The Keeper

[jimtastic56]

52 minutes ago, Chester40 said:

It was a Warne masterclass. 

I loved it.

Massive underdog performance. 

But we all know what happened to Rotherham. It's not a sustainable plan. 

And that's the crux isnt it. 

Have we got a bigger budget and significantly better players still to come to add to our more talented squad.

Can we retain the ball, take the game to teams,  impose our possession etc...or are we going to just be the underdogs in every game and launch it long and hope for knockdown and deadball goals to keep us in the league.

 

Just on dead-balls . Why on earth did NML keep strolling over and take the ball off of Osborn , only to hit a terrible one ? Vickers was M O M for me . If that had been the New goalie we would now be talking about a £10 mill rated beast that would drive us up the league . Vickers is un -droppable.

[Anag Ram]

18 minutes ago, jimtastic56 said:

Just on dead-balls . Why on earth did NML keep strolling over and take the ball off of Osborn , only to hit a terrible one ? Vickers was M O M for me . If that had been the New goalie we would now be talking about a £10 mill rated beast that would drive us up the league . Vickers is un -droppable.

I thought Vickers had a better second half but which of his saves were special? 

In the first half he caused indecision in the defence, including going for the same ball as his CB, going then retreating in the incident leading to Cashin’s injury and palming a weak shot into a dangerous area.

In the second half he was beaten to a ball he tried to punch by the giant that is Latte Lath. 

The guy did okay, but he wasn’t my MOTM.

 

[DiggerB]

33 minutes ago, jimtastic56 said:

Vickers is un -droppable.

Certainly not for next Saturday, unless the knock on his back prevents it.

[Sparkle]

4 hours ago, jimtastic56 said:

Just on dead-balls . Why on earth did NML keep strolling over and take the ball off of Osborn , only to hit a terrible one ? Vickers was M O M for me . If that had been the New goalie we would now be talking about a £10 mill rated beast that would drive us up the league . Vickers is un -droppable.

Re dead balls, we have lost Hourahan Sibley and Bird who had very good delivery and we seem to only have Ward who hopefully wouldn’t really be on the pitch assuming others were fully fit.

[TomTom92]

4 hours ago, jimtastic56 said:

Just on dead-balls . Why on earth did NML keep strolling over and take the ball off of Osborn , only to hit a terrible one ? Vickers was M O M for me . If that had been the New goalie we would now be talking about a £10 mill rated beast that would drive us up the league . Vickers is un -droppable.

Re Vickers; Can see why it’s his shirt to lose.
But let’s face it we haven’t spent £1.5m on a back up keeper. Plus everyone will be waiting for Vickers to drop a clanger so he can be ousted. Almost think it’s fairer to bring JWZ in straight away and give Vickers a move to league 1 if we can get a back up in.

[Srg]

2 minutes ago, TomTom92 said:

Re Vickers; Can see why it’s his shirt to lose.
But let’s face it we haven’t spent £1.5m on a back up keeper. Plus everyone will be waiting for Vickers to drop a clanger so he can be ousted. Almost think it’s fairer to bring JWZ in straight away and give Vickers a move to league 1 if we can get a back up in.

As well as Vickers played, and he did play well, none of his saves were miraculous and they were all ones a good keeper should make. Knocks against him for his indecision resulting in Cashin’s injury and there was one cross second half he missed which luckily went past the post. 

[The Running Man]

14 minutes ago, TomTom92 said:

Re Vickers; Can see why it’s his shirt to lose.
But let’s face it we haven’t spent £1.5m on a back up keeper. Plus everyone will be waiting for Vickers to drop a clanger so he can be ousted. Almost think it’s fairer to bring JWZ in straight away and give Vickers a move to league 1 if we can get a back up in.

I don't think Vickers ever expected to be number 1. He was brought is at a similar time as Wildmith, and presumably always knew he would be the number 2, and I don't think he has any ambitions to be a number 1, or he'd be out the door on loan last season. He's a good guy and a model pro, and I think he's happy as a backup keeper. He's not an idiot and doesn't think we spunked a massive fee (in our situation) on a 'keeper from Sweden to sit them on the bench.

Watch me be proven wrong my him joining Fornah at Salford now 😅

 

Warne does however seem like a 'dont change a winning team if you can help it' kinda guy, so I do suspect Vickers will start against Watford.

Edited August 18 by The Running Man

[CBX1985]

1 hour ago, The Running Man said:

I don't think Vickers ever expected to be number 1. He was brought is at a similar time as Wildmith, and presumably always knew he would be the number 2, and I don't think he has any ambitions to be a number 1, or he'd be out the door on loan last season. He's a good guy and a model pro, and I think he's happy as a backup keeper. He's not an idiot and doesn't think we spunked a massive fee (in our situation) on a 'keeper from Sweden to sit them on the bench.

Watch me be proven wrong my him joining Fornah at Salford now 😅

 

Warne does however seem like a 'dont change a winning team if you can help it' kinda guy, so I do suspect Vickers will start against Watford.

I think Vickers is a good League two keeper and nothing more, to which I strongly suspect he knows.  He probably has taken the deal of playing at a higher level with higher pay but being back up.  I always find Warne speaks so highly of him. 

It is hard to find a keeper that should be at your level that will be happy to be number 2 - unless you throw money at them.  

[Tamworthram]

10 minutes ago, CBX1985 said:

I think Vickers is a good League two keeper and nothing more, to which I strongly suspect he knows.  He probably has taken the deal of playing at a higher level with higher pay but being back up.  I always find Warne speaks so highly of him. 

It is hard to find a keeper that should be at your level that will be happy to be number 2 - unless you throw money at them.  

Very harsh. He didn't let us down in league 1 last season when he played. He's more than you describe and a decent league 1 keeper at worst.

[Ram-Alf]

7 hours ago, jimtastic56 said:

 Vickers is un -droppable.

I'll be gob smacked if J Zee isn't 1st choice next game, PW aint spunked the alleged £1.4m to put him on the bench, Yes competition is good...so was that performance down to competition or just a good day at the races.

 

 

[CBX1985]

1 minute ago, Ram-Alf said:

I'll be gob smacked if J Zee isn't 1st choice next game, PW aint spunked the alleged £1.4m to put him on the bench, Yes competition is good...so was that performance down to competition or just a good day at the races.

 

 

Indeed.  Put another way, how would we react if Vickers had hitherto been a loan and we made permanent for £1.4m.  I think the consensus would be we had overpaid to put it mildly.

 

14 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

Very harsh. He didn't let us down in league 1 last season when he played. He's more than you describe and a decent league 1 keeper at worst.

Not meant to be.  I think Vickers is good at what he does and goes about it as admirably as can be.  But, he plainly wasn't good enough to be No 1 last year and he sure as hell isn't this year.  He will, however, be an excellent insurance policy. 

[Tamworthram]

7 minutes ago, CBX1985 said:

Indeed.  Put another way, how would we react if Vickers had hitherto been a loan and we made permanent for £1.4m.  I think the consensus would be we had overpaid to put it mildly.

 

Not meant to be.  I think Vickers is good at what he does and goes about it as admirably as can be.  But, he plainly wasn't good enough to be No 1 last year and he sure as hell isn't this year.  He will, however, be an excellent insurance policy. 

He was good enough last season in league one (like I said, he didn't let us down) but PW considered Wildsmith the better keeper. I don't make a habit of scrutinising the performances of other teams keepers but I suspect he wouldn't be out of his depth in many league 1 starting line ups.

[CBX1985]

7 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

He was good enough last season in league one (like I said, he didn't let us down) but PW considered Wildsmith the better keeper. I don't make a habit of scrutinising the performances of other teams keepers but I suspect he wouldn't be out of his depth in many league 1 starting line ups.

Nor do I, but I don't think he'd be stellar in that league (which a Championship keeper would).  His propensity to punch rather than take means the ball is always coming back.  A good Lg 2 keeper can do a good job in Lg 1, and so on up and down the leagues. 

 

 

Edited August 18 by CBX1985

[Tamworthram]

15 minutes ago, CBX1985 said:

Nor do I, but I don't think he'd be stellar in that league (which a Championship keeper would).  His propensity to punch rather than take means the ball is always coming back.  A good Lg 2 keeper can do a good job in Lg 1, and so on up and down the leagues. 

 

 

Looks like a bit of backtracking to me. "A good league two keeper and nothing more" doesn't really mean they'd be OK in league one.

[RamsFan10]

Vickers was great yesterday but he is absolutely droppable and should be dropped, for all the reasons we were desperate for a new keeper in the first place. 
 

As I said he was great but there were still things he could’ve done better. I think people are getting carried away because he was so above the level we’d typically expect from him. 

[CBX1985]

1 minute ago, Tamworthram said:

Looks like a bit of backtracking to me. "A good league two keeper and nothing more" doesn't really mean they'd be OK in league one.

Not really. He is a good league two keeper and nothing more.  I suppose that could be reworded he is a below average lower half Lg 1 goal keeper, but in reality they are the same thing.

Think of teams that come up.  We were a good Lg 1 team last year.  If the same team comes up (without amendment), they would cope to some degree but would not be on any reasonable analysis "good". 

 

 

[Tamworthram]

11 minutes ago, CBX1985 said:

Not really. He is a good league two keeper and nothing more.  I suppose that could be reworded he is a below average lower half Lg 1 goal keeper, but in reality they are the same thing.

Think of teams that come up.  We were a good Lg 1 team last year.  If the same team comes up (without amendment), they would cope to some degree but would not be on any reasonable analysis "good". 

 

 

We were a good league one team. Did Vickers look out of his depth? I don't think so. Did he look out of place yesterday in the championship? Was he at fault for any of the goals at Blackburn? I  don't know how you can describe him as nothing more than a good league two keeper. I guess we'll have to just agree to disagree.

Edited August 18 by Tamworthram

[CBX1985]

12 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

We were a good league one team. Did Vickers look out of his depth? I don't think so. Did he look out of place yesterday in the championship? Was he at fault for any of the goals at Blackburn? I  don't know how you can describe him as nothing more than a good league two keeper. I guess we'll have to just agree to disagree.

I guess it is perceptions. 

Last year I was very nervous when I saw him on the team sheet.  Found his distribution less good, ditto shot stopping; and I dislike it when goalkeepers punch the ball.  I thought there was a notable gulf in class between himself and Wildsmith (who himself had his "issues" and probably is a good Lg 1 keeper and nothing more, on my analysis). 

Think Vickers has a nice gig as number 2 and may have a few games here and there, where I am sure he will give his all and do just fine.  Will be pleased he is not number 1, though.

[jimtastic56]

1 hour ago, Ram-Alf said:

I'll be gob smacked if J Zee isn't 1st choice next game, PW aint spunked the alleged £1.4m to put him on the bench, Yes competition is good...so was that performance down to competition or just a good day at the races.

 

 

£1.4 m is a months wages for some Prem goalies , so let’s not expect Peter Shilton . Some will want to roast him the first time one goes through his legs . I saw a big £10 mill donkey bang one in his own net for Brum yesterday. He thought he was too good for L1 .

[Tyler Durden]

What's the difference between being a good League 2 goalkeeper and a good Championship one?

Surely all good goalkeepers earn their corn by stopping shots, catching crosses, distributing the ball etc so what happens in League 2 that doesn't happen in the Championship?

Must go and watch a few League 2 games as it must be a cricket score every Saturday.