Jump to content


  • Content Count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

Reputation Activity

  1. Like
    Carnero reacted to LazloW in WHY   
    Everything is easy in hindsight. I’m sure every decision that has been made has been made with the best of intentions and the best interests of the club. It would be hard to conclude that many of those decisions have not turned out to be the best, but it’s easy to be wise after the event.
    A lot of things that have gone wrong are also ‘sporting’ issues, which I refuse to blame the owner for. Backing your manager isn’t a crime. Bringing in managers with decent CVs and footballing pedigree isn’t a crime. There are plenty of examples of teams who underperform out there and it is rarely the owner’s fault. That’s the nature of football I’m afraid. Sometimes other teams are better than you. It happens.
    I think a lot of negative things have happened all at once which has led to a lot of conflating of issues and 2+2 is equaling 5 in a lot of cases. But I’m not angry (I’m not even faux angry) - more than anything I’m just sad that it’s turned out this way and sad for Mel as well. 
  2. Like
    Carnero reacted to DarkFruitsRam7 in El DerbyCo   
    Yes, but we’ve still managed to make one play off final and two play off semis since Mel took over.
    Football is a game of incredibly fine margins. If Bryson had got on the end of that cross against Hull, we might have gone up in Mel’s first season. If Roos had caught the ball at Wembley, we might have gone up slightly later than planned.
    As it happens, those things didn’t happen, and we’re left in 21st place and worried about our club’s future.
    Mel has made some terrible mistakes, and his last act might well be to sell us to someone who destroys the club. His tenure has undoubtedly been a failure.
    But if one or two tiny things had happened differently, he’d have been a club legend.
    Such is football eh?
  3. Like
    Carnero reacted to Rev in El DerbyCo   
    I almost think a complete reset would be good.
    Start again from the bottom, with a fan owned membership in control, and we spend what we earn and not a penny more.
    A club constitution that prevents any one party taking over, and if that means that our natural level is lower than now, so be it.
    It would be our Derby, not the plaything of chancers and spivs. 
    If we could grow organically and one day return to previous heights, great, but if not there's nothing wrong with lower league football, it's Derby I pay to watch, not the opposition.
    I'm a dreamer though.
  4. Like
    Carnero reacted to jono in EFL appeal   
    This isn’t law making or law giving. It’s politics pure and simple. Lobbyists, polarised mindsets, unspoken agendas from numerous sources of power and influence. I’d almost feel sorry for the lawyers but they are making a pile of dough from the fall out from every party so maybe not ! 
    FFP is all about stoping an unfair advantage .. ummmm well DFC started in the championship, are still in the championship and the majority of parachute clubs continue their existence in the yo-yo world that is the lower half of the prem along with the odd enforced break down with the rest of us lads in the championship. Except perhaps Middlesbrough who seem to have spent an awful lot of money with limited results. 

    this is tiresome in the extreme and is killing my love of this game.
  5. Haha
    Carnero reacted to roboto in Limerick Day   
    There once was a man who used Bing
    To search for just about anything
    But it’s 2021
    And he’s the only one
    That doesn’t know Google’s a thing.
  6. Clap
    Carnero got a reaction from Ghost of Clough in El DerbyCo   
    I assume the media reports are talking about the MSD loans that one of the holding companies took out so that the football club had enough cash to be able to operate during the pandemic.
  7. Like
    Carnero got a reaction from angieram in El DerbyCo   
    I assume the media reports are talking about the MSD loans that one of the holding companies took out so that the football club had enough cash to be able to operate during the pandemic.
  8. Like
    Carnero got a reaction from RadioactiveWaste in El DerbyCo   
    I assume the media reports are talking about the MSD loans that one of the holding companies took out so that the football club had enough cash to be able to operate during the pandemic.
  9. Like
    Carnero reacted to Ghost of Clough in EFL appeal   
    You're wrong. If the numbers do come out as us failing 18/19, 19/20 , etc then I would expect new charges against us. However, my estimates suggest we'll be fine, and backed up by the 'noises' coming from the club.
    16/17 is the period I'd be more concerned about (estimated £6m over the limit). But, with the EFL starting with 17/18, I can't see them going even further back.
  10. Cheers
    Carnero reacted to Ghost of Clough in What will our punishment be?   
    I didn't think about that to be honest. It does seem like a reasonable assumption.
    FYI, I think* KM got his figures from total potential fee - essentially he's put Thorne down as £3.5m whereas I put him down as £2.4m. (£2.4m initial fee backed up by the decision documents if you read between the lines). His £20m would also include promotion bonuses.
    * I haven't gone through the accounts with a fine-tooth comb to be certain that's what he's done, but it seems plausible.
  11. Like
    Carnero got a reaction from Carl Sagan in What will our punishment be?   
    No punishment.
    Each side to pay their own legal costs.
  12. Like
    Carnero reacted to Ghost of Clough in What will our punishment be?   
    Any deduction is dependant on the outcome of recalculating the amortisation in the accounts.
    Any deduction would have to be in the 21/22 season.
    Any deduction can be reduced due to mitigating factors.
    Any deduction will not be increased due to extenuating circumstances.
    My estimate suggests we don't fail P&S in 17/18.
    KM's estimate of £30m amortisation vs £21m for mine, suggests failing P&S by about £7.2m.
    Based on KM's figure (worst case), we would be due a 6 point deduction.
    Given the precedent set in the SW case of halving the penalty, it becomes 3 points instead.
    Given the EFL's incompetence, that's reduced to 2 points.
    Given the accountants on the DC panel thought we were compliant, reduced further to 1 point
    Given we did not deliberately exceed the limits, rather we did everything we could to stay within them, 0 points deducted
  13. Like
    Carnero got a reaction from Ghost of Clough in What will our punishment be?   
    I'm pretty sure DCFC said that too, I think it was when we expressed our disappointment at the EFL appealing the original decision @Philmycock
  14. Cheers
    Carnero reacted to RandomAccessMemory in What will our punishment be?   
    This tweet references this being said on Radio Derby
  15. Like
    Carnero reacted to LE_Ram in EFL appeal   
    Yep, and even if you discard the merits of each party's argument/interpretation, it's a bit pathetic that it's come to this really.
    Derby could potentially be punished based on the fact that we interpreted a standard one way, and the witness the EFL found interpreted it another.
    How does any of this help English Football? Why does the EFL find it necessary to appeal against the initial decision? Quite simply the EFL isn't fit for purpose. 
  16. Clap
    Carnero got a reaction from Curtains in What will our punishment be?   
    I'm pretty sure DCFC said that too, I think it was when we expressed our disappointment at the EFL appealing the original decision @Philmycock
  17. Like
    Carnero reacted to RandomAccessMemory in EFL appeal   
    Just spotted this tweet from Alan Nixon, it appears he has a copy of the decision report. I wonder how he has that as they've not released it yet?
    So, it appears it was the second particular, and that ONLY which the EFL won on appeal.
    I don't understand how it can be impermissible to take into account the possible resale value of players when it clearly states in FRS 102, as mentioned in the original decision, that future economic benefits from the intangible asset include use OR disposal?
    From the original report
    So if it wasn't an unreliable pattern for the years under scrutiny, why do we have to use the straight-line method?
    If we don't have to use the straight-line method, given the expected consumption of future economic benefits includes disposal, it shouldn't be impermissible to take into account the resale value, and it being the 'cost model' should make no difference.
  18. Like
    Carnero reacted to SamUltraRam in EFL appeal   
    In the midst of all the effort the EFL have used to investigate us, what have they actually done that's useful to protect the 72 member clubs during the pandemic ?
    I am astonished that we've reached the end of the season with none of the members going bust & that's no thanks to the EFL
  19. Like
    Carnero reacted to RandomAccessMemory in EFL appeal   
    What about the auditors regulator?
    That quote is from the original decision.
    I find it astonishing that the club, its auditors, their regulators and the original IDC (which included an actual accountant - imagine that!) can be under the impression it's all fine and dandy, totally in line with FRS 102. But a new panel, none of which are accountants, can apparently say it's not, and their decision is final...
    Unbelievable, absolutely unbelievable.
  20. Like
    Carnero got a reaction from ramit in Which player did you initially not rate but then grew to love?   
    Yep CKR & Bucko.
    Oh, and Theo Robinson.
  21. Like
    Carnero reacted to Jimbo Ram in What will our punishment be?   
    The guy that has been involved in 6 of our last 9 goals, but with all of our creativity and attacking threat who needs him 🤔
  22. Like
    Carnero reacted to BramcoteRam84 in EFL appeal   
    This is an exercise in the EFL saving face, self justification, and placating bitter football clubs looking to do one over on each other. It is not about protecting football clubs from Portsmouth scenarios or the integrity of the competition. 
    The EFL is quite happy to overlook Watford and Forest’s unique methods of circumventing FFP (switch/loan players between clubs for fee values to help their compliance with rules), not penalise the overspending of the likes Villa Bournemouth Leicester QPR Wolves, and overlook the dodgy practices of Steve Gibson and the use of his haulage company to help circumvent rules. 
    They are choosing to follow this grotesque charade and to ruin the integrity of competition with league positions being decided by arbitration panels instead of addressing the fundamental issue, that parachute payments are creating a grossly unfair competition, creating spiralling wages and resulting in clubs needing to spend beyond their means just to compete. Much has been made of Derby’s spending, yet it’s been dwarfed by the clubs that have come down by the premier league, highlighted by the spending and wages disparity between Derby and both clubs they have lost playoff finals to. The irony of all of this is the main club fighting this - Boro - are doing it because we beat them to the playoffs. Did we have an advantage over them? No. They had a bigger budget than we did due to parachute payments!! They blew it on Assombalonga and others and failed. 
    How are clubs without parachute payments supposed to compete. Eventually the majority of those that do try and compete will eventually come into problems unless they have luck ie. they somehow get promoted. These clubs don’t want to spend over the odds on wages, they are forced to by the parachute funded clubs that set the market rate, like Boro giving Assombalonga £50k per week.
    If they try to apply FFP for the past two seasons (average of 19/20 and 20/21) as has been suggested, half the clubs will fail it, they must do, they’ve had massive revenue cuts so how can they comply? Only the clubs who are parachute funded could possibly comply.
    We will probably be punished to make a point and then FFP will be scrapped because half the league failing it will be ridiculous. It’s not working, it’s not making clubs more sustainable. How about fixing the distribution of money in the game and introducing salary caps either on players or in line with turnover if player salary caps is too difficult,  it would be far more effective and help level things up.
    But regardless of the rights and wrongs of the EFL and Derby. I’m tired. I’m tired of reading about ERVs and FRS102, I’m tired Mel’s war with the other football clubs, I’m tired of all these jokers trying to take over our football club. When can it be just about Football again?! 

  23. Like
    Carnero reacted to Steve Buckley’s Dog in El DerbyCo   
    I understand your sentiment but please don’t forget the fans. We ARE the football club. I remember Clough on ITV, speaking in front of fans protesting against Maxwell, saying that we would be here long after Maxwell was gone. He was right.
    Maxwell, Morris, Keogh, Glenn Skivington...we have and will see them all off and will be left standing. We are Derby. We are here because we care and all the mud and poo being thrown at us from all sides can slide off as far as I am concerned because, as much as I dislike it at the moment, I am bonded to and love this football club. So Gibson, EFL, bitter Leeds fans and the twitterati can all sod off. 
  24. Like
    Carnero reacted to LE_Ram in EFL appeal   
    Yep so assuming Derby chose to amortise the players contract over the length of their contract, they would have nil residual value at the end of their contract.
    For example, take a scenario where Derby sign a player for £4m on a 4 year contract.
    The EFL argue that the only economic benefit a club gets from the player is them playing matches, and at the end of their contract they can leave for £nil - so you would amortise in line with that economic benefit - the player is expected to play over their contract so you would amortise their registration fee over the 4 years on a straight line - £1m per year gets expensed and increases your loss/decreases the profit. If they leave on a free at the end of their contract, you’ve already amortised down to £nil so there’s no impact to your profit - the carrying amount is £nil and your proceeds on the sale are £nil so there’s no profit or loss.
    In that situation, if a player leaves at the end of year 3 for £3m, they’d have had 3 years of amortisation so be carried in the accounts at £1m, and you’d recognise a profit on the sale of the player of £2m.
    Derby however say that they get more than just the benefit of the player playing matches, in that they also expect them to be sold before contract expiry. So your economic benefits are the player playing matches and the cash you get in from selling them. This is where ERV comes in - expected recoverable value - this is the amount Derby expects to be able to sell a given player for. Some players won’t be given an ERV if Derby don’t expect to sell them - for example, if our player above was 34 and expected to retire after playing at Derby, the treatment would be the same - £1m charged every year and no value at the end.
    However, if it was someone like, say Joz, well DCFC would argue that if he plays well they’ll sell him on - so they decide when and for how much do we think we’ll sell. For example, if they think they’ll sell the player for £3m in three years, they will only charge £333k per year amortisation because you’d expect that by the time they’re sold for £3m, they’re carried in your accounts for £3m.
    In both situations, the net P&L impact is the same over the whole contract - it’s just using Derby’s method the profits you make on a transfer are smaller, because your player is valued higher in your accounts, because you’ve charged less total amortisation.
    It’ll be interesting to read why the EFL have won this appeal, because as far as I’m aware, both are compliant with the accounting standard.
  25. Haha
    Carnero got a reaction from Andicis in Keogh Sacked   
    Well we have no cash and our only assets worth £2.4m+ are Bielik, Joswiak, Lawrence and the youngsters. What exactly are bailiffs going supposed do, stick Joswiak in their van and sell him at auction?
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.