Remembering Peter Taylor: 2 July 1928 – 4 October 1990

[Ellafella]

A Derby County Immortal. A brilliant man who will never be forgotten. A brilliant eye coupled with a huge football brain and the driest of humour.

Up there with Clough. 

[GangwayD]

Sadly I'm only old enough to remember his time as manager, when he fell out with Clough over signing John Robertson, and the fact it was one of Brian's biggest regrets they never made up before Peter passed away.

I could be wrong, but when he was in charge of us, he said the immortal words of 'top six by Christmas', only to find ourselves struggling badly, and he was eventually sacked. 

As a partnership with Clough and an eye for a talented Footballer, you could easily say - none better of his generation. 

Great to see we honour both of them outside PP,

Cheers

Gangway D from the terrace

 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, GangwayD said:

Sadly I'm only old enough to remember his time as manager, when he fell out with Clough over signing John Robertson, and the fact it was one of Brian's biggest regrets they never made up before Peter passed away.

I could be wrong, but when he was in charge of us, he said the immortal words of 'top six by Christmas', only to find ourselves struggling badly, and he was eventually sacked. 

As a partnership with Clough and an eye for a talented Footballer, you could easily say - none better of his generation. 

Great to see we honour both of them outside PP,

Cheers

Gangway D from the terrace

 

One of the difficulties that Peter Taylor had was that believe it or not, he was a naturally shy and quite private person who didn't enjoy publicity. Clough socialised with a lot of people in Derby but Taylor shied away from that and stuck just with his own close circle of friends and family. He enjoyed Clough handling the publicity side of their partnership while he got on with with what he was good at; spotting the players and with the team, being  the good cop to Clough's bad cop. He would be the one who put an arm around a player after Clough had laid into him and then put what Clough had said into context. It was well rehearsed between the pair but the approach was amazingly successful. They had a famous argument in Turin when we played Juventus before the first leg of the European Cup semi-final in 1973. Clough was playing cards with the players when Taylor reminded him he should be on his way to do the pre-match press conference. Clough was dismissive and told Taylor to go and do it instead. Taylor blew his top because Clough knew he was uncomfortable with handling the press. The players, on the eve of the game were shocked by the fallout. Clough hastily went to do it but Taylor was livid.

When Taylor stayed at Brighton on his own as Clough went to Leeds, he was low-profile in the media. When he narrowly failed to take Brighton up, he'd had enough because he wasn't enjoying the manager's role and he reunited with Clough at Forest. Of course, they picked up on the amazing success they'd enjoyed together at Derby. Clough and Taylor together were spectacular but much less successful when they were apart.

When Derby approached Taylor to come out of retirement, he was up for it. But the first thing he did was arrange to meet Clough on Victoria Embankment by the Trent in Nottingham. He told Clough of the offer and asked him to come with him. Clough turned him down. The conversation was supposed to be in confidence but Taylor was furious when he read an article that Clough wrote for payment in the next day's Daily Express; he felt Clough had betrayed him but still came to Derby, bringing Roy McFarland with him as his player-assistant manager. But at Derby, he had to do all of the things that Clough had usually handled as well as what he was good at. He put himself under a lot of pressure and that caused him to make some irrational decisions. At first he was successful in pulling us away from relegation and beating Clough's Forest in the FA Cup. But the next season it went downhill and through the pressure he was under, he made a lot of irrational decisions and he left the club after a 5-1 defeat at Barnsley with relegation staring us in the face. The picture of him going down the tunnel at Oakwell shows you the face of a broken man and that is a sad memory of his final steps in football. He didn't deserve that for all he gave us.

I don't think the Robertson signing was the catalyst of their fall-out; but it was personally convenient for Clough to claim that. The seeds of the fall-out were Clough revealing the conversation to the Daily Express, which Taylor saw as a betrayal. Their division was aggravated by our cup win over Forest, which delighted Taylor and infuriated Clough. That all happened months before Robertson signed for Derby.

Taylor offered Clough the olive branch several times before he died and even went to the City Ground to try to make up, only to be shown the door with Clough refusing to even talk to him. But as you say Clough regretted it all when Peter died but it was too late.

Our statue of the pair at Pride Park was a delight for both families. The Taylor family was disappointed that In Nottingham there is the Clough Stand and the Clough Statue at the bottom of King Street but no memorial to Taylor. Our statue in contrast recognises the contribution the pair of them together made to our club. Both families liked that.

I personally like it too because our statue looks in the direction of the Baseball Ground with their backs to the City Ground 🐏.

 

 

Edited October 4, 2023 by Brailsford Ram

[Curtains]

He was a good goalkeeper as was Eric Steele. 

Peter Taylor was Cancerian star sign just like me  .

———-///////////———/——-//////

He was sold on to Middlesbrough for £3,500 in 1955, and kept goal for the Second Division club for four full seasons after being promoted to the first team in the 1956–57 campaign. He lost his first team place in 1960, and in June 1961 joined Port Vale for a £750 fee.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Taylor_(footballer,_born_1928)

 

Edited October 4, 2023 by Curtains
Added

[GangwayD]

12 minutes ago, Brailsford Ram said:

One of the difficulties that Peter Taylor had was that believe it or not, he was a naturally shy and quite private person who didn't enjoy publicity. Clough socialised with a lot of people in Derby but Taylor shied away from that and stuck just with his own close circle of friends and family. He enjoyed Clough handling the publicity side of their partnership while he got on with with what he was good at; spotting the players and with the team, being  the good cop to Clough's bad cop. He would be the one who put an arm around a player after Clough had laid into him and then put what Clough had said into context. It was well rehearsed between the pair but the approach was amazingly successful. They had a famous argument in Turin when we played Juventus before the first leg of the European Cup semi-final in 1973. Clough was playing cards with the players when Taylor reminded him he should be on his way to do the pre-match press conference. Clough was dismissive and told Taylor to go and do it instead. Taylor blew his top because Clough knew he was uncomfortable with handling the press. The players, on the eve of the game were shocked by the fallout. Clough hastily went to do it but Taylor was livid.

When Taylor stayed at Brighton on his own as Clough went to Leeds, he was low-profile in the media. When he narrowly failed to take Brighton up, he'd had enough because he wasn't enjoying the manager's role and he reunited with Clough at Forest. Of course, they picked up on the amazing success they'd enjoyed together at Derby. Clough and Taylor together were spectacular but much less successful when they were apart.

When Derby approached Taylor to come out of retirement, he was up for it. But the first thing he did was arrange to meet Clough on Victoria Embankment by the Trent in Nottingham. He told Clough of the offer and asked him to come with him. Clough turned him down. The conversation was supposed to be in confidence but Taylor was furious when he read an article that Clough wrote for payment in the next day's Daily Express; he felt Clough had betrayed him but still came to Derby, bringing Roy McFarland with him as his player-assistant manager. But at Derby, he had to do all of the things that Clough had usually handled as well as what he was good at. He put himself under a lot of pressure and that caused him to make some irrational decisions. At first he was successful in pulling us away from relegation and beating Clough's Forest in the FA Cup. But the next season it went downhill and through the pressure he was under, he made a lot of irrational decisions and he left the club after a 5-1 defeat at Barnsley with relegation staring us in the face. The picture of him going down the tunnel at Oakwell shows you the face of a broken man and that is a sad memory of his final steps in football. He didn't deserve that for all he gave us.

I don't think the Robertson signing was the catalyst of their fall-out; but it was personally convenient for Clough to claim that. The seeds of the fall-out were Clough revealing the conversation to the Daily Express, which Taylor saw as a betrayal. Their division was aggravated by our cup win over Forest, which delighted Taylor and infuriated Clough. That all happened months before Robertson signed for Derby.

Taylor offered Clough the olive branch several times before he died and even went to the City Ground to try to make up, only to be shown the door with Clough refusing to even talk to him. But as you say Clough regretted it all when Peter died but it was too late.

Our statue of the pair at Pride Park was a delight for both families. The Taylor family was disappointed that In Nottingham there is the Clough Stand and the Clough Statue at the bottom of King Street but no memorial to Taylor. Our statue in contrast recognises the contribution the pair of them together made to our club. Both families liked that.

I personally like it too because our statue looks in the direction of the Baseball Ground with their backs to the City Ground 🐏.

 

 

Thanks for that BR - An interesting read with some incidents I never knew.

It has always shocked me that F****st seem to have completely overlooked the part Peter Taylor played in their success, but typical of them I guess. 

It's why I am so pleased with our tribute to the pair.  Clough always said the best thing he won was the League Title with Derby.  I think Barbara, his wife, still has the medal which she often wears.  

I never realised our statue was placed so they looked in the direction of the BBG with their backs to the City Ground.  Purposely or by coincidence, who cares - I like it, and will adopt and share this tale.

Cheers

Gangway D from the terrace.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Curtains said:

He was a good goalkeeper as was Eric Steele. 
 

The young Reg Matthews took his place at Coventry and Harry Storer allowed Taylor to move to Middlesbrough where he met the young Brian Clough who was in Boro's reserves. Taylor recognised Clough's qualities and believed he should have already been in the first team. He recommended him to Harry Storer who was now Derby's manager. Storer wanted him and Clough wanted to come here. Boro wanted £3k but the Derby board said that was too much to pay! As we know Clough was soon on his way to 250 goals in less games than any other player has done it before or since.

Harry Storer's principles were the foundation for Clough and Taylor's views on management. He lived on Middleton Avenue in Littleover and the pair often visited him. Clough and Taylor's first goalkeeper at Derby was Reg Matthews who Storer had signed from Chelsea. Quite a few coincidences there and a glaring missed opportunity for Derby County.

[Mucker1884]

30 minutes ago, Brailsford Ram said:

... our statue looks in the direction of the Baseball Ground with their backs to the City Ground 🐏.

So obvious... now you mention it!

Not something I knew or realised... but I like it.

I too may well share that with anyone who is daft enough to listen to me!  
Cheers!

🍻🐏👍

[Curtains]

 

[SamUltraRam]

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, GangwayD said:

Thanks for that BR - An interesting read with some incidents I never knew.

It has always shocked me that F****st seem to have completely overlooked the part Peter Taylor played in their success, but typical of them I guess. 

It's why I am so pleased with our tribute to the pair.  Clough always said the best thing he won was the League Title with Derby.  I think Barbara, his wife, still has the medal which she often wears.  

I never realised our statue was placed so they looked in the direction of the BBG with their backs to the City Ground.  Purposely or by coincidence, who cares - I like it, and will adopt and share this tale.

Cheers

Gangway D from the terrace.

In June 2004, three months before he died, I spent two hours with Brian Clough in a bistro in West Bridgford. I had played cricket with him in Derby in the early 70s. He was with his grandson, Stephen, who is Simon's son and he was 16 at the time. Stephen is a Derby fan and all he wanted to hear from me was what it was like in Derby when his grandad was the manager. We talked Derby all the time. Cloughie said it was the worst decision of his life to leave and if they had stayed, no one would have heard much of Liverpool in the 70s because Derby would have been Champions of Europe eight times. He even apologised to Stephen for winning the European Cup with Forest.

I said that my favourite season was winning the Second Division in 1968-69 because it was the first time I had seen us win a trophy. Cloughie said that was also his favourite because it was the first time he won anything in football.

He and Barbara are now buried together in St. Oswald’s churchyard in Duffield.

The statue was purposely placed with them looking towards the Baseball Ground and I think it’s just coincidental that they have their backs to the City Ground but it’s still fitting.

[Tyler Durden]

I drive through the village on the way home from work every day where Taylor lived most of his life and where he's buried.

[Red Ram]

Fantastic stuff @Brailsford Ram!

[Guest]

38 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

I drive through the village on the way home from work every day where Taylor lived most of his life and where he's buried.

Peter Taylor only lived in Widmerpool from when he joined Clough at Forest in 1976. He was born and brought up in the Meadows area of Nottingham and signed for Forest. From there he moved to Coventry, Middlesbrough and Stoke when he finished his playing career with Port Vale before becoming manager of Burton Albion in 1964. Then he bought a bungalow on Doles Lane, Findern which he retained when he joined Clough at Harlepools where he was provided with a club house. When they joined Derby in 1967, he moved back into his home in Findern and remained there until he moved to Brighton. When he joined Clough in 1976 at Forest, he bought his bungalow in Widmerpool and remained there until he died, while also spending a lot of his time at his apartment in Cala Bona, Majorca. He died in Majorca in 1990. His body was brought back to the UK and he was buried in St. Peters churchyard, Widmerpool.

[Guest]

For those interested in the Clough & Taylor era at Derby, @LeedsCityRam's 1971-72 Season Scrapbook on this forum provides a comprehensive match-by-match coverage of their greatest achievement, with comments and contributions from members who were lucky enough to have witnessed it:

 

[OUTSIDER]

been good read this thread with video's,  

[loweman2]

Here are Peter’s official Derby County club tie and blazer and his FA England tie and blazer.

entrusted to safe keeping by Peter daughter Wendy !

Rip.

[Mucker1884]

Not wishing to appear rude, insensitive, or even ungrateful, @loweman2, but any chance you can re-do those ties?

From what evidence I can find,(Your own pics, Google images, videos etc) it appears both Brian and Peter... and myself, for that matter... much prefer the clean lines and symmetry of a Windsor knot.

(The C&T statue get a thumbs up on the score, btw).  👍

 

I'd like to think Peter would approve... and I'm as certain as hell that the mannequins would!  

 

🍻🐏

 

[PendineRam]

Having been watching the Rams since the late 50's (kid's corner) I have been through all the highs and lows. I was fortunate enough to be at most of the 2nd Division promotion season games and, whilst the two Championship Seasons were brilliant (obviously), that season still holds a special memory. The euphoria was unparalleled and we just knew it was only the start and that there was more, much more to come. It still seems like yesterday. 

Great reading Brailsford Ram. 

[richinspain]

1 hour ago, PendineRam said:

Having been watching the Rams since the late 50's (kid's corner) I have been through all the highs and lows. I was fortunate enough to be at most of the 2nd Division promotion season games and, whilst the two Championship Seasons were brilliant (obviously), that season still holds a special memory. The euphoria was unparalleled and we just knew it was only the start and that there was more, much more to come. It still seems like yesterday. 

Great reading Brailsford Ram. 

I was a bit too young to remember the 2nd division season having been born in 63 (although I do remember games from around that time), but games from the Championship seasons I do remember quite well. There were a lot of similarities in the Cox era, where I think that we may well have gone on to repeat the success if Captain Bob hadn't lost interest but wouldn't sell quickly enough.