Jourdan Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 What does Rooney have to achieve for this signing to be considered a success? The commercial and financial benefits of the deal don’t really interest me. I don’t really care about how many shirts we sell, how many Instagram followers we have, how many fairweather fans we attract, whether this brings in new money to the club, or how many headlines we make. In my mind, it has to be a move that won’t jeopardise the club’s financial future. But it’s equally as important that Rooney has to be the catalyst for promotion. If we don’t get promoted, I am struggling to see how anyone can classify the move as a success. Of course, one player doesn’t make a team and we have other players who will be very important for us this season, but for a club that have been pushing for promotion for the past five years, surely a player of Rooney’s unrivalled quality, profile, experience and influence has to make the difference? Could he be worth the extra 10-15 points we might need to get ourselves over the line? For this deal to make sense, the end goal has to be promotion. If in two years’ time we are still in the Championship, people will wonder whether we could have invested our time, energy and money into other players with a lesser profile but possibly a better fit for the team. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 We could make it to Wembley, Rooney scores a hat trick in the final but horrendous defending at the back sees us lose 4–3. As you say, one player doesn’t make a team, I don’t see how you can define success for one individual based off promotion. Was John Terry’s time at Villa a failure? You judge Rooney as you would any other player at the club, by his performances on the pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar Lamb Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 I think the fact we wont have him until Jan makes this a risk in terms of could it have been better to use the money in other ways. The off set of that risk is we know full well what we are getting, there will be a buzz like nothing before, every player will up their game and we will have optimism which is priceless. We will also have made our club a whole lot more appetizing for any other gifted targets looking to join. Oh, and it will put a great big smile on our faces. Cant put a price on that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyPowell Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 Complete and absolute rubbish.Although you arent interested in the financial side. The club has to be(Surely Mel Morris has shown his awareness of the constraints placed upon the club) and it seems that with various incomes generated by having Rooney ,he will actually cost the club very little.He is second in the all time England appearances,he is the top England all time goalscorer add to this almost 18 years of top flight football the wealth of knowledge /experience he can give to our younger players is priceless IMO.He will surely strengthen the squad and i am sure he will try his hardest Where we finish in the league will be shaped by the 24/25 matches we play before he has arrived.He will be a boost how much of a boost only time will tell.but for goodness sake dont start pulling the guy down before he has kicked a ball 0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimRam Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 Mount was injured and on his return so did our form. He could be the difference between promotion and another championship season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jourdan Posted August 7, 2019 Author Share Posted August 7, 2019 43 minutes ago, David said: We could make it to Wembley, Rooney scores a hat trick in the final but horrendous defending at the back sees us lose 4–3. As you say, one player doesn’t make a team, I don’t see how you can define success for one individual based off promotion. Was John Terry’s time at Villa a failure? You judge Rooney as you would any other player at the club, by his performances on the pitch. You are right - we could make it to Wembley and lose 4-3, and then lose in the play off semi finals the following year despite Rooney’s best efforts. But I still think you can judge the success of Rooney’s signing on whether we get promoted or not. Surely if that player is above and beyond the standard of player we normally attract, surely we should demand more of that player and the team as a consequence? If Villa hadn’t been promoted last season, then you would have to say yes. But Terry played a key role as a player in 17-18 and then as a coach in 18-19 and the team achieved its ultimate goal. Like I say, for me, if we are still in the Championship in 2021-22, the Rooney experiment will have failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zag zig Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 My measuring thoughts. It’s pretty much wound the gumps up who are buying scattergun dross again, Leeds fans (you’re not rivals to us, yet comment on all we do!), possibly a few other 32 Red sponsored clubs, Brizzle fans seem to throw stones at our every move (heck knows why with Stephen Lansdown as chairman) and let’s not forget Steve Gibson. So there’s enough reasons aside from any financial gain. As for playing success, how can anyone make serious comments until he arrives? But Rooney has never struck me being happy just collecting money or warming benches, so let’s see when he arrives, I strongly suspect he has enough in his locker to make a positive impact in the championship and it would be just good for all supporters to get behind him and make him feel welcome before we throw any doubts now he’s signed. After all, every other club is probably wanting him to fail with pure green eyed envy.....sod em, Mel’s too smart for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 I think you judge Rooney by his performances on the pitch and commitment to the club - however he is just one player and his time here won't be classed as a failure if we aren't promoted. Similar to Frank Lampard, despite 'failing' in getting us promoted Rooney will once again elevate the status of the club and who knows what opportunities may arise from having him here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jourdan Posted August 7, 2019 Author Share Posted August 7, 2019 16 minutes ago, TommyPowel said: Complete and absolute rubbish.Although you arent interested in the financial side. The club has to be(Surely Mel Morris has shown his awareness of the constraints placed upon the club) and it seems that with various incomes generated by having Rooney ,he will actually cost the club very little.He is second in the all time England appearances,he is the top England all time goalscorer add to this almost 18 years of top flight football the wealth of knowledge /experience he can give to our younger players is priceless IMO.He will surely strengthen the squad and i am sure he will try his hardest Where we finish in the league will be shaped by the 24/25 matches we play before he has arrived.He will be a boost how much of a boost only time will tell.but for goodness sake dont start pulling the guy down before he has kicked a ball 0 Well if the club’s financial future is not impacted by Rooney’s signing, that’s great. Time will tell. I can understand why Mel has done it. He is a businessman. But again only time will tell if it’s the right business decision. Who is ‘pulling the guy down’? Surely I have been very complimentary of Rooney by saying he is a calibre of player above and beyond what we’d normally sign and that his arrival will heighten expectations? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Jourdan said: What does Rooney have to achieve for this signing to be considered a success? Score some goals (any more than one will do), make some nice passes (I'd like to go "ooooooo" at one), run around a bit, fit into the system well, inspire the youfs in the team, wind up Waggers a bit for bants, let me enjoy watching the playing style and accept the wonderful and totally VIKING nature of his new captain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 11 minutes ago, Jourdan said: You are right - we could make it to Wembley and lose 4-3, and then lose in the play off semi finals the following year despite Rooney’s best efforts. But I still think you can judge the success of Rooney’s signing on whether we get promoted or not. Surely if that player is above and beyond the standard of player we normally attract, surely we should demand more of that player and the team as a consequence? If Villa hadn’t been promoted last season, then you would have to say yes. But Terry played a key role as a player in 17-18 and then as a coach in 18-19 and the team achieved its ultimate goal. Like I say, for me, if we are still in the Championship in 2021-22, the Rooney experiment will have failed. I think you're putting a lot of weight on to Rooney's shoulders with this, look at Messi with Argentina, as good as he is all he has is an Olympic Gold medal to his name at International level. Football is a team game and Rooney cannot drag us to the Premier League by himself, he will need the rest of the team to step up. Of course you would say we stand a better chance with Rooney at our disposal, but we still have to go out there and get the results. Ignoring the commercial side of the move and placing this promotion or failure on Rooney I can't get on board with, and whilst my interest in the money side of the game is minimal it would be foolish to completely ignore the financial rewards that this can bring the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jourdan Posted August 7, 2019 Author Share Posted August 7, 2019 1 minute ago, David said: I think you're putting a lot of weight on to Rooney's shoulders with this, look at Messi with Argentina, as good as he is all he has is an Olympic Gold medal to his name at International level. Football is a team game and Rooney cannot drag us to the Premier League by himself, he will need the rest of the team to step up. Of course you would say we stand a better chance with Rooney at our disposal, but we still have to go out there and get the results. Ignoring the commercial side of the move and placing this promotion or failure on Rooney I can't get on board with, and whilst my interest in the money side of the game is minimal it would be foolish to completely ignore the financial rewards that this can bring the club. But surely as one of the world’s best players for the last 15 years, Rooney will not only be expecting to carry that burden of pressure and expectation, but also relishing it? I could understand your point if we were Luton Town or Preston North End. It’d be unreasonable to expect promotion on the basis of one signing and one player’s influence. But even without Rooney, we would be a team that most observers would consider a top 10 Championship side and higher, a team already capable of competing for promotion. So surely with his signing, it should elevate us further and improve our already strong prospects? You are right in saying that football is about the team not the individuals and ordinarily I would agree. But Wayne Rooney joining a Championship club is no ordinary signing. We know it. Mel knows it. The media know it. Football fans up and down the country know it. If not promotion, what is a reasonable expectation to place on Rooney and the team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 8 minutes ago, Jourdan said: If not promotion, what is a reasonable expectation to place on Rooney and the team? I don't have any real "expectation", but it would be nice to see an improvement on the pitch in terms of performances and results, same as I do with any big signing. To be honest I'm just looking forward to watching a World Class player, albeit past his prime play for my club. Will always have the results first, must win, feel like crap if we lose mentality and that won't go away just because Rooney is here, but again I can't pin any expectations on his shoulders alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 I don’t think you can write off the financial impact the move will have as meaningless- we’ve already seen previously unprecedented sponsorship by 32red and obviously a massive increase in shirt sales and no doubt tickets sold. That will improve the clubs situation not jeopardise it with FFP and is certainly a very significant part of this move, his wages will be more than recouped by the sounds of things. And the transfer fee was nothing as well. But if we park that for a second, and look at this as just a normal move, then we have to assess the move like any normal signing. And I personally don’t judge individual signings on where they lead us to in the table. After all, there’s 11 players contributing and if the other 10 aren’t good enough, that doesn’t make the new signing a poor move. The finishing position is a way to assess the managers success who’s using those players in a tactical system, not a way to assess the players themselves imo. To assess a signings success, you have to look at whether they’ve done the job they’ve been brought in to do to a sufficient quality- ie if they’re brought in to be a first choice player, did they perform well enough to keep their place and impress the manager? If so, the moves probably been a success. If he performs poorly and loses his place, then the move is arguably a failure. To assess rooneys success is quite a difficult thing to do, as he is both a player and a coach. If we assume most his coaching will be with the young lads, and that he will primarily be a player, then that makes assessing his signing easier and is probably the best thing to do. For me, Rooney is a massive signing and to be a success needs to become a key player in the team, and contribute enough in dictating games, scoring/assisting to justify that position. Where we finish isn’t all down to him, so to judge him solely on that over the course of his contract would be very harsh imo- either by us, or by others outside the club. FWIW I genuinely think Rooney will become by far and away our best player, and probably the best player in the championship. He’s only 33! And thus hopefully, he will be a success. And here’s hoping a side effect of that success is our promotion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bimmerman Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 For him to be a success... needs to create a bit of interest and buzz in the club to keep the momentum from the playoffs last year going It's done that Hell be in our dressing room, just his presence will boost the morale of the team in jan So it's gotta be a success so far????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BondJovi Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 Just enjoy having such a talented player to watch, regardless of where we finish. Essentially we have failed for the last 10 years or so if promotion is the end game. All about the journey. I also refuse to believe a manager like Cocu would pin his promotion hopes on Rooney. Lesser managers, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gritstone Ram Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 I want to see loads of worldies and a lot of effort. Also inspire the team to win in January and February and we’ll be somewhere near. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Kevin Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 He's cost neutral He pisses off Forest fans He gets us promoted He pisses off Leeds fans He fills the ground He really pisses off Smogies and Gibson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 Goals, Assists, Profile, Inspiration, Motivation, Attracting new players, Advertising, Shirts, Interviews, Sponsorships, Excitement, Bragging Rights etc etc. What is not to like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rammy03 Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 2 hours ago, Bar Lamb said: I think the fact we wont have him until Jan makes this a risk He'll help us get out of the annual new year slump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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