Career advice

[Leeds Ram]

14 hours ago, therealhantsram said:

Someone mentioned GCHQ already, thats a possible for sure.

Look at the Foreign Office. 

Have a look at global charities. Is there a cause you are passionate about? Doesn't need to be one of the traditional British Charities either. I know someone who works for a Lebanese charity in the UK for instance.

The United Nations. They have locations all across the globe. Once you are in it's a great way to travel and see the world. A friend of my wife's works for the UN in Kenya and they have a wonderful lifestyle.

Academia - don't know how feasible this is, but maybe an academia job is a possibility, but in a different country could the pay be better?

If all else fails, take some time out to travel with your GF. I know it feels like you don't have time and you need to sort something out, but really 29 is no age. If you take a year to figure it all out on a working holiday it will be worth it. And you'll probably never have a better opportunity to do it either.

 

Thanks for the advice I really appreciate it ? I'll definitely keep this in mind especially the foreign office (I have looked at some openings there) and charities. The UN I have looked at and the difficulty seems to be getting a foot in the door but i shall definitely keep looking. In other countries generally so such as in Germany, Sweden etc. But I am less keen about moving out of the country for family reasons really. 

[Leeds Ram]

6 hours ago, Tyler Durden said:

Why do you think that you got turned down for two jobs because of your PhD? Unless you withheld that qualification from your CV then the interviewer would have known about it upfront so if it was that much of a deal breaker then they wouldn't have wasted their time interviewing someone whom they were never going to progress.

I've thought I've done well in interviews before and not gotten the job - did you ask the interviewer for feedback in either cases afterwards? Just bear in mind that regardless of how well you think you did there are sometimes better placed candidates whom you are competing against that also may have interviewed well.

Bear in mind as well if the interviewer isn't asking any really probing questions it can be just as much as a red flag as when they are asking quite uncomfortable ones - basically they've already decided at that point that they're not going to progress you and just going through the motions. 

If it was me I'd get a job - not just any random job ideally but a job as it's always easier to find another job when you're in one. It will also go some way to dispel potentially preconceived ideas some employer's may have about you being able to hold down a job given your length of time in Higher Education. Would also give you some thinking time too to decide what you do want to do ultimately. 

I wouldn't worry too much about changing fields at 29; if you were 49 then would have more of a factor but you've effectively got the majority of your working career infront of you. I've known people to take pay cuts in the knowledge that the new field they will be working in will have far greater earning potential in the long run than the one they're currently in. Try to consider the bigger picture.

It felt like every question went well except my answer to that one. It may just be a gut feeling and I'm wrong about that though. I did ask for feedback but did not receive any. Thanks for your advice ? I am thinking if i don't find something ideal in a couple of months I'll broaden my search. I don't like doing nothing as it doesn't suit my temperament very well. Also like you say it would give me some time to what I'd like to do and prove that I can enter the workforce and stay there. Thanks for your advice I really appreciate it ?

[Crewton]

41 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

Thanks for the advice david is much appreciated ? You are right the PhD doesn't grant me some of those things. I'm hoping my experience of teaching not just for the uni but outside organisations can help with convincing ppl i am reliable, punctual, and can get along well with others in a work environment. But yes, if i had not done any work and merely focused on the thesis this would obviously be a barrier especially given the solitary nature of PhD study. 

I do remember Joe. I believe he now works in an enrollment office at the Uni of Derby as we sometimes chat on twitter, if that is the same joe i am thinking of at least. 

I'll definitely look at career advice ? I do think university can be helpful, whether it was a wise choice made doing a PhD i guess time will tell. I made the decision to do my PhD right after my dad and grandad passed away, I basically finished my MA dissertation quickly post funeral and whacked in proposals within 2 months of that so it was perhaps a rushed decision to say the least.  It's been a tough 4 years (even if some aspects I have loved) and there is a large part of me that thinks i should have gotten onto the employment ladder as soon as i left my MA. My gf studies architecture at Edinburgh so she's very well placed for a good career at least so perhaps where a course specifically directs you into a field of work it is perhaps at its strongest for direction. Subjects such as politics or history leave you twisting in the wind somewhat post graduation. 

 

 

See, you're already a natural diplomat ?

[Boycie]

The ticket office were wanting people, anything to get you out into the routine of work will look good on a cv.

[Tamworthram]

1 hour ago, Leeds Ram said:

It felt like every question went well except my answer to that one. It may just be a gut feeling and I'm wrong about that though. I did ask for feedback but did not receive any. Thanks for your advice ? I am thinking if i don't find something ideal in a couple of months I'll broaden my search. I don't like doing nothing as it doesn't suit my temperament very well. Also like you say it would give me some time to what I'd like to do and prove that I can enter the workforce and stay there. Thanks for your advice I really appreciate it ?

No need to answer on this forum but consider what did they asked you and how did you answer it? They already knew you had a PhD so I imagine they were digging a bit deeper into why you chose to do the PhD and perhaps what relevance there is, if any, to the job you were applying for. If there isn’t any relevance then maybe they asked you why you have now decided to change direction. Not an easy question to answer.

[TimRam]

Check out local companies who have an industry you're interested in. Explain your situation and ask if you could be an 'observer' for a day to get a feel for the work that goes on there. It helps if you have a friend/family member who works there. My Dad worked for a local company and got me such a day in their I.T. department. You can get chatting to others and network. I found it invaluable and it set me on my career path.

[FindernRam]

Keep at it! I would advise against a scattergun approach though.

There are all sorts of techniques available to help you think through what you are good/bad at. What your personality profile says about you. Leader/follower, risk taker or not etc. 

When I mentored young graduates (decades ago) I started with a simple chart. Where do you want to be in 10 years. Where do you NOT want to be in 10 years. Keep it general, then what do you enjoy/not enjoy. Does this match what you are good at.  Then go through random  vacancies (easier now than when you had to buy the Daily Telegraph) and do a gut feel yes/no. Eventually a pattern will emerge. 

Then go for something like that!  Good luck!

PS , a bit left field but with your knowledge of Middle East politics have you thought of the Army in a Staff type role. 

[Van der MoodHoover]

Asset management. 

Someone like Blackrock love academically gifted folk. Doesn't have to be quants either. 

[Normanton Lad]

“I just want to say one word to you : plastics.”

Just joking. That was a good film and it astonished me to think that I since that film came out I’ve had a long working life and I’ve been retired nearly 20 years. You are living in a totally different world to the one I worked in. When I started firms would almost be begging for you to work for them. Anyone from my school who wanted an apprenticeship could easily get one. Those boys usually ended up as self-employed plumbers, electricians, gas engineers, etc. The ones who got office jobs often ended up as some kind of manager and they retired at 50 on a nice pension. Now job loyalty and security are long gone. It is every man for himself.

Not long ago I decided to spy on some of the young people I used to work with. These were people around your age. The more successful of them had reinvented themselves as “Project Managers”. Before they had been junior managers or IT workers but they got the Prince 2 qualification and a bit of experience running small projects and then they all seemed to find work as consultant project managers in big organisations like local government and the NHS. I could see from the Linkedin site that they usually moved on to another contract after a couple of years. I don’t know if this is normal practice or whether they didn’t want to stay long enough to be "found out".

That’s one option for you. Just say that you’ve been doing project management in education for about 10 years. I’m sure you could dress up whatever you’ve been doing as various projects.

[EtoileSportiveDeDerby]

Replied to you privately. Dont apologise for staying in academia, you can be very proud of what you have achieved so far, not everyone can do a Phd, well done.

 

[uttoxram75]

My brother never left school, or so we tease him, after Manchester Uni he took a job at Staffordshire Uni and is now a Director of Learning at de Montfort in Leicester. He did have to work in Stoke for quite a few years though!

 

[DarkFruitsRam7]

On 17/12/2022 at 13:56, David said:

All to common this is. 

Heading into your 30's loaded with debt for all the fancy letters a University can offer, yet no idea what path to take.

Meanwhile the competition sat alongside you waiting to be interviewed have 10+ years working experience, which can be more valuable than the fancy letters that hold no real weight in the direction you decide to take.

All you have proven is to be intelligent in an interest, doesn't show you can be on your feet all day, grinding away, work well with others, reliable, punctual, all the things employers look for.

Not many people have the luxury of knowing exactly what career path to take, completing the studies and then walking into employment that pays well and everything you want is very rare.

I'm sure you remember Joe on here from years ago, he did all the Uni stuff, history if I remember correctly, ended up in a Sky call centre. A job which with all due respect, many can walk into with minimal GCSE's.

If I was you, I'd look at career advice, passing on your story to school leavers and making sure Uni is right for them.

Uni's proper fun though innit

[uttoxram75]

11 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

Uni's proper fun though innit

I don't think David attended Uni, if he did, I would guess he didn't gain any qualifications in Risk Management or Hazard Analysis.

[Ghost of Clough]

1 hour ago, uttoxram75 said:

I don't think David attended Uni, if he did, I would guess he didn't gain any qualifications in Risk Management or Hazard Analysis.

I heard he did a crash course. 

[Leeds Ram]

On 18/12/2022 at 10:58, Tamworthram said:

No need to answer on this forum but consider what did they asked you and how did you answer it? They already knew you had a PhD so I imagine they were digging a bit deeper into why you chose to do the PhD and perhaps what relevance there is, if any, to the job you were applying for. If there isn’t any relevance then maybe they asked you why you have now decided to change direction. Not an easy question to answer.

Thanks for the post tamworth ? I have had a bit of a think about that and maybe I didn't quite articulate myself as well as i could have in regards to that! 

[Leeds Ram]

On 18/12/2022 at 10:59, TimRam said:

Check out local companies who have an industry you're interested in. Explain your situation and ask if you could be an 'observer' for a day to get a feel for the work that goes on there. It helps if you have a friend/family member who works there. My Dad worked for a local company and got me such a day in their I.T. department. You can get chatting to others and network. I found it invaluable and it set me on my career path.

Thanks Tim Ram I'll definitely take that under consideration ? 

[Leeds Ram]

On 18/12/2022 at 11:56, FindernRam said:

Keep at it! I would advise against a scattergun approach though.

There are all sorts of techniques available to help you think through what you are good/bad at. What your personality profile says about you. Leader/follower, risk taker or not etc. 

When I mentored young graduates (decades ago) I started with a simple chart. Where do you want to be in 10 years. Where do you NOT want to be in 10 years. Keep it general, then what do you enjoy/not enjoy. Does this match what you are good at.  Then go through random  vacancies (easier now than when you had to buy the Daily Telegraph) and do a gut feel yes/no. Eventually a pattern will emerge. 

Then go for something like that!  Good luck!

PS , a bit left field but with your knowledge of Middle East politics have you thought of the Army in a Staff type role. 

Thanks FindernRam for the advice ? I have been a bit guilty of scattergunning out of anxiety more than anything else tbh. I'll definitely work up a chart reflecting this and try to be honest with myself ? Thanks for the suggestion too which is something I'll take into consideration! 

[Leeds Ram]

On 18/12/2022 at 18:45, Van der MoodHoover said:

Asset management. 

Someone like Blackrock love academically gifted folk. Doesn't have to be quants either. 

Cheers for the advice ? I have seen a few people mention this so it's definitely something I'll be looking at post xmas ? 

[Leeds Ram]

On 18/12/2022 at 20:56, Normanton Lad said:

“I just want to say one word to you : plastics.”

Just joking. That was a good film and it astonished me to think that I since that film came out I’ve had a long working life and I’ve been retired nearly 20 years. You are living in a totally different world to the one I worked in. When I started firms would almost be begging for you to work for them. Anyone from my school who wanted an apprenticeship could easily get one. Those boys usually ended up as self-employed plumbers, electricians, gas engineers, etc. The ones who got office jobs often ended up as some kind of manager and they retired at 50 on a nice pension. Now job loyalty and security are long gone. It is every man for himself.

Not long ago I decided to spy on some of the young people I used to work with. These were people around your age. The more successful of them had reinvented themselves as “Project Managers”. Before they had been junior managers or IT workers but they got the Prince 2 qualification and a bit of experience running small projects and then they all seemed to find work as consultant project managers in big organisations like local government and the NHS. I could see from the Linkedin site that they usually moved on to another contract after a couple of years. I don’t know if this is normal practice or whether they didn’t want to stay long enough to be "found out".

That’s one option for you. Just say that you’ve been doing project management in education for about 10 years. I’m sure you could dress up whatever you’ve been doing as various projects.

Thanks Normanton for the post ? That's interesting and yes the PhD is definitely one big project i guess with a lot of smaller projects interwoven into it. 

[Leeds Ram]

On 18/12/2022 at 22:38, uttoxram75 said:

My brother never left school, or so we tease him, after Manchester Uni he took a job at Staffordshire Uni and is now a Director of Learning at de Montfort in Leicester. He did have to work in Stoke for quite a few years though!

 

Nice one uttox and massive congrats to your brother. You must all be very proud of him even if he did have to live in Stoke for a while...