The Politics Thread 2019

[maxjam]

3 minutes ago, 86 points said:

Maybe then it can counterbalance a hideously right wing press bias that sees the lines of Corbyn portrayed as a subversive and a terrorist sympathiser and remainders as traitors and threats to democracy. Swings and roundabouts.

There's a mix in the press though;

Mirror <> Sun

Telegraph <> Times

Google, Facebook, Twitter, Youtube, PayPal, Instagram, etc are all the major/only players in their fields.

[Comrade 86]

18 minutes ago, maxjam said:

There's a mix in the press though;

Mirror <> Sun

Telegraph <> Times

Google, Facebook, Twitter, Youtube, PayPal, Instagram, etc are all the major/only players in their fields.

So blue rinsers who read the Daily Fail are countered by the Twitter generation. You won. Get over it! ?

[Rev]

41 minutes ago, maxjam said:

There's a mix in the press though;

Mirror <> Sun

Telegraph <> Times

Google, Facebook, Twitter, Youtube, PayPal, Instagram, etc are all the major/only players in their fields.

In what way do the equally right leaning Telegraph and Times balance each other out?

The Mirror was a left leaning title historically, but now it's been merged with the Express and the Star, sharing stories, newsdesks, picture editors etc, I wouldn't expect that to last much longer.

 

[maxjam]

9 minutes ago, reveldevil said:

In what way do the equally right leaning Telegraph and Times balance each other out?

 

Oops my bad, typed Times into media bias and got the answer for NY Times ? Ah well, swap that for The Guardian. 

The point is there is a range of political opinions in the papers whereas the social media giants typically dominate or monopolise their fields and all lean left.

[maxjam]

Interesting article in the NY Times on social media and democrat voters;

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/04/08/upshot/democratic-electorate-twitter-real-life.html

I could explain it but Tim Pool does it better than me; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMbFtPgOEe8

In short, the progressive wing of the democrat party dominate social media and are driving the democrat agenda because they are basically shouting the loudest - despite being less than 10% of the voter base.  Conservatives that push back are being removed from platforms and Moderates don't engage which is allowing the far left to run riot.

I know its America but there are parallels with the UKs social media usage and Labours move to the left.  In a time when we have the weakest Tory government in forever Labour should be streets ahead in the polls.  Maybe if they stopped trying to win the young, progressive vote online, reined themselves in a bit and concentrated on their larger moderate base they might pick up a few more votes?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jun/09/digital-strategists-give-victory-to-labour-in-social-media-election-facebook-twitter

[Wolfie]

On 08/04/2019 at 12:49, maxjam said:

If I was cynical (and I am ?) I'd be inclined to think its all a sham, they have no intention of leaving and they are simply figuring out a way for us to remain in the EU with our (or should that be their) 2 party political system still intact.

To be honest I think you’re crediting MPs with a bit too much strategic nous with that. I think they’re just as chaotic and divided as the public at large. 

[WhiteHorseRam]

5 hours ago, maxjam said:

 

 In a time when we have the weakest Tory government in forever Labour should be streets ahead in the polls.  Maybe if they stopped trying to win the young, progressive vote online, reined themselves in a bit and concentrated on their larger moderate base they might pick up a few more votes?

Totally agree. Labour should be over the hills and far away in the polls. I know they are unreliable but the general shift should be well in Labour's favour.

I think Corby had his 'Trump breakthrough moment' at the the last GE, and he's now blown it. A GE right now i think would leave us with almost the same mix of seat numbers as right now .... but the turn out would be amazingly low.

He has done NOTHING to recapture Scotland from the SNP and without those seats its really just down to Maths. He is Marmite and I can't see him taking Northampton South, Burton, Worcester - all those places you have to win.

The BBC guy would read out the exit poll prediction at 10pm, it would all start to come true, and from 3am onwards Labour would begin to disintegrate as a party as the finger-pointing started.

[WhiteHorseRam]

18 hours ago, StivePesley said:

You realise that the BBC Comedy and Drama outputs are separate to their news function though. I totally agree that the BBC comedy is generally left of centre (but then isn't most comedy. The problem with right wing comedy is that it isn't funny)

Their news though. Different matter. Laura Keunessberg was found guilty of breaching the impartiality guidelines in a report she did on Corbyn. Her ability to paint Theresa May in a positive light despite everything is astonishing. Her predecessor Nick Robinson was the chair of the Conservatives club at Oxford University, Andrew Neil used to work for the Conservative party. Robbie Gibb left his role as BBC Politics Today editor to become Theresa May's Comms director (and has now been outed by Nick Boles as an arch hard-brexiteer!)

 

I love the BBC to be honest. At least they have a delve.

You will know when they have been completely taken over the by the Right when the news becomes just Harry and Meghan, cats up trees and house prices going up and down.

The evening schedule being typically - Football - Rom Com film - Reality TV show - (enter name of group here) Do the funniest things - Football - Reality TV show with some snogging - Football highlights - Big Fat (enter name of group here) Wedding - Weather presented by ex-Reality TV show 'star.'.

[maxjam]

BBC video from yesterday talking about the rise of UKIP and The Brexit Party - which given the current impasse is understandable.

Interestingly though, and the reason for me posting the video, at 4m30m they highlight a poll (yup, polls are unreliable but if its good enough for the BBC!) it looks like most of the UKIP votes are being taken from Labour (25%) as the Tories (50%) are holding steady. 

Either Labour are doing an even worse job than the Tories of handling Brexit or as mentioned in my previous post moderates aren't buying into the progressive agenda.  Whatever, a weak opposition is helping to prolong the crisis ☹️

[ariotofmyown]

7 hours ago, maxjam said:

Interesting article in the NY Times on social media and democrat voters;

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/04/08/upshot/democratic-electorate-twitter-real-life.html

I could explain it but Tim Pool does it better than me; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMbFtPgOEe8

In short, the progressive wing of the democrat party dominate social media and are driving the democrat agenda because they are basically shouting the loudest - despite being less than 10% of the voter base.  Conservatives that push back are being removed from platforms and Moderates don't engage which is allowing the far left to run riot.

I know its America but there are parallels with the UKs social media usage and Labours move to the left.  In a time when we have the weakest Tory government in forever Labour should be streets ahead in the polls.  Maybe if they stopped trying to win the young, progressive vote online, reined themselves in a bit and concentrated on their larger moderate base they might pick up a few more votes?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jun/09/digital-strategists-give-victory-to-labour-in-social-media-election-facebook-twitter

The mostly right-wing media has painted Corbyn as some sort of far left Communist whereas the last election manifesto was perfectably reasonable and won traditional Tory seats in Remain areas.

One of Labour's biggest problems has been anti-Semitism and Corbyn's handling of the issue. Not really a case of chasing young progressive votes. They probably haven't been progressive enough.

Most people in the UK would be better off under the manifesto Labour stood on in last election. Corbyn's failing is that he hasn't been able to communicate that effectively to enough people.

He also the wrong type of leader in the public cycle on always wanting the opposite

Major...boring, we need someone with charisma

Blair...all spin, we want someone to get on with the job

Brown...boring, we need someone with charisma

Cameron, all spin, we want someone to get on with the job

May...boring, we need someone with  charisma

Next...not Corbyn he's too boring.

Interestingly, Major and Brown are reasonably respected voices now whereas Blair and Cameron are hated.

In terms of next leader, fortunately Johnson is already hated. Not many charismatic politicians knocking about that could get broad support. Ken Clarke perhaps? The cupboard's bare.

[Curtains]

We are now being humiliated by the EU 

 

[Stive Pesley]

49 minutes ago, Curtains said:

We are now being humiliated by the EU 

 

It's like that time I got drunk at mt Nan's party and took all my clothes off and then was sick all over myself. And then soiled myself.

My Nan really humiliated me that day

[Curtains]

Things is our politicians are hopeless. 

[McRamFan]

53 minutes ago, Curtains said:

We are continuing to humiliate ourselves to the EU 

 

FTFY

Regardless of remain or leave camp, this pitiful excuse of a PM will go down in history as an utter failure, and will possibly be the architect of the dismantlement of the Tory party.  Even Neville Chamberlain got to the stage that he knew he could not cope and resigned to let Churchill take over, even though Labour had the majority.

She needs to let it go, parliament has already taken over from her on two occasions, no deal is virtually off the table, unless the EU decide that they what to kick us out, more and more MP's, Unions, Industrialists and gen public are demanding a vote on the deal and don't forget there is a huge legal challenge that can be brought and enough evidence to make the vote null and void.

[Curtains]

29 minutes ago, McRamFan said:

FTFY

Regardless of remain or leave camp, this pitiful excuse of a PM will go down in history as an utter failure, and will possibly be the architect of the dismantlement of the Tory party.  Even Neville Chamberlain got to the stage that he knew he could not cope and resigned to let Churchill take over, even though Labour had the majority.

She needs to let it go, parliament has already taken over from her on two occasions, no deal is virtually off the table, unless the EU decide that they what to kick us out, more and more MP's, Unions, Industrialists and gen public are demanding a vote on the deal and don't forget there is a huge legal challenge that can be brought and enough evidence to make the vote null and void.

We should have left without a deal. 

Now we are being humiliated by the EU. 

We are left to begging the EU. 

Another referendum will be the same result. 

[Curtains]

Another year what will that achieve.

I mean really ! 

[Curtains]

EU will make us have the Euro now 

 

Thats fun 

[Curtains]

Do you know what the situation is so bad now regarding us taking part in the Euro elections and not having a say in anything for years and the possibility of another referendum and all the heartache that brings we should just revoke. 

Thats from a leaver who can’t abide the EU. 

The whole Brexit project has been destroyed.

May needs to go now and I’m a Tory. 

[McRamFan]

12 minutes ago, Curtains said:

We should have left without a deal. 

Now we are being humiliated by the EU. 

We are left to begging the EU. 

Another referendum will be the same result. 

That is like being married for 40 years, then just leaving the house with just the shirt on your back, no wallet, no phone, no bank cards and no money.  The only people that want no deal, and will not suffer, are the tax avoiders.  JRM and his crisis capitalist company in the Caymans, and Dyson moving to Singapore - who now have a 0 tariff trade deal with Europe...

No the EU listened and agreed to the May deal.  They are sticking to what they agreed to.  May pitched a dog's dinner and the EU said, if you are sure you want that, then fine, however you have to stick to it, as we don't want to play ping pong.  Can't blame them, there are 27 other countries to bear in mind.

Nope, wrong, no one is begging for anything,  How can we be?  We are leaving.  However it is not apparent that a lot of people where lied to.  Already the NHS is suffering, go look at the fruit farmer video, he voted leave, and now he is fundamentally out of business.

You do not know that.

7 minutes ago, Curtains said:

EU will make us have the Euro now 

 

Thats fun 

That is BS from Esther McVey.  We have opted out of having the Euro, and have done for a long time.  To opt in would need a referendum, and I am pretty sure keeping the £ would win.  However if we did opt to have the Euro, there is no downside that I can see.  Be a lot harder for the tax avoiders and money launders that rinse their cash through London.

[eddie]

3 hours ago, WhiteHorseRam said:

Totally agree. Labour should be over the hills and far away in the polls. I know they are unreliable but the general shift should be well in Labour's favour.

I think Corby had his 'Trump breakthrough moment' at the the last GE, and he's now blown it. A GE right now i think would leave us with almost the same mix of seat numbers as right now .... but the turn out would be amazingly low.

He has done NOTHING to recapture Scotland from the SNP and without those seats its really just down to Maths. He is Marmite and I can't see him taking Northampton South, Burton, Worcester - all those places you have to win.

The BBC guy would read out the exit poll prediction at 10pm, it would all start to come true, and from 3am onwards Labour would begin to disintegrate as a party as the finger-pointing started.

Scotland voted 2:1 in favour of remaining in the EU and since then, opinions have hardened still further. Both Labour and Conservatives could well be pretty well wiped out in a general election North of the border.