennington Ram said:

Spot on. We got Vydra near enough on transfer deadline day and he's now played under 3 Derby managers, each of whom set the team up differently.

Chris Martin took a little time to learn his role and how to play in the team when Clough initially loaned him... A summer later and he was among the best in the league.

You boys should know by now ... it isn't a squad game. Whoever isn't in the first eleven should be sold immediately. ;-)

[Leicester Ram]

I quite like Vydra and I'm fairly certain he'll play a part in us making the play-off's this season, he's bound to have some time in the starting XI and I think he'll do alright when he does.

But I'd swap him for Martin in an instant.

[Leicester Ram]

1 hour ago, Norman said:

This thread reminds me of religion.

A small group of people have got an idea which they think is right, they then massage each other's egos, relatively unchallenged. Their idea becomes fact and a load of bullshit is born.

Anya and Vydra are deemed useless in this formation, when one hasn't been fit to play in it yet, and the other is learning the role. 

Seriously?

You can equally apply that to the people who were super on board with Vydra when he came in, mainly because he's almost the complete opposite of Martin (It's Ninos, I'm talking about Ninos and his mates, in case no one figured it out), and decided Vydra will be successful at the club for years to come.

Now we're under a different manager and we're a different side that's doing well without Vydra. But some people are still convinced he's going to be the main man.

Sounds like they've got an idea which they think is right, have massaged each other's egos and made their idea fact?

Or MAYBE, you're just describing people having an opinion on a bloody Internet forum, which is all about opinions and discussion of opinions, but you've got a bee in your bonnet because it's not your opinion.

Maybe.

[rynny]

34 minutes ago, Leicester Ram said:

You can equally apply that to the people who were super on board with Vydra when he came in, mainly because he's almost the complete opposite of Martin (It's Ninos, I'm talking about Ninos and his mates, in case no one figured it out), and decided Vydra will be successful at the club for years to come.

Now we're under a different manager and we're a different side that's doing well without Vydra. But some people are still convinced he's going to be the main man.

Sounds like they've got an idea which they think is right, have massaged each other's egos and made their idea fact?

Or MAYBE, you're just describing people having an opinion on a bloody Internet forum, which is all about opinions and discussion of opinions, but you've got a bee in your bonnet because it's not your opinion.

Maybe.

I tell you something, I was delighted when we signed Vydra. I was hoping to see Martin and Vydra upfront, and could see a decent partnership between them. In the time from signing Vydra, then adding Anya I was starting to think that maybe lego block head knew what he was doing, just needed a combative centre mid (or even moving Bradley in there) and away we would go. That all crashed within minutes and before I could even finish the the sentence when it was announced that Martin was gone. They only saving grace on the deal is that is was a loan, that he couldn't play against us and that there is a chance (however small it is) that he could return and play for us again.

[Norman]

51 minutes ago, Leicester Ram said:

You can equally apply that to the people who were super on board with Vydra when he came in, mainly because he's almost the complete opposite of Martin (It's Ninos, I'm talking about Ninos and his mates, in case no one figured it out), and decided Vydra will be successful at the club for years to come.

Now we're under a different manager and we're a different side that's doing well without Vydra. But some people are still convinced he's going to be the main man.

Sounds like they've got an idea which they think is right, have massaged each other's egos and made their idea fact?

Or MAYBE, you're just describing people having an opinion on a bloody Internet forum, which is all about opinions and discussion of opinions, but you've got a bee in your bonnet because it's not your opinion.

Maybe.

Nah. I don't have an opinion. I'm not sure if he can play the role or not. I don't know what ******* role he is supposed to be playing.

Do you know why? Because he's hardly played. And when he has, it's away form home at an in-form team who are good at home. 

And then, we don't know what the tactics are, we don't know what McClaren wants from him. We seem to be less possession based. Is that because Vydra and Bent can't do the job he is asking them to, or is it a deliberate ploy to move through the thirds quicker, and get in behind teams on the counter? Is that because we need Martin back, or have we decided this may be the way to go?

I don't know. Because that last bit makes me sound like Gary Neville, but i've just made it up and never though about it before.

I didn't even go. I wanted to, but i couldn't. Under the thumb - so like Bris, i will wait until i've seen him play the role. Whatever that is.

[Anon]

21 minutes ago, Norman said:

I didn't even go. I wanted to, but i couldn't. Under the thumb - so like Bris, i will wait until i've seen him play the role. Whatever that is.

Against Fulham it looked like he was asked to do exactly what Bent has been doing. I fully accept that our possession stats were poor and he wasn't given much chance with the ball. What I can't accept is that his work rate in terms of pressuring defenders when not in possession was well below what we've seen from 32 year old Darren Bent in previous weeks. This is especially galling when you consider that Fulham like to play out from the back with defenders often carrying the ball over the half way line before passing. It makes for a very attractive and attacking style of play, but as Johnson proved at the end of the game, they are just asking to have their pockets picked.

[Anag Ram]

6 minutes ago, Anon said:

Against Fulham it looked like he was asked to do exactly what Bent has been doing. I fully accept that our possession stats were poor and he wasn't given much chance with the ball. What I can't accept is that his work rate in terms of pressuring defenders when not in possession was well below what we've seen from 32 year old Darren Bent in previous weeks. This is especially galling when you consider that Fulham like to play out from the back with defenders often carrying the ball over the half way line before passing. It makes for a very attractive and attacking style of play, but as Johnson proved at the end of the game, they are just asking to have their pockets picked.

I would agree.

Paul Dickov would have been all over them like a rash.

There were a couple of occasions when through balls didn't quite reach Vydra on Saturday and he looked exasperated.

However, half our games are going to be away from home and he will have to get used to working hard and surviving off relatively little service.

It's just a shame that under our current system we can't play him alongside Bent.

[Jimbo Ram]

As stated previously, Vydra does not fit the current system. Waste of time playing him in the role he played at Fulham.

[Ninos]

2 hours ago, Leicester Ram said:

You can equally apply that to the people who were super on board with Vydra when he came in, mainly because he's almost the complete opposite of Martin (It's Ninos, I'm talking about Ninos and his mates, in case no one figured it out), and decided Vydra will be successful at the club for years to come.

Now we're under a different manager and we're a different side that's doing well without Vydra. But some people are still convinced he's going to be the main man.

Sounds like they've got an idea which they think is right, have massaged each other's egos and made their idea fact?

Or MAYBE, you're just describing people having an opinion on a bloody Internet forum, which is all about opinions and discussion of opinions, but you've got a bee in your bonnet because it's not your opinion.

Maybe.

My mates ?

Whooooaaaa hold your horse. When was i keen on us paying 8+ m for Vydra ??? My point the entire time was that the squad needed whittling down. We are still a bit too big and it's hard on morale when you have veteran players on the bench all the time : they'll poison the morale. 

All I was saying is that he's a live wire perhaps time to give him a run out. Mac did but the poor bugger can't score. 

The main man will be someone we haven't even heard of yet ... that's what I'm convinced of . 

I did like your final paragraph - there was truth there 

[richinspain]

30 minutes ago, Ninos said:

My mates ?

Whooooaaaa hold your horse. When was i keen on us paying 8+ m for Vydra ??? My point the entire time was that the squad needed whittling down. We are still a bit too big and it's hard on morale when you have veteran players on the bench all the time : they'll poison the morale. 

All I was saying is that he's a live wire perhaps time to give him a run out. Mac did but the poor bugger can't score. 

The main man will be someone we haven't even heard of yet ... that's what I'm convinced of . 

I did like your final paragraph - there was truth there 

Sometimes I agree with what you have to say and sometimes I disagree, but that is total BS. Any self respecting Derby fan knows that it's "ode yer 'oses". Please try better in the future ?

[Ninos]

1 hour ago, richinspain said:

Sometimes I agree with what you have to say and sometimes I disagree, but that is total BS. Any self respecting Derby fan knows that it's "ode yer 'oses". Please try better in the future ?

Wat dat