TomTom92

52 minutes ago, oodledoodle said:

I think Clowes's main focus was to try and alter the perception of us as a club. Football aside, to the average fan we looked pretty rotten. We'd had "cheating" Mel, financial scandals, Rooney's hotel, the drink driving, etc etc etc. Getting Warne in, someone who seems like a genuinely lovely bloke, is all part of a much bigger effort to give us a totally new culture at the club. I understand it, and I fully agree with what he's doing. NSPCC, the colours thing, investing in the women, and getting in Warne who really is an embodiment of all of those values. I also assume that the 4 year contract for Warne is an attempt to shed the impression we're a full on merry-go-round club.

The only thing that seems to be going wrong at the moment is on the pitch. It's not quite terminal decline just yet. I'm sure the club are getting the message loud and clear that a growing section of the crowd are getting restless as our footballing direction. Let's hope Warne is brave enough, and savvy enough to do something about it. That's really all everyone wants, isn't it?

Very good point and i can only speak for myself, but i don't care about any of the nice things as long as we win on a saturday.

I know the two aren't exclusive, but ultimately i'd have the devil himself as manager if he got us 3 points on a saturday. 

I like PW as a person and i'm desperate for it to work, but other peoples fears about him being tactically poor etc. seem to be correct. I think maybe Derby is too big for him. I remember him making a passing comment about fans spotting Waggy in a pre season photo and he compared us to MI5. Richie Barker also told a story where he was surprised to see a young boy wearing a Derby shirt in the Yorkshire area, before he realised that Derby are followed throughout the country. 

We're not going to be patient especially in League 1, where there's an unjust feeling that we should be there in the first place. PW seems to be Nigel mk2 except Nige's recruitment was better and he had the luxury of being in the championship to keep us satisfied.

On 10/09/2023 at 09:07, David said:

Not this again.

The PGMOL are responsible for referees and match selections.

Which makes this F the EFL chant after every poor decision daft.

The PGMOL is a separate company that is jointly owned by the PL, FA and EFL so your accusations are incriminating both the PL and FA.

Now if what you are saying is correct, do you honestly think they would have rescinded Wildsmith's red card?

If you watch enough games from top to bottom, you will see poor decisions are made all over, there is no hidden agenda to punish Derby.

We are where we are because we're failing to put the ball in the net more times than the opposition. 

Yes poor decisions don't help, yet we're responsible for our own downfalls on the pitch, it's a game of 90 minutes where we have ample opportunities to minimise the impact of poor decisions.

Plus you have to play the odds. 

We felt aggrieved during the admin season because of bad decisions, but we spent a lot of time, especially away from home in our own half. 

We spent most of the Bolton match in our own half, so if a bad decision is due and at this level it is, we're bound to be punished when its near our goal. 

2 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

The football under Lampard was dire when Mason Mount was injured. We won only once in about ten weeks (11 games or so).

We have had purple patches under all managers since.

We broke a 40-year club record under Phillip Cocu of scoring at least once in over 20 consecutive league games. Not even Jim Smith or Steve McClaren manager that.

We had a great spell under Wayne Rooney when Bielik was injury free and completely dominating the opposition. 

I don’t recall creating as many chances as we did during Rosenior’s spell in charge, regularly having over 60% possession and 20+ attempts on goal.

And to be fair to Warne, I think he boasts the longest unbeaten run of any Derby manager since Jim Smith. But then again, it largely coincided with playing all the bottom teams and hammering the likes of Forest Green Rovers, Accrington Stanley and Morecambe.

Long story short, we’ve had purple patches under all managers and Lampard has gone on to show he is a bog standard manager who wouldn’t have had us anywhere near the top six without £100m worth of talent on loan.

This wasn’t me saying I think Lampard is a good manager and I agree about the Mount comment. However, we’d go 2-0 down and I’d still have faith we’d win. 
 
Cocu and Rosenior football wasn’t for me. My blood pressure must’ve quadrupled watching us try and walk the ball in every match only to draw/lose. 
 
Rooney’s football was meh. But our squad was less than ideal so I let him off for that.

Warne has overseen some big wins and maybe it’s an arrogance problem, but I fully expect us to pump the likes of Morecambe etc. So he doesn’t get much praise from me on that front. 
 
What would be entertaining with Warne using his brand of football would be wins. I don’t care if we have 1 shot a match if we win im all for it. But as others have pointed out, play ugly football and lose and fans patience won’t be as generous.

Last manager to play entertaining football was Lampard. 
 
But to entertain you need solid principles, good coaching and the players to pull it off. Think currently we have 1/3.

5 hours ago, Curtains said:

So if he is the wrong man how much would sacking him and his staff cost. 
 

So in summation it’s an irrelevance 

Why’s how much he costs matter? 

Someone broke down the signings and on paper our squad is better than last seasons. We’ve lost 3 very good teams at this level so if we’re not top 6 surely the blame lies with the manager? 
 
If you don’t think our squad is better then what have recruitment been doing these past few months. 
 
To conclude I don’t think people’s expectations are too high. Whether it’s too early for some of the moaning? Maybe…But it’s a fine balance between giving PW a fair crack of the whip and not wanting to waste a season with the wrong man.

Depends ultimately which formation Warne is going to hammer his flag to. 
 
If we’re playing 352 then we’re now in need of a central defender and right wingback. Although when Ward and Wilson are fit we have enough class in that position. 
 
Personally think the injuries have pushed us to play 4 at the back. In which case a right back may be priority. Ward apparently isn’t very good there, Wilson is an injury doubt and Smith won’t offer anything going forward. But 4 at the back means we have enough depth in central defence. 
 
Intrigued to see what formation and personal he uses in central midfield now as well. With a full squad 433 seems the way forward but doesn’t seem to be on PW list of go to formations.

Now we can’t shift Collins any chance of us bringing in a striker is dead until January.

1 hour ago, sage said:

I'm amused by posters saying "6 games is too early' as if Warne was appointed in the summer.

Obviously this season is more 'his team" but he did have most of last season.

Still no sign of a pattern of play.

He's got the next 5 games fir me.

 

 

Hull are 6th.

 

 

Hull have also spent considerably this season, were lucky to beat Leicester if you're an xG nerd. Plus out of interest 2 matches in some of the fans were starting to turn on Rosie for his style. Fair play he's turned it around since but not sure it does anybody any good comparing managers.

For all we know we could get rid of PW and he could get another L1 team promoted at our expense.

Think the next run (6) of matches will show us were we are under PW. In hindsight our opening fixtures were tough although all our defeats have come against promotion rivals. A criticism of PW last season. 
 
Not sure what to say if we win 3 and lose 3 of the next 6. Personally think top 6 is about our limit this season. My love for PW has waned but it does feel like he needs to be given every opportunity before a tough decision may need to be made.

Rosenior leaving also ended another link to the Mel era. Rightly or wrongly Rosenior’s flaws such as the away games etc. could be held against his time here as 1st team coach under Cocu and Rooney, neither of which were a success. Maybe not fair to link others shortcomings against his, but PW coming in was a clean slate.
 
Warne was a great appointment at the time. Now it’s looking like a mistake, but every appointment is a risk. If PW was to go then I wouldn’t like to say who a good appointment would be. 

6 hours ago, Ambitious said:

I don't think people should be revisionists in the hiring of Paul Warne -- he had everything that was used as a stick to beat Rosenior with. He had experience as a manager, at this level, he played football with an emphasis on getting the ball forward quickly. No one can hammer Clowes for hiring a manager with three promotions in three attempts at this level, all while utilising a budget less than roughly half of our own. He knew the division really well and I think we all thought that he would iron out the nativity in the team shown under Rosenior. He did, for a period, which shows me that a mixture of the two of them garnered the best results. A possession based football team, not afraid to overload wide areas and get the ball forward quickly between November, December & January. 

All that being said, we focused on what he brought to the table that Rosenior couldn't, but ignored what Rosenior brought to the table that he couldn't IMO. One thing that I've learned that I previously overlooked is that we really need someone who understands the demands of this football, Warne has often tried to apply a mentality and mindset that isn't aligned with the supporters - the game today highlights that in that he tried to go to Bolton and play counter-attacking football. I'd understand if we played a Premier League side, but never did I expect to see a Derby County team set up in that manner in the third tier of English football. It leaves a bitter taste in the mouth. It's only the fourth season at this level in the club's history. 

I have no love for Warne at the moment, I just feel his football philosophy (although I can understand some of the logic behind it) doesn't align with what I want. Results aside, I feel a lot of people feel the same way. Wins offer some respite, but every loss is focused on the same things. It just feels like this is leading to an inevitable conclusion already, not because i don't feel like we won't make top 6, but because people don't like his strategy. It's eerily similar to both Nigel Pearson and Gary Rowett. Rowett got results, but wasn't liked - every loss raised the same questions. I would include Clement too. 

Next time I would make it a priority to find a manager who has had some form of success at a big club as a player or coach/manager. 

I’d argue Rowett was treated poorly by fans and then Mel in the end. However, if you search his name on twitter Milwall fans want him gone despite his solid efforts there. His style of play just doesn’t seem enough to get him a promotion. Plus as you rightly point out, every defeat gets magnified because of the style of football. 
 
If we would swap Warne for Evatt today would Derby fans say yes? I’d say the majority would.

Don’t think we can keep fluctuating between Warne in/out every time we win/lose we just look silly. 
 
Id also argue that we’ve had a tough start to the season, only burton and Fleetwood have been easy games. 
 
That said, I am struggling to see what Warne brings to the table. Poor tactically, questionable in recruitment, not a player development specialist and seemingly not a good enough man manager to churn out 3 points each week. 
 
Think he’s safe as long as we don’t completely fall off the cliff. The big question for DC will be next season if we’re still in league 1. Does he risk having PW prepare for another season? 
 
What I’d give for us to find our new Stevie Mac or our very own Steve Cooper. 

Surprised this was a free transfer in the end.  

Good signing for Barnsley. 

14 minutes ago, DerbyAleMan said:

What about Waggy, think he is a top forward myself at this level, again time will tell, but 5 goals already is not a bad start. 

Still have my reservations although 5 goals would suggest otherwise. 
 
We may go up top 2 but we’re not as strong as Plymouth or Ipswich in my opinion and that rightly or wrongly is my barometer.

His move to Bristol Rovers fell through. 
 
Interesting dynamic now. Does he sign a new contract at posh? Or do they have to accept an even lower bid in Jan? Or do they keep him and hope he can fire them to the championship? Kinda the same predicament we have with Cash. Bet DMac is gutted.

7 hours ago, Barney1991 said:

What I want to know is why was it to late  when Percy reported it around 22:00 a deal sheet could have gone in. Clubs agree deals after 22:00 

Got to think some of the deals on deadline day had been going on all day and was still 50/50 to be completed. 
 
Not sure if we accepted a bid at around 08:00/09:00 that everyone had enough time to do their bit.

Before the final 3 signings I wasn’t confident of a top 6 finish. I’d say that squad is now top 6 worthy. 
 
Top 2? Maybe, but we’re a top striker short for my liking.

Just now, inter politics said:

Exactly. We know what we have in Cashin.

True, think fans opinion including my own would be different if we had him under a decent contract. 

Just now, S8TY said:

Its really quite sad to see how much we have fallen........Forest signing players like Odoi and players from PSV whilst we are excited about the possible signing of a 30 year old league 1 striker ffs.....we should never be in this position!!🤬

Thanks Mel Morris !!!

Yes sickener that all our main rivals have enjoyed prem years and the finances that come with it. 
 
Just us and Wednesday out of the big teams that are in the mud.

1 minute ago, inter politics said:

I don't get why so many fans want us to sell our best centre half and one of our best players when we're trying to get promoted. This isn't football manager. The new centre halves haven't pulled up any trees yet so how would selling Cashin definitely help us?

All if, buts and maybes but if DC allowed PW to reinvest we maybe could’ve signed a top striker and a decent replacement for Cash.

2 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

How have they bullied us?

Not met our asking price and consequently we have not sold him.

Fail to see where the bullying is?

Get your point. 
 
Think their point is more ‘Brighton have hundreds of millions and have dragged it out until it’s too late for us to have a good deal. Now Cash will go most likely for £1m/£2m in Jan where the market is difficult to replace’.

Brighton need burning at the stake. Why leave it so late? 

4 minutes ago, Elwood P Dowd said:

There’s also the same claim from Ipswich 😂

Panic over they’ve read TFR’s latest tweet which we all know is garbage.

A Norwich update account on twitter says we’ve accepted £4m bid. Good money if true but leaves us scratching for a replacement. 

Johnson’s a no go apparently, due to cost. So I presume Weds aren’t in the mood to be charitable and the poor lad will be twiddling his thumbs until Jan (or until the manager gets chopped).