Wayne Rooney

[RLACML]

but the ultimate measure of a goal scorer is, by definition, the number of goals he's scored. He may not be the best, but he's undeniably the greatest. 

One measure, but not the only one. Given that a number of people in the thread are denying it, it's certainly not undeniable.

All the arguments against this have already been said in the thread so I'll leave it now.

[Sexydadbod]

And your's isn't an opinion? That's a fact, is it?

Seriously do you think he would get into any of those teams? 

[Sexydadbod]

If any of those teams felt that Rooney would improve their teams then they would have bidded for him in the last couple of years

[Day]

Wasn't Bayern interested in him a couple years ago? seen several players urge him to sign for Barca as well, Messi one and Neymar

“The style of football we [Barcelona] play and the level of the players we have - we are the perfect club for the top players to join,” said Neymar, ahead of his departure from Santos for the Nou Camp. “I have met Wayne on a few occasions and he seems a good guy but importantly, he is one of the players I admire most in the world. 

“Wayne is one of the most gifted and technical players in the world. Of course he would improve Barcelona. He would improve any club in Europe. And on a personal level, it would be a dream to play with him.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/10151588/Neymar-urges-Wayne-Rooney-to-join-Barcelona-as-he-meets-Moyes-to-discuss-future.html

[RLACML]

If any of those teams felt that Rooney would improve their teams then they would have bidded for him in the last couple of years

To be fair, you have no idea whether they have or not. 

[Sexydadbod]

To be fair, you have no idea whether they have or not. 

It would have leaked if they had tbh. Just like the man utd bid for bale and psg's deadline day bid for ronaldo

[RLACML]

It would have leaked if they had tbh. Just like the man utd bid for bale and psg's deadline day bid for ronaldo

Not necessarily. There will be hundreds of enquiries/bids that we have no idea about

[TigerTedd]

One measure, but not the only one. Given that a number of people in the thread are denying it, it's certainly not undeniable.

All the arguments against this have already been said in the thread so I'll leave it now.

methinks you've grabbed the wrong end of my stick. 

Goal scorer = one who scores goals, they don't need to be pretty, they just need to cross the line. He has scored the most goals, therefore he is the greatest goal scorer. 

Now if you were to say 'striker', 'forward', 'attacker' anything like that, then it's debatable. That brings a whole load of other qualities to the table (qualities I believe Rooney has, incidentally). But it is a cool hard statistical fact that he has scored two greatest number of goals for England, and is therefore the greatest goal scorer. 

I'm just being annoyingly picky. But then trying to argue against that is also annoyingly wummy. 

BTW, I was also going to mention that terms like world class and best, are completely subjective and impossible to measure with stats. The best you could probably do is get a bunch of experienced football journos and players in a room to decide (or failing that, a bunch of footy needs on a faceless (flat round faces don't count) forum), and you still won't get a consensus. Makes for good debate though. 

[DEL]

All these arguments is really silly. Rooney record is amazing and I'm glad to say I was there to see him broke Charlton record #justsaying 

[eddie]

Keep thinking I'm making ground then you go and insult another member and leave me for dust, I'm working on new tactics now

Choose the insultee wisely.

Utch is always good for a few.

[eddie]

but the ultimate measure of a goal scorer is, by definition, the number of goals he's scored. He may not be the best, but he's undeniably the greatest. 

You are, like Muespach, confusing superlative with comparative.

[Dimmu]

methinks you've grabbed the wrong end of my stick. 

Goal scorer = one who scores goals, they don't need to be pretty, they just need to cross the line. He has scored the most goals, therefore he is the greatest goal scorer. 

Now if you were to say 'striker', 'forward', 'attacker' anything like that, then it's debatable. That brings a whole load of other qualities to the table (qualities I believe Rooney has, incidentally). But it is a cool hard statistical fact that he has scored two greatest number of goals for England, and is therefore the greatest goal scorer. 

I'm just being annoyingly picky. But then trying to argue against that is also annoyingly wummy. 

BTW, I was also going to mention that terms like world class and best, are completely subjective and impossible to measure with stats. The best you could probably do is get a bunch of experienced football journos and players in a room to decide (or failing that, a bunch of footy needs on a faceless (flat round faces don't count) forum), and you still won't get a consensus. Makes for good debate though. 

Someone who is more dedicated to statistics, should compare Rooney to Müller. They are fairly similar IMO, not the most technical, not out-and-out strikers, playing about as good teams etc.

[RamNut]

All these arguments is really silly. Rooney record is amazing and I'm glad to say I was there to see him broke Charlton record #justsaying 

yeah.......but he's not very good.

[StringerBell]

Has he signed?

[MuespachRam]

He has the greatest number of goals yes, but that's not the same as greatest goalscorer. As most people have said, goalscoring ability has a number of different factors to it.

nope goal scoring has one factor and one factor only scoring GOALS..

he is the greatest-and guess what, that is a fact. 

[DEL]

yeah.......but he's not very good.

But he's better than you so your post is silly though. 

[rynny]

Good question. A combination of more goals, scoring more important goals, and making a goalscoring impact at a major tournament. It's difficult to say exactly what he needs to do but he's not there at the moment.

More goals? He already has the most for England. More important? Without his goals England would never have qualified for the last WC, these Euros and the Euros before. A goal scoring impact at a major tournament, fair enough.

Is it difficult to say as you just don't like him and you can't think of anything rational? 

[Duracell]

Seriously do you think he would get into any of those teams? 

Yes. I don't think he's as good as Ribery, Robben, Neymar, Messi, Kroos blah blah blah but not everyone in these sides are better than Rooney.

I don't think Benzema is better than Rooney for a start.

[ramit]

Rooney has scored more goals than any other England player, that makes him the greatest goalscorer in the national side's history.  Surely that's cause for celebration rather than debate. If England win the Euro in France (yes that could actually happen) don't argue about it, just enjoy it.

[Alph]

I'm willing to bet that you've seen Cavani maximum about 5 times. He is one of the most hard working forwards in world football. Silly comparison comparing their scoring records over their whole career. I'm referring to the here and now where Rooney is no longer world class

I'm willing to bet I've seen Cavani over 20 times. I used to watch Serie A every week up until about the last 2 seasons where apart from Juventus it seems to be getting worse. 

I'm not knocking his work rate. Just his general play. It's not a patch on Rooney's

I agree that Rooney is in decline. But outside the immediate 5 or 6 great forwards that spring to mind he's up there. One of the best forwards in the world. By almost any criteria he compares to almost all forwards.