Punching above our weight. What do you think would elevate us above mid table next season?

[Foreveram]

On 24/05/2024 at 20:05, Bris Vegas said:

Derby have never been a similar size to West Ham. We're a similar size club to West Brom, Norwich and Coventry City. Not West Ham who are and always have been a top 10 sized club in this country.

 

[Mucker1884]

7 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

It was obvious what I meant, and an insignificant part of the debate.

 

[MackworthRamIsGod]

Has the club badge of Villareal ever been used in the News of The World to cover someone's lady garden? Because I know Derby County's was...Jimmy Jewel made us World famous 😆 

[Foreveram]

Did the king of Spain open their stadium.

[Foreveram]

Has Chris Kirchner ever tried to buy them.

[Hans Datdo-Dishes]

10 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

Did the king of Spain open their stadium.

Ashley Giles?

[ramsbottom]

As is always the case when you don't or can't have an unlimited budget for players, the most important thing is smart recruitment.  There's plenty of gems in the divisions below us, as well as undervalued players from The Championship which Warne will believe he can make use of and that would fit his system, Mr Ebou Adams being a case in point.  The trick is to identify them, and get them at the right price, all whilst fitting his mantra of being good people.

Time for the recruitment team to earn their corn...

[ram59]

26 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

Did the king of Spain open their stadium.

He didn't open Pride Park, either.😉

[Foreveram]

7 minutes ago, ram59 said:

He didn't open Pride Park, either.😉

No but the reigning monarch of England opened our ground, the first time she had ever opened a football ground, and remained so until she opened the MK Dons stadium.

[Bris Vegas]

6 hours ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

I love how much you’ll move the goalposts to die on any particular hill you created for yourself.
You said we’ve had no international players since Stimac and Wanchope, that’s the statement you made, you didn’t qualify it further with any additional conditions around those stars having a “following”.

I still agree with you that Villarreal and West Ham are currently bigger clubs than Derby, I just think the way you’re qualifying your opinion on it is questionable and smacks once more of you parading your opinion as superior to anyone else

Moving the goal posts? Nah, it was clear that I meant we haven’t had any international stars, the sort of players where supporters look out for their results, since the days of Stimac, Strupar and Wanchope yet you seem to want to debate the tiny details to try and prove a point. 

You can go on believing Derby are a big club. I respect your opinion. The constant personal jibes on this forum Is poor etiquette. 

 

[Ambitious]

Are we arguing who is bigger between Villarreal and Derby County? 

We need some transfer rumours pronto. 

[Bris Vegas]

5 minutes ago, Ambitious said:

Are we arguing who is bigger between Villarreal and Derby County? 

We need some transfer rumours pronto. 

Next some will be claiming Paul Warne is a better manager than Unai Emery. 

[Comrade 86]

1 minute ago, Bris Vegas said:

Next some will be claiming Paul Warne is a better manager than Unai Emery. 

Or that Liverpool are going to win the league.

[Bris Vegas]

Just now, Comrade 86 said:

Or that Liverpool are going to win the league.

Good job they didn’t. 

[Ambitious]

7 minutes ago, Bris Vegas said:

Next some will be claiming Paul Warne is a better manager than Unai Emery. 

Promotions: 

Emery - 0
Warne - 4

It all adds up. 

[Bris Vegas]

8 hours ago, Crewton said:

How could you forget CONOR SAMMON!

Villarreal don't even have regional support. The only time they get close to filling their 23,000 capacity stadium is when they play Real Madrid or Barcelona. We filled ours numerous times, against the likes of Oxford and Carlisle IN THE 3RD TIER.

Why do you reckon a "world famous" club only averages 16,000 at home? Are the tickets too expensive? Or are they simply neither would famous nor a "big" club?

 

If fans in stadium is the only criteria for a big club then West Ham are bigger than Liverpool.

 

[Bris Vegas]

I guess simply you could look at criteria for a big club being:

- Fans in stadium

- Trophies won throughout history

- Seasons in top flight

I think that the above criteria has no bearing on whether a player will choose one club over the other.

I think that more importantly a big club has:

- Wider global audience / reputation

- The ability to attract better players 

- Potential to challenge for major trophies

Villarreal tick the boxes. Derby don’t. Sadly our ceiling is midtable PL and if anything we are becoming a smaller, insignificant club outside of Derby as smaller clubs either catch us up or overtake us in the latter categories.

 

Edited May 29 by Bris Vegas

[Caerphilly Ram]

37 minutes ago, Bris Vegas said:

Moving the goal posts? Nah, it was clear that I meant we haven’t had any international stars, the sort of players where supporters look out for their results, since the days of Stimac, Strupar and Wanchope yet you seem to want to debate the tiny details to try and prove a point. 

You can go on believing Derby are a big club. I respect your opinion. The constant personal jibes on this forum Is poor etiquette. 

 

What point am I trying to prove? I’ve already said I agree with you that Villarreal and West Ham are currently bigger clubs than Derby. I provided evidence contradicting a statement that said we’ve had no international players since Stimac and Wanchope. I’m also not the only person who did so which suggests it wasn’t clear that you meant international stars who attract their own fans until the point you added those comments, ergo “moving the goalposts”.

If I’ve caused offence then I apologise. To explain my point further I simply don’t ever see you discussing your points with consideration of other factors, there is always a “it’s this or that” stance to your “hot takes”. Such as we’re “flat track bullies”, “Warne won’t succeed in the championship”, “Derby aren’t a big club”, in fact you rarely seem to be constructive in what you say about the club unless I’m missing something 🤔 

So on the point of if Derby are a big club or not, you’ve discounted our history (ancient and recent), attendances, and wider fan base, without the context of where we have spent the last 2 years post admin. Prior to admin we were managed by some big names in world football in Rooney, Lampard and Cocu….where we a big club then? We were covered by Sky Sports as “Frank Lampard’s Derby County”, did that qualify us as a big club? If we sign a Japanese international this summer will that make us a big club? We were consistently pushing towards the top of the championship a few years ago, if we get back to that are we a big club? It’s more complex than that, it’s dependent on a number of factors.

West Ham and Villarreal (to quote two of the examples you’ve used to belittle Derby) are at present larger clubs than Derby, playing at a higher level of competition and with wider media exposure as a result. They have larger social media followings than Derby. They have higher profile international players. Currently. IF Derby were to be promoted in the next couple of years through and play in the PL for a couple of seasons gaining stability and kicking on from there, our profile would grow, our social media following would grow, the likelihood of us having higher profile international players and coaches increases. AND we’d still have a consistently high level of attendance alongside the club’s history. 

So in summary, are we as big a club as we were? No we’re not. Are we a club with the potential to progress and succeed with the right recruitment, ownership, investment, coaching? Yes we are.
If we got to the PL and established ourselves in that league we’d be bigger than your Bournemouth’s, Brighton’s, Fulham’s etc. Would it be good to see that as a Derby County fan, absolutely it would. How we get there will take a combination of factors to fall in to place, it may or may not ever happen, but rather than dismiss it I’m happy to consider the possibility at least.
To get back onto the OP’s point, for us to “punch above our weight” we’ll need to recruit well, play effective football for the league (what that is is open for debate), gel as a squad, back the team from the stands, and ideally win more than we lose.

[Crewton]

20 minutes ago, Bris Vegas said:

If fans in stadium is the only criteria for a big club then West Ham are bigger than Liverpool.

 

You're confusing stadium size with club size. If Liverpool had a 100,000 stadium, they'd fill it quite regularly with mainly Liverpool fans. If West Ham had a 100,000 stadium they might fill it occasionally, but only if there was nothing else to do in London that weekend and the tickets were cheap.

As far as your later post is concerned, you were doing so well until you mistook the temporary with the permanent, the superficial with matters of substance. While Villareal are in La Liga and Derby are not in the PL, they'll beat us to a player every time, particularly if they're from a Spanish speaking country, assuming we'd both be interested in signing them, but mid-table Premier League as a destination most likeley trumps Villareal everytime, unless a player simply decides they prefer to live in the Villareal area. 

[plymouthram]

Current Skybet odds have us finishing 12th in the Championship. I think with the right recruitment and current squad, that's about right.