The Politics Thread 2020

[A Ram for All Seasons]

1 hour ago, Angry Ram said:

I see the EU budget negotiations are going well.. Harmony in motion.

Arguments about money with my missus never go well either 

[King Kevin]

18 hours ago, Needlesh said:

I think you'll find that economics made that decision.

The decline in manufacturing started way before Thatcher ,it started when we joined the Common Market in 1973 .We joined a trading bloc that made the same things as we did only better .

We would have been better off developing our trade with mainly agricultural  Commonwealth countries   whist selling them manufactured goods .This was of course way before global trade as we know it  today .

In 1973  Australia seeming a lot further away than it does now .In the fifties and sixties Britain dominated world aircraft production we now either buy abroad or build jointly .

It wasn't just Thatcher we have been let down by just about every government since the war.

[A Ram for All Seasons]

2 hours ago, King Kevin said:

We would have been better off developing our trade with mainly agricultural  Commonwealth countries   whist selling them manufactured goods 

 

We would have been much better off investing our money (or other people's money) in something productive rather than spaffing it up the wall on currency speculation, sub-prime mortgages and financial derivatives. The result has been that wage earners are now 68p a week better off than they were in 2008, while their outgoings have soared.

This was not dictated by economics. Rather, it was caused by one small set of vested interests triumphing over the greater good.

[Tamworthram]

3 hours ago, A Ram for All Seasons said:

 

We would have been much better off investing our money (or other people's money) in something productive rather than spaffing it up the wall on currency speculation, sub-prime mortgages and financial derivatives. The result has been that wage earners are now 68p a week better off than they were in 2008, while their outgoings have soared.

This was not dictated by economics. Rather, it was caused by one small set of vested interests triumphing over the greater good.

I can't imagine what the wages would have to be if we had a clothing industry (or many other industries) that had to compete with some of the low wages paid in certain other parts of the world. I wonder if one of the main drivers causing the decline in our manufacturing sector is due to being part of the global economy rather than the growth in the service (including financial) sector.

[A Ram for All Seasons]

50 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

I can't imagine what the wages would have to be if we had a clothing industry (or many other industries) that had to compete with some of the low wages paid in certain other parts of the world. I wonder if one of the main drivers causing the decline in our manufacturing sector is due to being part of the global economy rather than the growth in the service (including financial) sector.

Other European countries seem to have coped much better.

[Tamworthram]

6 minutes ago, A Ram for All Seasons said:

Other European countries seem to have coped much better.

[King Kevin]

It's tough to stay near the top of the economic tree globally .Emerging economies usually have cheap labour and in the case of China have exported deflation to the West in terms of cheap goods .

We do however have great expertise in this country in terms of high end technology .The Lockheed Lightening aircraft is 15%  British made , the most important parts of the Airbus are made in the UK .

We need to back ourselves more . The problem with having so many foreign owned companies over here is because when the poo hits the fan decisions on  closures , redundancies etc are made abroad not over here.

[1of4]

Looks as if our Prime Minister is taking another page out of the Trump playbook. Reportedly Johnson as now ordered that all government information passed to him must not be any longer than two sides of a A4 sheet of paper.

How can we have any trust in our country's leader, when they can't or don't want to be bothered to have a full understanding of the issues, that can affect the safety and wellbeing of the country.

[Rev]

14 minutes ago, 1of4 said:

Looks as if our Prime Minister is taking another page out of the Trump playbook. Reportedly Johnson as now ordered that all government information passed to him must not be any longer than two sides of a A4 sheet of paper.

How can we have any trust in our country's leader, when they can't or don't want to be bothered to have a full understanding of the issues, that can affect the safety and wellbeing of the country.

You could argue it's a sign of a man who knows his limitations, and a sign of his great self awareness and strength that he's requested information in this way.

He also may be wanting to drill down straight into the point people are trying to make, and is tired of reading fluff that doesn't address the point needed.

On the other hand, it's Boris so he'd probably prefer the info in pictorial form, like he's used to seeing in the Sun?

 

[ariotofmyown]

2 hours ago, reverendo de duivel said:

You could argue it's a sign of a man who knows his limitations, and a sign of his great self awareness and strength that he's requested information in this way.

He also may be wanting to drill down straight into the point people are trying to make, and is tired of reading fluff that doesn't address the point needed.

On the other hand, it's Boris so he'd probably prefer the info in pictorial form, like he's used to seeing in the Sun?

 

You do know Johnson went to Eton and Oxford right? Although he only managed a 2:2 after all that money spent on his education. 

[Rev]

2 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

You do know Johnson went to Eton and Oxford right? Although he only managed a 2:2 after all that money spent on his education. 

Yeah, I was being sarcastic and failing.

[ariotofmyown]

2 minutes ago, reverendo de duivel said:

Yeah, I was being sarcastic and failing.

Lol so was I and failing too!

[ariotofmyown]

Excellent piece on the flooding, Tory cuts and the lack of decent media.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/23/tories-ignored-flood-advice-austerity-pitt-review

Imagine the current set of fools been asked about the Pitt Review. They would probably bang on about Scargill and the Unions. Actually, they probably would know nowt about that either.

[Ghost of Clough]

8 hours ago, ariotofmyown said:

Excellent piece on the flooding, Tory cuts and the lack of decent media.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/23/tories-ignored-flood-advice-austerity-pitt-review

Imagine the current set of fools been asked about the Pitt Review. They would probably bang on about Scargill and the Unions. Actually, they probably would know nowt about that either.

"Tory cuts" = 6.2% increase since 2011?

Flooding isn't the problem, building on floodplains and the destruction of nature surrounding rivers is. How many fewer problems would we have had in the past couple of weeks if we didn't build houses in such areas?

[Van der MoodHoover]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

"Tory cuts" = 6.2% increase since 2011?

Flooding isn't the problem, building on floodplains and the destruction of nature surrounding rivers is. How many fewer problems would we have had in the past couple of weeks if we didn't build houses in such areas?

So where ARE we going to build them? Perhaps we shouldn't bother building at all.......ah, tried that one - hence the need to build MORE rather than less....oh dear!

 

Meanwhile, I was  tickled to hear that The Sunday Times (the shrieking commie rag) ran a piece that said MI5 were not passing intelligence to the Home Secretary (remind me of their  name?) on the basic grounds that she is too dim to understand it. Actually the wording was "concerns about her ability to understand the subtleties of intelligence briefings".

What a fun start to the week - have a good one all! ?

[Ghost of Clough]

36 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

So where ARE we going to build them? Perhaps we shouldn't bother building at all.......ah, tried that one - hence the need to build MORE rather than less....oh dear!

 

Meanwhile, I was  tickled to hear that The Sunday Times (the shrieking commie rag) ran a piece that said MI5 were not passing intelligence to the Home Secretary (remind me of their  name?) on the basic grounds that she is too dim to understand it. Actually the wording was "concerns about her ability to understand the subtleties of intelligence briefings".

What a fun start to the week - have a good one all! ?

You believe there's nowhere else to build houses?

[Van der MoodHoover]

55 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

You believe there's nowhere else to build houses?

Only about 12% of the UK landmass is "urban" or built upon, so yes there is - in theory - plenty of room.

But when you start knocking off the 88%, the places where people don't wish to live, the mountains/lakes/hills that its difficult to build on, the NIMBYs, proximity to services/transport

 

.....how much is left? The floodplains are a) at least partly in popular parts of the uk and b) quite flat so easy to build on......

 

 

[Ghost of Clough]

11 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Only about 12% of the UK landmass is "urban" or built upon, so yes there is - in theory - plenty of room.

But when you start knocking off the 88%, the places where people don't wish to live, the mountains/lakes/hills that its difficult to build on, the NIMBYs, proximity to services/transport

 

.....how much is left? The floodplains are a) at least partly in popular parts of the uk and b) quite flat so easy to build on......

 

 

Nothing to do with profit then?

[Van der MoodHoover]

Just now, Ghost of Clough said:

Nothing to do with profit then?

easy to build on and in a part of the country where people want to live = low build cost and high sale prices = max profits

 

What do you reckon.......forced migration to the less populated parts of the UK......Scotland, central wales and norfolk by banning building outside of those areas.....mind you, most of East Anglia is a floodplain under climate change ?

[A Ram for All Seasons]

37 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Mind you, most of East Anglia is a floodplain under climate change

The German government decided to build a big office block in Bonn right next to the River Rhine when Bonn was still the capital. The foundations were designed as a concrete pontoon which would simply float in the event of flooding, and the sheer weight of the building on top would prevent it from rising up and causing any structural damage.

However, the Rhine broke its banks while they were still building the foundations, the project was cancelled and they had to write off 300 million marks.

The best solution is not to start building on the floodplain in the first place.