Stuniverse Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 It's not about the league position for me or what my expectations were in the summer. We were second going into the January transfer window and messed it up. We made ourselves worse while everybody else chasing automatic promotion strengthened. But, most of all, it's about 16 points from our last 16 matches - that's relegation form! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tibbs Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 hour ago, GadFly said: Who'd have been happy with a 6th/7th place finish before a ball was kicked this season? Are we going to finish 6th/7th on this form?? More like 11th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GadFly Posted April 21, 2018 Author Share Posted April 21, 2018 8 minutes ago, Stuartsays said: most of all, it's about 16 points from our last 16 matches - that's relegation form! It's not really. It is a bit ****, but it's not relegation form. A point per game would probably see you safe at the end of the season, just. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrimsbyRam Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 17 minutes ago, philmycock said: Is that English? Autocorrect fans* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete2 Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 14 minutes ago, GadFly said: It's not really. It is a bit ****, but it's not relegation form. A point per game would probably see you safe at the end of the season, just. Not usually... 50 points is needed for safety. Anyway we are cr@p at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Kevin Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Simsy said: A 6th I would have snapped your hand up. A 7th I would have been content with... a 7th now though however I would be gutted How you going to feel when we finish 10th? . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottsRam77 Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 hour ago, RIMBAUD said: I went into the season with no expectation whatsoever. This was based on some rather dispiriting performances last season and an acknowledgement that we are in a transitional phase of our development. The league position we have attained has been excellent at times but it’s where we finish that is important. I really want us to be successful but I really don’t enjoy the way we play. Recent performances have made some people angry. I am merely overwhelmed with utter apathy. This ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth's left foot Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 League placing is irrelevant at the moment, it’s the nosedive in form, lack of tempo and Gary buying absolute dross like Jerome rather than say a young upcoming league one striker. He said he wasn’t going to sign Premier league players on their way down but he’s joined past managers in signing has beens. Cardiff will turn us over, at least we can start planning for the summer then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottsRam77 Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 hour ago, TommyPowel said: Surely its the managers advise that count where length of contracts are concerned? Honestly, I don't think it is at all a manager will say that he wants player A, after u would hope some scouting etc etc.Although going by some of our signings I'm not sure we ever did. its then passed to the powers that be aka the chief exec, director football or head of football operations to go out and broker the deal with the targets club and agent. managers do meet the players to try and sell their ideas and their vision, u would hope they might possibly discuss how they see that player fitting into their plans although clement certainly didn't when he signed Blackman as a wide man when the player very deffinitivly said on radio he saw himself as a central player. but the numbers and wages and contract details are negotiated by the clubs dedicated money men think Sam rush and Daniel levy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Sheriff Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 13 minutes ago, King Kevin said: How you going to feel when we finish 10th? . 7th or 10th makes no difference to me to be honest at this stage. Pre season I expected 10th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TobyWanKenobi Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 hour ago, GadFly said: Who'd have been happy with a 6th/7th place finish before a ball was kicked this season? Happy with 6th, unhappy with 7th. Next question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Kevin Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 Just now, Simsy said: 7th or 10th makes no difference to me to be honest at this stage. Pre season I expected 10th. So did I to be fair ,as I have always thought we had a non existent midfield and a rookie manager . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottsRam77 Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 7 minutes ago, Seth's left foot said: League placing is irrelevant at the moment, it’s the nosedive in form, lack of tempo and Gary buying absolute dross like Jerome rather than say a young upcoming league one striker. He said he wasn’t going to sign Premier league players on their way down but he’s joined past managers in signing has beens. Cardiff will turn us over, at least we can start planning for the summer then. Have to say I do support rowett but ypuvr nailed that. agree totally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BramcoteRam84 Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 Definitely wasn’t expecting playoffs. Expected a transition season. The season still isn’t over but even if we sneak into the top 6, you have to say on balance we haven’t moved forward from last season. We’re going to get a similar number of points and like last season the football hasn’t been inspiring. In a transition season you want to see evidence that we’re building towards something, working to a clear strategy. I think we saw that with the defensive solidity and steel added to this team, very evident in the first half of the season. We also started to score goals. It wasn’t free flowing football but it was efficient, effective and clinical. At times it was decent to watch. It was no fluke that we were second at Christmas. Since Christmas, we haven’t been the same. Either teams have worked us out or the legs have gone in the older players. I think it’s a bit of both but either way, We’re scratching around for form, we haven’t managed to kick on and the result is the season is likely to fizzle out into disappointment. Back to the strategy, I think it’s clear how Rowett wants to play. Defensively solid, aggression in both defence and attack, be ruthless in both boxes, do the simple things well. Very much a Burnley type model. However, to be effective in this league you need energy and dynamism as well as power and skill. He talked when he came in about signing players of the right age, think he even said 26 or under. Yet clearly with the exception of Wisdom Lawrence and Palmer, he hasn’t stuck to this policy. In addition, academy players have not come through into the team. As a consequence it all looks a bit tired, a bit pedestrian. Why? Well I think if anyone has seen our financial results it’s clear he’s had to work within a budget, he needed to bring money in (we wouldn’t have been compliant with FFP without selling Hughes and Ince) and his transfer budget has therefore been limited. He’s also inherited a bloated unbalanced squad of players of the wrong age on big wages who haven’t delivered and no one wants. Ability to operate in the transfer market is compromised as a result. So Rowett has the following options, go to the academy, sign bargains who may have potential from championship or lower leagues or sign older names of established quality and experience who have won promotion and could support a promotion push. The academy players were either not ready and needed to go out on loan (Guy Elsnik Vernam), or injured (Lowe, Hanson,Bennett) or only emerged during the season (Thomas). To play these players and to scour the lower leagues for signings this season would be to effectively write off any chances of a promotion push. Would Mel be happy with that? Would the majority of fans be happy with that? Rowett has gone the older proven experienced on short contracts to work within a budget and maintain a promotion push. It’s looks like the latter won’t happen which leads people to question this approach. People can rightly assert his vision and strategy have become muddled and incoherent. I think this is the consequence of him trying to focus on a promotion challenge while balancing the books. In order for this transition season to be the building block for future success in light of the financial constraints, it needs further cuts to the playing squad (possibly even some of Rowett’s own signings) this summer and the academy players to come through alongside the right older experienced players. It will also require some astute signings, most likely free transfers. Should Rowett keep his job and is he the right man to take us forward? Previous managers at this club have been sacked for less! If he lost his job I think he could have few complaints. However whoever comes in will need to work under a budget, and like Rowett and McClaren before him inherit an old bloated ineffective squad on big wages that requires major overhaul with no financial backing. You can question rowett’s approach and strategy but he is proven at achieving relative success on a budget. My view, Rowett has scored par for this season, no more no less, You could argue he should’ve focussed on youth last year and written off this season but we haven’t lost anything as the older players he’s signed are on short contracts. But we haven’t improved either. I think we should let him put the team he wants in place then judge. If we make a change, we need to stick with it for at least 2 seasons, but will it be a strategy around pure football with a squad that can’t play it? Which leads to more square pegs in round holes? And ultimately bigger problems. Whoever is in charge has a hell of a task and will have to hope some academy gems come through to help take us forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelBlimp Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 Where we finish is irrelevant, I thought we'd be between 6th and 10th this year then kick on next season. Trouble is, we don't look like we're anywhere near kicking on do we? That's the problem, no sign of progression, just regression almost everywhere you look, squad quality, transfer budget, attendances. Apathy and pessimism is what I feel and I hate feeling this way about the club I love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ollycutts1982 Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 We look so disjointed up front. We have no cutting edge whatsoever. I like Rowett but he sometimes baffles me with his changes. Vydra was poor today but 2-0 down at home and you take the only goal scorer off. Added to that to them bring Hanson on when we are chasing a game. Jan killed it for me. Jerome and Palmer have had zero impact. Look at Mitrovic and the impact he's had at Fulham or Grabban at Villa. As much as I hate to say it the way we play at times is crying out for a Martin type player. I don't mind us losing but the manner of performance drives me mad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jourdan Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 hour ago, GadFly said: Who'd have been happy with a 6th/7th place finish before a ball was kicked this season? Usually you can say it's not about the journey, it's about the destination if it results in promotion. Will Rowett have that luxury? I think when the journey has been as bad as it has been, the destination becomes immaterial and I don't think it is any surprise that fans are finally showing their frustration. I could understand it if we had taken a 12-hour flight with no legroom, no brandy and a screaming baby, and ended up sat on a beach in the Maldives with Penelope Cruz. Now that you would take. 7th place in the Championship after a season of negative and uninspiring football bears no resemblance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 2 hours ago, GadFly said: Who'd have been happy with a 6th/7th place finish before a ball was kicked this season? Not me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyD Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 2 hours ago, GrimsbyRam said: Have to say the finish tried today too! Can you translate this please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 10 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said: Definitely wasn’t expecting playoffs. Expected a transition season. The season still isn’t over but even if we sneak into the top 6, you have to say on balance we haven’t moved forward from last season. We’re going to get a similar number of points and like last season the football hasn’t been inspiring. In a transition season you want to see evidence that we’re building towards something, working to a clear strategy. I think we saw that with the defensive solidity and steel added to this team, very evident in the first half of the season. We also started to score goals. It wasn’t free flowing football but it was efficient, effective and clinical. At times it was decent to watch. It was no fluke that we were second at Christmas. Since Christmas, we haven’t been the same. Either teams have worked us out or the legs have gone in the older players. I think it’s a bit of both but either way, We’re scratching around for form, we haven’t managed to kick on and the result is the season is likely to fizzle out into disappointment. Back to the strategy, I think it’s clear how Rowett wants to play. Defensively solid, aggression in both defence and attack, be ruthless in both boxes, do the simple things well. Very much a Burnley type model. However, to be effective in this league you need energy and dynamism as well as power and skill. He talked when he came in about signing players of the right age, think he even said 26 or under. Yet clearly with the exception of Wisdom Lawrence and Palmer, he hasn’t stuck to this policy. In addition, academy players have not come through into the team. As a consequence it all looks a bit tired, a bit pedestrian. Why? Well I think if anyone has seen our financial results it’s clear he’s had to work within a budget, he needed to bring money in (we wouldn’t have been compliant with FFP without selling Hughes and Ince) and his transfer budget has therefore been limited. He’s also inherited a bloated unbalanced squad of players of the wrong age on big wages who haven’t delivered and no one wants. Ability to operate in the transfer market is compromised as a result. So Rowett has the following options, go to the academy, sign bargains who may have potential from championship or lower leagues or sign older names of established quality and experience who have won promotion and could support a promotion push. The academy players were either not ready and needed to go out on loan (Guy Elsnik Vernam), or injured (Lowe, Hanson,Bennett) or only emerged during the season (Thomas). To play these players and to scour the lower leagues for signings this season would be to effectively write off any chances of a promotion push. Would Mel be happy with that? Would the majority of fans be happy with that? Rowett has gone the older proven experienced on short contracts to work within a budget and maintain a promotion push. It’s looks like the latter won’t happen which leads people to question this approach. People can rightly assert his vision and strategy have become muddled and incoherent. I think this is the consequence of him trying to focus on a promotion challenge while balancing the books. In order for this transition season to be the building block for future success in light of the financial constraints, it needs further cuts to the playing squad (possibly even some of Rowett’s own signings) this summer and the academy players to come through alongside the right older experienced players. It will also require some astute signings, most likely free transfers. Should Rowett keep his job and is he the right man to take us forward? Previous managers at this club have been sacked for less! If he lost his job I think he could have few complaints. However whoever comes in will need to work under a budget, and like Rowett and McClaren before him inherit an old bloated ineffective squad on big wages that requires major overhaul with no financial backing. You can question rowett’s approach and strategy but he is proven at achieving relative success on a budget. My view, Rowett has scored par for this season, no more no less, You could argue he should’ve focussed on youth last year and written off this season but we haven’t lost anything as the older players he’s signed are on short contracts. But we haven’t improved either. I think we should let him put the team he wants in place then judge. If we make a change, we need to stick with it for at least 2 seasons, but will it be a strategy around pure football with a squad that can’t play it? Which leads to more square pegs in round holes? And ultimately bigger problems. Whoever is in charge has a hell of a task and will have to hope some academy gems come through to help take us forward. Fantastic post. Nice one ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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