Thomas Tuchel - New England Manager

[Day]

 

[IslandExile]

Thought he was favourite to take over at Manchester United. 

Which poisoned chalice will he choose?

[hintonsboots]

17 hours ago, IslandExile said:

Thought he was favourite to take over at Manchester United. 

Which poisoned chalice will he choose?

Nice cliche use😁

[Ram-Alf]

19 hours ago, IslandExile said:

Thought he was favourite to take over at Manchester United. 

Which poisoned chalice will he choose?

Not interested

 https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/c3ggj0291qpo#:~:text=Thomas Tuchel has ruled himself out of the,should they decide to replace Erik ten Hag.

[TigerTedd]

I think it’s a pretty sad indictment of English football that we can’t find an English manager. Something definitely would long sit right if, when we finally win something, (and I’m sure we would with a quality manager like tuchel at the helm), we do it with a German in charge.

Having said that Sarina Weigman has ingratiated herself well in the women’s team. Like Klopp became a honorary scouser. I guess if you’re a winning manager, you can be adopted pretty quickly. 

[therealhantsram]

1 hour ago, TigerTedd said:

I think it’s a pretty sad indictment of English football that we can’t find an English manager.

This is a very valid point. I think it was about 15 years ago the FA introduce the player performace plan and we see the rewards with so many talented players at the moment. 

It's time we had the same kind of strategy for management talent.

[hintonsboots]

Get Big Sam back.

[Bris Vegas]

8 hours ago, TigerTedd said:

I think it’s a pretty sad indictment of English football that we can’t find an English manager. Something definitely would long sit right if, when we finally win something, (and I’m sure we would with a quality manager like tuchel at the helm), we do it with a German in charge.

Having said that Sarina Weigman has ingratiated herself well in the women’s team. Like Klopp became a honorary scouser. I guess if you’re a winning manager, you can be adopted pretty quickly. 

I think a lot has to do with the quality of the Premier League and the experiences future coaches are having.

It always seemed English managers were a long way behind the rest simply because English players (who later became managers) only ever knew England.

In contrast, Scaloni for instance had spells at West Ham, Lazio and Deportivo - three different countries with different playing styles.

Southgate, Carsley, Howe all just know English football from their playing career, and the PL coaching has only really come on leaps and bounds since the likes of Pep and Klopp turned up.

I think England will have some brilliant coaches going forward, but it might not be until another 10 years or so when the real affect of playing under top managers and being exposed to different environments takes place. 

You look at somebody like Jordan Henderson for instance, having played under Klopp and now playing in Holland. 

[rammieib]

7 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

I think a lot has to do with the quality of the Premier League and the experiences future coaches are having.

It always seemed English managers were a long way behind the rest simply because English players (who later became managers) only ever knew England.

In contrast, Scaloni for instance had spells at West Ham, Lazio and Deportivo - three different countries with different playing styles.

Southgate, Carsley, Howe all just know English football from their playing career, and the PL coaching has only really come on leaps and bounds since the likes of Pep and Klopp turned up.

I think England will have some brilliant coaches going forward, but it might not be until another 10 years or so when the real affect of playing under top managers and being exposed to different environments takes place. 

You look at somebody like Jordan Henderson for instance, having played under Klopp and now playing in Holland. 

Except a lot of the foreign managers in the UK right now never played in England?

I still think it comes back to the fact that an unknown foreigner sounds like a better option than a known English man.

We don't give English managers a chance.

[Bris Vegas]

14 minutes ago, rammieib said:

Except a lot of the foreign managers in the UK right now never played in England?

I still think it comes back to the fact that an unknown foreigner sounds like a better option than a known English man.

We don't give English managers a chance.

But a lot of foreign managers didn’t need to. People were too arrogant in this country. ‘Pep’s football will never work’.

England technically had been so far behind our European rivals for so long. 

The reason there are so few good English coaches is the environment they have been brought up in.

But in 10 years time that will no longer be the case.

[rammieib]

9 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

But a lot of foreign managers didn’t need to. People were too arrogant in this country. ‘Pep’s football will never work’.

England technically had been so far behind our European rivals for so long. 

The reason there are so few good English coaches is the environment they have been brought up in.

But in 10 years time that will no longer be the case.

Fair point. However, I do believe that for every Pep or Klopp, there are plenty of completely unknown and unsuccessful foreigners who come in. Look at the revolving door of Watford for instance. A foreign manager doesn't give a better chance of success mid Pre downwards is my view. 

English managers are not given enough chances in my opinion and would be every bit as successful (certainly in leagues such as the Championship) if they were allowed time.

 

[StaffsRam]

I'll take anyone who's cognizant of form trumping reputation. And stop trying to bang round pegs into square holes. Just by addressing those two issues we'd be a lot better off....

[Anon]

I disagree with the concept of national teams even being allowed to have foreign managers. The manager position is such an important factor in the success of a team that it seems bizarre to not have them follow the same eligibility rules as players. No European team, other than Greece has ever won anything with a foreign manager. I don't understand why we as a nation are so fixated on the idea of a big name foreign coach. It didn't work with Sven and Capello, it won't work if we try it again.

[therealhantsram]

5 minutes ago, Anon said:

I disagree with the concept of national teams even being allowed to have foreign managers. The manager position is such an important factor in the success of a team that it seems bizarre to not have them follow the same eligibility rules as players. No European team, other than Greece has ever won anything with a foreign manager. I don't understand why we as a nation are so fixated on the idea of a big name foreign coach. It didn't work with Sven and Capello, it won't work if we try it again.

However the FA have seen it work with Sarina Wiegman.

[Ram-Alf]

53 minutes ago, therealhantsram said:

However the FA have seen it work with Sarina Wiegman.

 😁

[bimmerman]

I don't know why they don't just have done with it and appoint wiegman

She's already an employee of the fa and shows she is a winner 

[bimmerman]

On 13/10/2024 at 16:41, Bris Vegas said:

 the PL coaching has only really come on leaps and bounds since the likes of Pep and Klopp turned up.

 

You spelt Steve Mclaren wrong

 

[Ghost of Clough]

8 hours ago, rammieib said:

Fair point. However, I do believe that for every Pep or Klopp, there are plenty of completely unknown and unsuccessful foreigners who come in. Look at the revolving door of Watford for instance. A foreign manager doesn't give a better chance of success mid Pre downwards is my view. 

English managers are not given enough chances in my opinion and would be every bit as successful (certainly in leagues such as the Championship) if they were allowed time.

 

15 of the 24 Championship managers are English (1 also Welsh). I think thats a reasoanble amount .
However... How many of those have shown themselves be capable of matching even Sean Dyche in the PL? Maybe Michael Carrick, Luke Williams, Scott Parker, John Eustace are towards the top of the pile. Rob Edwards (Welsh) would be up there too. Would a bottom 6 PL side be interested in any of them though? For reference, Carrick still has a lower ppg than Wassall.

To get a chance, you have to earn it. You do that by getting your team to perform in the league.
Over the past 10 years, the English managers to win promotion from the Championship are very limited - Paul Heckingbottom (1), Scott Parker (2), Dean Smith (1), Chris Wilder (1), Neil Warnock (1), Sean Dyche (1), Steve Bruce (1)
There's currently only 3 English managers in the PL. 2 of those are currently in the bottom 5, after finishing 14th and 15th last season. Howe has performed and has earned the right for his name to be put into the hat to be next England Manger (4th favourite behind Tuchel, Pep and Carsley).

Out of work, there's only really Lampard, Potter and Allardyce. Lampard would be lucky to get in at a Championship club, and Allardyce is only interested in half season (at most) rescue acts. 

So out of all the English managers in the game, I think only Eddie Howe and Graham Potter would be offered a job at a PL club. 
Howe took Bournemouth all the way from L2 to the top half of the PL (with a short stop off at Burnley). He then guided Newcastle to their first top 4 finish in over 20 years.
Potter did enough at Swansea and Brighton (taking over a relegation candidate and turning them into a top 6 side) to get the Chelsea job.
 

[Alty_Ram]

I'm personally not bothered about just having an English manager at all costs. If there are obvious strong English candidates out there then fine, but there are not a whole lot of options with sufficient gravitas with the ultra-wealthy prima donnas that they'll need to try to shape into a team. If you assume that it'd be a Premier League manager then you're picking one from Dyche, Howe or O'Neil. Probably Howe out of that lot, but its pretty slim pickings. What if Howe simply wasn't interested? Do you actually want one of the other 2 ? What then ? A lower league coach who is going to have to try to tell Grealish how he should be playing ?

I think were have to consider foreign coaches these days just to give us some decent quality options. It's that, or we'd either be picking from a very small pool of talent or taking a massive gamble on someone unproven in the top flight.

[Stive Pesley]

21 hours ago, Anon said:

No European team, other than Greece has ever won anything with a foreign manager.

No men's team

🙄