robglosta Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Proven quality. Yes yes yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robglosta Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Spot on.Christie and Forsyth looked brilliant with Ward and Russell playing in front of them. Both attacking players tracked back tirelessly to help out. When Ibe first came in the full back on his side suddenly looked really out of sorts - the dodgy defending just happened to be whichever side Ibe was playing at the time - because he offered no support to the full back. However, during his last five games, Ibe had been coached to attend to his defencive duties as well. It is no coincidence that Ibe's last month was our best form of the season. Ibe gets replaced by Ince and Russell and Ward lose form and fitness and our full backs look like the worst players in the world. It is no coincidence. Ince is more effective than either Russell or Ward in attack, but far less so in defence. This puts more onus on the full backs to stay back and defend, and changes the whole dynamic of the side. We lose all width and the defencive frailties of Forsyth and Christie are exaggerated, whilst their attacking prowess is firmly blunted. I'm not saying don't sign Ince, but we need to be aware that he doesn't actually fit the 433 system very well as we usually play it. Not anything to do with Eustace then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CornwallRam Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Not anything to do with Eustace then? Eustace stays central, which does at least allow the centre halves to offer a little cover to the full backs, but that is not as key to the performance of the full backs as cover from the wide attackers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craic dispenser Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Lol please no. sort of player we need Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rammieib Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Some people are obsessed with signing players who have played for Derby at some point in the past. I bet if you asked them to name 20 Championship players they couldn't because they don't know who else actually exists.Ince would be a cracking signing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tombo Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 I think we need to go for a more solid back 4 next season. Sacrifice the attacking abilities and strengthen in the areas we clearly lacked this season as we just need to be harder to beat.Rubbish. We need to play with much more abandon. And yes I'm being serious. Too much focus on defense is where we've gone wrong this season. Need to get back to attacking teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Rubbish. We need to play with much more abandon. And yes I'm being serious. Too much focus on defense is where we've gone wrong this season. Need to get back to attacking teams.Scoring goals wasn't our problem this season, it was conceding them. All the points we dropped (especially against teams in the lower third) was because we conceded stupid goals. Successful teams do not concede and I'm sure if you check all the top two teams in every top league in the world my point will be proven! And to clarify I meant sacrifice the attacking abilities of our defenders not the whole team. Let them focus on keeping the ball out of our own net!And to further my point go and check out La Liga. Barcelona and Real are separated by two points. Both scored the same but Barcelona are top with a better GD of 13. May as well class that as 3 points better off and in a much better position to win the league.So clearly one of the most attacking sides in the world still values a solid defence! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Scoring goals wasn't our problem this season, it was conceding them. All the points we dropped (especially against teams in the lower third) was because we conceded stupid goals. Successful teams do not concede and I'm sure if you check all the top two teams in every top league in the world my point will be proven! And to clarify I meant sacrifice the attacking abilities of our defenders not the whole team. Let them focus on keeping the ball out of our own net!Scoring goals wasn't our problem this season, it was conceding them. All the points we dropped (especially against teams in the lower third) was because we conceded stupid goals. Successful teams do not concede and I'm sure if you check all the top two teams in every top league in the world my point will be proven! And to clarify I meant sacrifice the attacking abilities of our defenders not the whole team. Let them focus on keeping the ball out of our own net! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Scoring goals wasn't our problem this season, it was conceding them. All the points we dropped (especially against teams in the lower third) was because we conceded stupid goals. Successful teams do not concede and I'm sure if you check all the top two teams in every top league in the world my point will be proven! And to clarify I meant sacrifice the attacking abilities of our defenders not the whole team. Let them focus on keeping the ball out of our own net!And to further my point go and check out La Liga. Barcelona and Real are separated by two points. Both scored the same but Barcelona are top with a better GD of 13. May as well class that as 3 points better off and in a much better position to win the league.So clearly one of the most attacking sides in the world still values a solid defence! In La Liga teams on equal points are separated on head-to-heads rather than goal difference.The problem is that any new defenders need to be both excellent defensively and on the ball. That would cost millions, which we probably couldn't afford. If we don't have ball-playing centre-halves then we end up giving the ball away a lot more. Our better defenders end up having to do a lot more deafening whilst our forwards have a lot less of the ball. Think back to the Brentford game, granted that everyone was ****, but a huge factor in our inability to gain control was Forsyth's shocking distribution. He gave it away more times than he kept it.This defence is awful when put under pressure, but barring Hughes, Dawkins, Thorne and Martin all being injured simultaneously, it's highly unlikely that that will happen more than twice a season in this division because we'll have control. Was it not Brian Clough that said "If we have possession, they can't score"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 In La Liga teams on equal points are separated on head-to-heads rather than goal difference.The problem is that any new defenders need to be both excellent defensively and on the ball. That would cost millions, which we probably couldn't afford. If we don't have ball-playing centre-halves then we end up giving the ball away a lot more. Our better defenders end up having to do a lot more deafening whilst our forwards have a lot less of the ball. Think back to the Brentford game, granted that everyone was ****, but a huge factor in our inability to gain control was Forsyth's shocking distribution. He gave it away more times than he kept it.This defence is awful when put under pressure, but barring Hughes, Dawkins, Thorne and Martin all being injured simultaneously, it's highly unlikely that that will happen more than twice a season in this division because we'll have control. Was it not Brian Clough that said "If we have possession, they can't score"?Yes possession is a must. However I think the priority of our full backs needs addressing. Two seasons ago we had a better balance because we had wisdom on the right, his strengths were first in defending and then attack followed. This season we haven't had that balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Scoring goals wasn't our problem this season, it was conceding them. All the points we dropped (especially against teams in the lower third) was because we conceded stupid goals. Successful teams do not concede and I'm sure if you check all the top two teams in every top league in the world my point will be proven! This is slightly off the money... Watford conceded more this season than say... Sheff Weds... yet Watford finished 2nd and Sheff Weds finished 13th...Brentford both scored less and conceded more than we did... yet they finished 3 places above us...It's about results... Not scoring AND conceding away at Fulham and Brighton... 2 stupid late goals at home to Birmingham... Then almost everything that happened from then onwards for the rest of the season..."concede less goals" is far to simplistic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 This is slightly off the money... Watford conceded more this season than say... Sheff Weds... yet Watford finished 2nd and Sheff Weds finished 13th...Brentford both scored less and conceded more than we did... yet they finished 3 places above us...It's about results... Not scoring AND conceding away at Fulham and Brighton... 2 stupid late goals at home to Birmingham... Then almost everything that happened from then onwards for the rest of the season..."concede less goals" is far to simplistic...When Steve first came in his plan to get the team winning again was to not touch the attack (as we were scoring freeley) but tighten up at the back. That worked! However the second half of this season we went back to conceding far too many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3072884/Derby-County-ready-offer-deals-winger-Tom-Ince-striker-Darren-Bent-successful-loan-spells.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490£3m for Ince - Bargain for me, that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3072884/Derby-County-ready-offer-deals-winger-Tom-Ince-striker-Darren-Bent-successful-loan-spells.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490 £3m for Ince - Bargain for me, that. the fact that they think he was here for the season detracts from the credibility of the story for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete2 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 How could we afford £3 million without even play off money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam the Ram Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 @PistoldPete2 FFP is a lot more lenient next season I think, so clubs can spent more than this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete2 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Ok so we can spend some candy crush money then? Whatever money we spend I hope our biggest signings don't get injured for the whole season before a ball is kicked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiddingsRam Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Hardly fair that ! That was pure bad luck and a risk you sometimes need to take ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 http://the72.co.uk/26765/leeds-united-transfer-target-ince-written-in-the-stars/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Ram Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 that will never happen mosty, can't see it, well not in the next couple of years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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