Rev Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 As the title says, is it unrealistic to expect Gary Rowett, as a youngish up and coming manager, to improve both the performances and the resulting outcomes of the existing squad to improve our final position? Selling Hughes, to bring in Hudds, Davies and Wisdom I can kind of understand, although I wouldn't have done it myself, but I see it strengthens 3 positions for the sacrifice of one, especially when you add Christie to the mix. Ince also went, for a sizeable amount, and it seems that cash is burning a hole in fans pockets, and we can't seem to wait to spend it whether wisely or not, we want a replacement! Is it possible GR can tease the necessary improvement from the existing players, which he himself publicly doubted in a Radio Derby interview towards the end of last season, or is it not in a managers remit to improve what he already has anymore? If he can't find what he wants this window, I'd rather he used his expertise to tease what what he needs out of the current squad, or as close as he can get, and leave the cash for January reinforcements. Am I asking too much, can no manager improve what he's got in this era? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 8 minutes ago, reveldevil said: As the title says, is it unrealistic to expect Gary Rowett, as a youngish up and coming manager, to improve both the performances and the resulting outcomes of the existing squad to improve our final position? Selling Hughes, to bring in Hudds, Davies and Wisdom I can kind of understand, although I wouldn't have done it myself, but I see it strengthens 3 positions for the sacrifice of one, especially when you add Christie to the mix. Ince also went, for a sizeable amount, and it seems that cash is burning a hole in fans pockets, and we can't seem to wait to spend it whether wisely or not, we want a replacement! Is it possible GR can tease the necessary improvement from the existing players, which he himself publicly doubted in a Radio Derby interview towards the end of last season, or is it not in a managers remit to improve what he already has anymore? If he can't find what he wants this window, I'd rather he used his expertise to tease what what he needs out of the current squad, or as close as he can get, and leave the cash for January reinforcements. Am I asking too much, can no manager improve what he's got in this era? It is possible but my big bone of contention is we have no flair players now Ince and Hughes have gone. Maybe Rowett will get us promoted with these players but I doubt it and I like Gary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 I think he can...whilst we have lost ince,that's more than made up for by Martin's return and Huddlestone will be more influential than Hughes i.m.o. My only concern is Gary's lack of flair in his side's style of play up to now in comparison to Mac's more free flowing teams.... Having said that,its way to early to generalise on that yet after only one game against a relegated premium side and free flowing football together with greater defensive cohesion may well be on its way,given a little time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Kevin Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 We have seen what can be done ie when SM took over from NC you wouldn't believe they were the same players .However GR may prove to be a better manager than SM but he sure ain't a better coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosmic Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 30 minutes ago, reveldevil said: Is it possible GR can tease the necessary improvement from the existing players, which he himself publicly doubted in a Radio Derby interview towards the end of last season, or is it not in a managers remit to improve what he already has anymore? I think this quality is priority when looking for a new manager. Rarely do managers get to come in and be given a war chest to gut the squad in one transfer window and bring in his own team. His main job is to get the team at his disposal playing better than they were. Obviously a good chairman backs his manager to change some personnel around to better fit his vision, but a good manager shouldn't need wholesale changes to get a group of players performing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 By now I would have expected to see a system and a style and some preferences and patterns with him. That's where I get frustrated. In terms of results and targets etc... not so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 45 minutes ago, curtains said: It is possible but my big bone of contention is we have no flair players now Ince and Hughes have gone. Maybe Rowett will get us promoted with these players but I doubt it and I like Gary. Doesn't being the best passer of a ball in the division constitute 'flair' - or does it have to include stepovers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrowram Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 We have an ok side but it needs some star quality which has been sold and not replaced by the incumbent manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 16 minutes ago, eddie said: Doesn't being the best passer of a ball in the division constitute 'flair' - or does it have to include stepovers? You have a point with Huddlestone who I think you are referring too. He does have that extra bit in his game that can get you out of your seat . End of the day I hope Rowett gets us promoted and I think I am just hoping for a bit more flair in the attacking side of our game. I am looking forward to the next 2 home games very much in fact I'm quite excited to see us play at home . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 I think it's unreasonable to expect a team of world beaters when the sum of the parts is far lesser than that. It is however reasonable to want the manager to maximise the performances of the individuals and get 7/10-10/10 from each, and then to get those players into a effective team collective. Rowett perhaps did this excellently at Birmingham, so he has previous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 It is certainly possible to get more out of some players and hence the team, Martin and nugent we know can produce for Derby and Vydra has the talent which we are yet to see and wieman ought to be able to improve on his results for Derby, now in terms of central midfield if Rowett can get Bryson consistent and on the pitch we would become very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve How Hard? Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 It's not unrealistic at all. Ok we've lost two of our shining lights in the sale of Ince and Hughes. However, one area that can be improved is consistency of performance. If he can find a solution to this then we will achieve our ultimate goal. Our end of season capitulations have seriously damaged our aspirations. I think the work GR has put into our fitness levels could go a long way to resolving some of the issues preventing us getting over the line. He has said from day one that our best team is not necessarily the combination of the 11 best individual players. Here's hoping he finds that winning combination. COYR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbydave96 Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 100% think it's reasonable to expect any manager to get more out of this group of players than has been seen in the past year or so. When you look at the plethora of attacking talent available in Martin, Nugent, Vydra, Weimann, Russell, Bennett, Anya, Bent and Blackman, all of those players have the ability to give more than they did last season. All have performed at this level in the past (not Bennett, but he has potential) and only Bent and maybe Nugent are pushing past their prime. Unless we are going to bring someone in who is significantly better than what we have (which seems unlikely with players like Jota etc seemingly out of our reach) then surely the plan has to be to look at the attributes of the players we have, pick a system and try and maximise their output. For example, when Gary first came in we played Vydra in behind Nugent for a few games and he looked really dangerous, not quite sure why we chose to deviate from that (seemed to happen during/after the Fulham game last year). I want to see Gary give a system a go for a few months and try and bring the best form out of these undoubtedly talented players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Willow Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 I am sure Gary Rowett will certainly improve certain aspects of the game such as: overall tactical awareness and positional awareness of the members of the team. He can also work on building more cohesion and partnership between players, but I don't think he can make them much better improved players than they are already. They are mostly finished product in the terms of football development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Sagan Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 Gary talks a good talk but has made several errors. Not picking Hughes when he came in last season was bizarre and Rowett refusing to give Will any guarantees that things would be different this time around inevitably led to Hughes' departure. Selling Hughes, Ince and Christie right at the start of the transfer window and massively underestimating transfer valuations has demonstrably made it difficult to bring in flair replacements. We sell Will for £5m while we're being quoted £15m for Che Adams - go figure. And I'm pretty sure time will tell (not necessarily a lot of time either) that Christie is a far better fullback than Wisdom. It's clear (and no bad thing) that Gary is a huge fan of Johnny Russell and wanted to bring him to Brum. Last season GR preferred to play Johnny behind the central striker putting Vydra out on the wing rather than the other way around. Probably 99% of the forum would have known that to be madness and the team only picked up when Rowett eventually switched their positions. Again, GR played Russell as the central striker of a 3 in a 4-2-3-1 formation at Grimsby. Is it that he can't help himself or were there really no other options? Or is JR going to be a 20 goal man playing there this season after all? Gary said he wanted a much smaller squad. Four players have left but three have come in, but also several have returned from loans meaning the squad appears no smaller. It should be realistic for every manager to improve what he inherits and I see no reason whatsoever why Rowett should be any different. He has Mel's backing (hence selling golden boy Hughes for peanuts) and is at a club with a recent hustory of unfulfilled potential. I want to believe. I think it's too early to judge, but had he put his faith in Hughes then I think we could still have made the other signings and would have had the most skillful midfielder in the league to knit defence and atttack together (as well as the option of going long from Big Tom). That would have been more potent than what we have now. It seems to me that Gary is going for a team of athletes not artisans. The last manager to do that was Billy Davies and he did get us up. All will be fine if Gary is able to deliver the same (which with Mel's backing would lead to a better ultimate outcome). And if he does manage that, Rowett will have improved us. Gary (or Mel?) said we'd be recruiting young hungry players with the potential to gain value and avoiding premier league journeymen looking for one last payday. Two of our three signings have been premier league journeymen looking for one last payday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesertRam Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 Our best chance with the squad we had, was against QPR, we've never reached those heights again. We spent to long trying to recreate the same belief, instead of doing what we are now. Perhaps GR can get the current players to show more determination to win - but we still need a couple more to supply the game winning flair, IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VulcanRam Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 10 hours ago, eddie said: Doesn't being the best passer of a ball in the division constitute 'flair' - or does it have to include stepovers? Depends on what you qualify as passing - playing balls to the same colour shirt yes, banging relentless balls into the channels hoping someone will run after them, no. We saw plenty of both against Sunderland. The ball he played to Russell for the goal was pure quality, but there were plenty of other hit and hopes which were exasperating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kennington Ram Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 I sympathise as we clearly cannot move players on. Some are a clear cancer at this stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry Ram Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 5 hours ago, Carl Sagan said: Gary (or Mel?) said we'd be recruiting young hungry players with the potential to gain value and avoiding premier league journeymen looking for one last payday. Two of our three signings have been premier league journeymen looking for one last payday. Good post.. The last paragraph sums up DCFC for me, just one big contradiction. Everything that comes out of the club should be taken with a pinch of salt. b******* most of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 5 hours ago, Carl Sagan said: We sell Will for £5m £8m rising to £10m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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