Derby v Notts County (A) Match Thread

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

3 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Another person that has never heard of delegation...

So you want Warne running every team at every age group?

And lets be honest, every single one of your arguments is aimed at further bashing Warne, so not really going to make much notice of what you think anyway.

Core blimey. 
 

Warne should 100% be close to the U21s whether Buxton is the manager or not. Why shouldn’t he and why wouldn’t he? 
 

Anyway, enjoy your night. I’m off to book my hotel ready for the final. 

[Foreveram]

Two days ago tickets went on sale for the home game against Wolves under 21s in the last group stage fixture.

Although it is still on the fixture list for 7th of November at Pride Park the tickets are not now showing as on sale.🤷🏻‍♂️

[angieram]

8 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

Two days ago tickets went on sale for the home game against Wolves under 21s in the last group stage fixture.

Although it is still on the fixture list for 7th of November at Pride Park the tickets are not now showing as on sale.🤷🏻‍♂️

Did you buy before they disappeared?

[GangwayD]

12 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

So given promotion is priority and given we ‘ran out of players’ last season wouldn’t it have been better to test some of the youngsters? 

On this point I’d disagree with you RM.

I felt it was necessary to go with a very strong line up last night, especially considering the international break and it being so long until we play again, plus the squad has shown unfortunately only a  few glimpses at times this season of what it could be capable off so considering the new faces, I felt it was better to allow them to try and gell further. 

I bang on about Warne not replacing Didzy and it was highlighted yet again last night for me. We should have been 3 up possibly 4 by half time had we got a player of his quality up top. 

The game would have been secured and then allowed us to look at the youngsters plus the Wolves game now should mean they are all given game time. 

Thought his substitution seemed very odd and Warne seems to over complicate things but overall job done. 

Let’s hope we see more of the glimpses of quality we have seen. 

Gangway D from the terrace 
 

 

 

 

 

 

[G STAR RAM]

18 minutes ago, Bald Eagle's Barmy Army said:

Core blimey. 
 

Warne should 100% be close to the U21s whether Buxton is the manager or not. Why shouldn’t he and why wouldn’t he? 

Because he has a job to do with the first team?

When an u21s player is ready they will step up and train with the first team?

 

[Foreveram]

2 minutes ago, angieram said:

Did you buy before they disappeared?

No, I wanted to check with my lad that he wanted to go, I didn’t anticipate them selling out.😂

There were five single tickets sold when I looked, and then I noticed this morning they were no longer on sale.

I don’t know if it’s within the rules to move it to another ground like Alfreton 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Matchday Fred]

Only saw the highlights but Bird looked like the player we’d hoped he’d be. Looking to go forward, running at pace, lots of energy, threatening the goal. Much much better than the exhibition pace we have seen before the injury. You can tell his contract is up this summer.

[Archied]

10 hours ago, Bald Eagle's Barmy Army said:

Actually, yes they are one team. 
 

Paul Warne is manager of Derby County. When he first arrived he addressed all staff from the whole club, not just the first team. 
 

Everything the academy does is with the first team in mind, so yes, they are one team, one club. 

Let’s hope he is rolling his sleeves up and mucking in with the washing up in the canteen , bloody shirker , im guessing he’s more of a tea towel drying man myself though

[Guest]

15 hours ago, Archied said:

Hilarious , you asked why put them on the bench if your not going to play them ,then state that it’s clear that he had not much choice but to put them on the bench , warnes job is first team manager and to get the club promoted, I don’t really want him bogged down in a decimated academy rebuilding job thanks 👍, last time I checked we had coaches employed for that job , now if there is a player in there that is setting the world alight I expect one of those coaches to be bugging the hell out of warne to consider checking if he’s good enough or ready for the FIRST TEAM ,

I get it, we won so some need to open up another front on the war on warne , I just don’t buy it , get on with getting this club promoted as fast as you can please Mr warne , if you can’t do it then there will come a time to hit the road🤷🏻‍♂️

My thoughts on the bench last night as @Ghost of Clough isn’t really wrong. The first team are off for 4/5 days now and I’m guessing some were decided not needed for the game so could start their time off early creating some spaces on the bench. Brown has been doing well in u21s and trains every day with the first team as does Robinson, Radcliffe and Evans from that group. Allen and the other young lad were never going to play they have been given this as a reward for playing well and to up their value if other clubs are lurking. Brown coming on when the game was won is another example of upping his value more than playing him for an impact in my opinion.
 

All of those mentioned are the best u21 players and the ones closest to being consistently in the first team and I would love to see them all get a game against Wolves u21s who they will probably play this season in their own league….

What I will add though is that Mansfield brought on a lad released by Derby at 16 when they were 2-2 last night and he had influence in their last goal against Doncaster. Honestly I don’t think we would bring on a player to make a debut in that circumstance at present.

Warne doesn’t run the u21s and of course they are Buxton’s responsibility but if you have lads training with you every day then maybe you should trust them for more than 2 minutes at the end of a game..? 

[DavesaRam]

23 hours ago, TINMANTED said:

We just need to be more clinical.-this is the problem,we dont have  forwards with the ability to be more clinical

Actually we might have, but so far we’ll never know.

Edited October 12, 2023 by DavesaRam

[angieram]

3 hours ago, ExiledinDerby said:

My thoughts on the bench last night as @Ghost of Clough isn’t really wrong. The first team are off for 4/5 days now and I’m guessing some were decided not needed for the game so could start their time off early creating some spaces on the bench. Brown has been doing well in u21s and trains every day with the first team as does Robinson, Radcliffe and Evans from that group. Allen and the other young lad were never going to play they have been given this as a reward for playing well and to up their value if other clubs are lurking. Brown coming on when the game was won is another example of upping his value more than playing him for an impact in my opinion.
 

All of those mentioned are the best u21 players and the ones closest to being consistently in the first team and I would love to see them all get a game against Wolves u21s who they will probably play this season in their own league….

What I will add though is that Mansfield brought on a lad released by Derby at 16 when they were 2-2 last night and he had influence in their last goal against Doncaster. Honestly I don’t think we would bring on a player to make a debut in that circumstance at present.

Warne doesn’t run the u21s and of course they are Buxton’s responsibility but if you have lads training with you every day then maybe you should trust them for more than 2 minutes at the end of a game..? 

Were there any senior players not fit or not on international duty that weren't on the bench? I couldn't think of any.

Edited October 12, 2023 by angieram
Got mixed up and said same thing twice

[Ghost of Clough]

25 minutes ago, angieram said:

Were there any senior players not fit or not on international duty that weren't on the bench? I couldn't think of any.

Loach 😅

[Guest]

28 minutes ago, angieram said:

Were there any senior players not fit or not on international duty that weren't on the bench? I couldn't think of any.

I’m rubbish at keeping track on the injuries… must have forgotten a few!! There is enough of them… 😂

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

5 hours ago, Archied said:

Let’s hope he is rolling his sleeves up and mucking in with the washing up in the canteen , bloody shirker , im guessing he’s more of a tea towel drying man myself though

Yea hope so - unless he's busy trying to work out how to stop Cheltenham's midfield when we play them at home. 

[Guest]

Probably even more of a reason to rest sone and five minutes to the better academy lads… then again I don’t see the pizza cup as important in the slightest

[duncanjwitham]

4 hours ago, ExiledinDerby said:

Warne doesn’t run the u21s and of course they are Buxton’s responsibility but if you have lads training with you every day then maybe you should trust them for more than 2 minutes at the end of a game..? 

I'm not even sure it's down to trust.  You either have to commit fully to being a team that develops academy players, or you just don't bother at all.  If you genuinely want academy lads to progress through to the first team consistently, you have to be willing to gamble a bit on them sometimes.  Give them some minutes whenever you can, and be aware that it might cost you results in that game, but be willing to accept that, because long-term you will be better off as a club.

If we don't ever play Brown because we don't trust him, he's never going to make the mistakes that he can learn from, and become a player that we can trust.  And then instead of being a 17 year old that needs to develop, he's suddenly going to be a 21 year old that needs to develop, and by then it's probably too late.  Players don't just spring from the academy fully formed and trustworthy.

And obviously I'm not saying throw players in before they're ready at all, or even that we should have put all of the youngsters on much earlier the other night.  But if we think Brown is a genuine championship-level prospect, he should be getting at *least* a couple of hundred first-team minutes over the course of this season.  If he's only getting 2 minutes in a tin-pot cup when we were 2-0 up, he's going to get nowhere near that, especially when he barely even makes the bench in league games.

If you aren't going to be willing to commit to it, you might get the odd Will Hughes-type that comes through and just looks like a first-team player from day one, but you'll never get the conveyor-belt of players that teams like Southampton seem to manage.

[Srg]

4 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

I'm not even sure it's down to trust.  You either have to commit fully to being a team that develops academy players, or you just don't bother at all.  If you genuinely want academy lads to progress through to the first team consistently, you have to be willing to gamble a bit on them sometimes.  Give them some minutes whenever you can, and be aware that it might cost you results in that game, but be willing to accept that, because long-term you will be better off as a club.

If we don't ever play Brown because we don't trust him, he's never going to make the mistakes that he can learn from, and become a player that we can trust.  And then instead of being a 17 year old that needs to develop, he's suddenly going to be a 21 year old that needs to develop, and by then it's probably too late.  Players don't just spring from the academy fully formed and trustworthy.

And obviously I'm not saying throw players in before they're ready at all, or even that we should have put all of the youngsters on much earlier the other night.  But if we think Brown is a genuine championship-level prospect, he should be getting at *least* a couple of hundred first-team minutes over the course of this season.  If he's only getting 2 minutes in a tin-pot cup when we were 2-0 up, he's going to get nowhere near that, especially when he barely even makes the bench in league games.

If you aren't going to be willing to commit to it, you might get the odd Will Hughes-type that comes through and just looks like a first-team player from day one, but you'll never get the conveyor-belt of players that teams like Southampton seem to manage.

and I don't know about you, but I'm much more willing to accept mistakes and failure when it's academy lads trying their hearts out and making a mistake, than the lack of effort or mistakes we get from old journeymen.

[angieram]

Well, I would have brought Davidson on the wing as well as Brown up front, would have loved to see them run against tired legs. There was loads of space up front towards the end of the game.

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

I'm not even sure it's down to trust.  You either have to commit fully to being a team that develops academy players, or you just don't bother at all.  If you genuinely want academy lads to progress through to the first team consistently, you have to be willing to gamble a bit on them sometimes.  Give them some minutes whenever you can, and be aware that it might cost you results in that game, but be willing to accept that, because long-term you will be better off as a club.

If we don't ever play Brown because we don't trust him, he's never going to make the mistakes that he can learn from, and become a player that we can trust.  And then instead of being a 17 year old that needs to develop, he's suddenly going to be a 21 year old that needs to develop, and by then it's probably too late.  Players don't just spring from the academy fully formed and trustworthy.

And obviously I'm not saying throw players in before they're ready at all, or even that we should have put all of the youngsters on much earlier the other night.  But if we think Brown is a genuine championship-level prospect, he should be getting at *least* a couple of hundred first-team minutes over the course of this season.  If he's only getting 2 minutes in a tin-pot cup when we were 2-0 up, he's going to get nowhere near that, especially when he barely even makes the bench in league games.

If you aren't going to be willing to commit to it, you might get the odd Will Hughes-type that comes through and just looks like a first-team player from day one, but you'll never get the conveyor-belt of players that teams like Southampton seem to manage.

I’m with you completely on this I really am. I watch a fair bit of academy football and the ones I’ve discussed really do have the potential to be in our first team for years to come if developed properly and given a chance. 
 

I’m going to ignore Allen and Davidson for now as I will the likes of Thompson, Hawkins and MacAndrew in the u18s as they really aren’t close to being ready for the first team yet but Robinson, Radcliffe, Brown and Evans really do need exposure and minutes to develop them and this cup for me is perfect for it. It’s meaningless, in fact play them in all the cups because we aren’t winning the FA or Carabao cup so give them Minutes give them exposure and increase their value in the mean time whilst showing them they have a future here. 

[Ghost of Clough]

24 minutes ago, angieram said:

Well, I would have brought Davidson on the wing as well as Brown up front, would have loved to see them run against tired legs. There was loads of space up front towards the end of the game.

I felt we should have brought Allen on at AM for any of our midfield trio, who were all tiring late in the game. Fornah diving in was a tired mind setting in.
Davidson should have been brought on for Barkhuizen, for the reason you give, rather than for Smith (pushing Wilson to RW and Sibley to LW)
Brown should have come on for Collins much sooner, who was having 'one of those days' and was a red card risk.

 

33 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

I'm not even sure it's down to trust.  You either have to commit fully to being a team that develops academy players, or you just don't bother at all.  If you genuinely want academy lads to progress through to the first team consistently, you have to be willing to gamble a bit on them sometimes.  Give them some minutes whenever you can, and be aware that it might cost you results in that game, but be willing to accept that, because long-term you will be better off as a club.

If we don't ever play Brown because we don't trust him, he's never going to make the mistakes that he can learn from, and become a player that we can trust.  And then instead of being a 17 year old that needs to develop, he's suddenly going to be a 21 year old that needs to develop, and by then it's probably too late.  Players don't just spring from the academy fully formed and trustworthy.

And obviously I'm not saying throw players in before they're ready at all, or even that we should have put all of the youngsters on much earlier the other night.  But if we think Brown is a genuine championship-level prospect, he should be getting at *least* a couple of hundred first-team minutes over the course of this season.  If he's only getting 2 minutes in a tin-pot cup when we were 2-0 up, he's going to get nowhere near that, especially when he barely even makes the bench in league games.

If you aren't going to be willing to commit to it, you might get the odd Will Hughes-type that comes through and just looks like a first-team player from day one, but you'll never get the conveyor-belt of players that teams like Southampton seem to manage.

I've created a list of minutes given to academy players/graduates up to and including their breakthrough season, with a total minutes row at the bottom.