Who has the patience?

[Anon]

2 minutes ago, Howard Canitbé said:

I was disappointed to see Clough sacked as I was pleased that the club had shown patience to a manager and allowed him to time to implement his ideas on the club. Everything from top to bottom was Clough at the time of his sacking. 

If you were happy with finishing 3rd, 8th and then 5th, then I assume you've had no complaints at the resolution of the previous 3 seasons? It's very easy to say it was better back then with the benefit of hindsight.

I was perfectly happy after 3rd and 8th and was looking forwards to another season under McClaren. I'll admit in hindsight that I was unfair to Clement. The football was decent enough, but his transfers were bizarre. I was ambivalent about Wassall and wouldn't have been upset if he'd been given the job permanently.

[wixman1884]

I think it's a bit of a stretch to say the previous system didn't work just because we didn't walk what is a very competetive league. We were competing for promotion 3 years in a row, and came pretty damn close even with our u21s manager at the helm.

Since then we've looked significantly worse in every regard after splashing even more money. I don't like Nigel Pearson, certainly didn't want him to come in, and after an embarrassing start to the season would be happy to see the back of him. 

[G STAR RAM]

1 minute ago, Howard Canitbé said:

I think he fired Clement on fan reaction, I think he had plenty of time to consider his next appointment in Pearson and that Wassall was never a permanent solution. All conjecture of course. 

Russell started the majority of the games before the international break, if I remember correctly, and didn't do well. Him aside, would you agree that the attitude of the others has been called into question on occasion? It appears Pearson agrees.

Yes I would agree with that, however performances and results are more important than perceived attitude to me!

[Howard Canitbé]

4 minutes ago, wixman1884 said:

I think it's a bit of a stretch to say the previous system didn't work just because we didn't walk what is a very competetive league. We were competing for promotion 3 years in a row, and came pretty damn close even with our u21s manager at the helm.

Since then we've looked significantly worse in every regard after splashing even more money. I don't like Nigel Pearson, certainly didn't want him to come in, and after an embarrassing start to the season would be happy to see the back of him. 

We splashed a lot more money last season and came close with two different managers, our net spend this season is a lot lower and we've not given Pearson even half the number of competitive games either Clement or Wassall had. 

The system worked to an extent, but the whole point was to achieve promotion and we didn't do that. 

3 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Yes I would agree with that, however performances and results are more important than perceived attitude to me!

I believe that attitude, performance and subsequently results are intrinsically linked and that each follows on from the other. Pearson is moving out players he doesn't believe have the attitude required, performances have, tonight aside, been improving, and results will hopefully follow. 

[sage]

2 minutes ago, wixman1884 said:

I think it's a bit of a stretch to say the previous system didn't work just because we didn't walk what is a very competetive league. We were competing for promotion 3 years in a row, and came pretty damn close even with our u21s manager at the helm.

Since then we've looked significantly worse in every regard after splashing even more money. I don't like Nigel Pearson, certainly didn't want him to come in, and after an embarrassing start to the season would be happy to see the back of him. 

That's my opinion, pretty much word for word.

I think NP was the best manager MM thought he could get and sacrificed The Derby Way to gain promotion. NP will be given more time than he deserves because he has arrived at time when he need stability. I would agree that we need a manager to stay longer than MacClaren and Clement, but only if he is taking us in the right direction.

The next few months will be a real test of MM's nerve.    

[Sparkle]

I do not believe we will be relagated

i do not believe Pearson will get the boot

i do not believe we will get in the top six ( still capable)

people keep saying 433 never worked - well it got us the the top 6 every year with these players

cureently the way we are going whatever system we are trying or not trying we are looking at bottom 6 or half way.

[Howard Canitbé]

1 minute ago, sage said:

That's my opinion, pretty much word for word.

I think NP was the best manager MM thought he could get and sacrificed The Derby Way to gain promotion. NP will be given more time than he deserves because he has arrived at time when he need stability. I would agree that we need a manager to stay longer than MacClaren and Clement, but only if he is taking us in the right direction.

The next few months will be a real test of MM's nerve.    

The problem with McClaren was that he plainly had ambitions beyond DCFC, and there was no point forcing him to stay against his wishes. Clement wasn't given the time because MM was apparently trigger happy at the time. 

[Rev]

2 minutes ago, Howard Canitbé said:

We splashed a lot more money last season and came close with two different managers, our net spend this season is a lot lower and we've not given Pearson even half the number of competitive games either Clement or Wassall had. 

The system worked to an extent, but the whole point was to achieve promotion and we didn't do that. 

I believe that attitude, performance and subsequently results are intrinsically linked and that each follows on from the other. Pearson is moving out players he doesn't believe have the attitude required, performances have, tonight aside, been improving, and results will hopefully follow. 

Performances have improved from absolutely dreadful to underwhelming under Pearson.

From a base of of top 6 performances, I'd say that's not great.

[uttoxram75]

1 minute ago, reveldevil said:

Performances have improved from absolutely dreadful to underwhelming under Pearson.

From a base of of top 6 performances, I'd say that's not great.

Maybe we'll finish a season strongly?

[G STAR RAM]

4 minutes ago, Howard Canitbé said:

I believe that attitude, performance and subsequently results are intrinsically linked and that each follows on from the other. Pearson is moving out players he doesn't believe have the attitude required, performances have, tonight aside, been improving, and results will hopefully follow. 

All well and good but why leave it so long to do it?

While performances are improving they are still light years away from where we previously were. 

[Howard Canitbé]

4 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

I do not believe we will be relagated

i do not believe Pearson will get the boot

i do not believe we will get in the top six ( still capable)

people keep saying 433 never worked - well it got us the the top 6 every year with these players

cureently the way we are going whatever system we are trying or not trying we are looking at bottom 6 or half way.

Tbh it all boils down to whether you are happy to try the same thing year after year and experience the same shortcomings that fail to get us promoted. I personally don't see the point of finishing in the same place every year and being satisfied with it provided we play pretty football in 1/3 games. 

I don't think we've been that good since 13/14, barring the odd game here and there. We never achieved the same heights of performance, and that's reflected in our lower league standings in the two subsequent years. 

[Ambitious]

I don't have any problem with Mel appointing Pearson. As nice as it was under McClaren, Mel needed to appoint someone to come in and put their own stamp on the club. Improve what he had and take us to the next level.

Understandably, for Pearson, this comes with its own expectations. 

The absolute bare minimum for him has to be the play-offs. Under NO circumstances should he be allowed to take a team with 240 points from their previous 138 games - 1.74 points per game, 80 points per season average - and take them backwards. 

I've said it a few times now, but I don't think you could have paid Pearson to do a worse job up to this point, well, short of playing without a goalkeeper. He's truly been a nightmare.

Let's just see where he takes us. I'd be beyond surprised with a top half finish at the moment though. 

[rammieib]

Quite simply, the lack of creativity and strength in the middle of the pitch mean we no longer have the personnel to conduct the tactics and formations employed by the coach.

We are desperately missing Thorne, which we knew and didn't address, and who knows if he will get fit.

A centre mid pairing of Bryson and Hughes hasn't worked. 2'goals in 8 show that.

I think for me the biggest concern is Pearson trying to do it his way without addressing the positions that need addressing.

Mid table mediocrity is the best we can hope for and after the past few seasons, that's quite depressing,

[Rev]

7 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

Maybe we'll finish a season strongly?

I'm a drowning man, and you've just pointed out some driftwood!

Probably get ate by sharks swimming to it, mind.

[Reverend]

Anyone remember the Jim Smith promotion? If I remember correctly we started that year badly with a team of so called "stars" expensively assembled. After 13 odd games we only had 15 points and we almost bottom 3. THen we bought an unknown Croatian and went on a 21 match unbeaten run and eventually got promotion.

Its FAR too early to be even thinking of sacking Pearson. Jeez, give the man a chance. And yes, I am disappointed by the spineless, useless performances so far but I think that shows the players are not good enough. Decide on Pearson when its his team - I remember many wanted Jim Smith out too - luckily they didn't get their way.

[uttoxram75]

11 minutes ago, reveldevil said:

I'm a drowning man, and you've just pointed out some driftwood!

Probably get ate by sharks swimming to it, mind.

 

[JaguarRam]

 

[Sparkle]

31 minutes ago, Howard Canitbé said:

Tbh it all boils down to whether you are happy to try the same thing year after year and experience the same shortcomings that fail to get us promoted. I personally don't see the point of finishing in the same place every year and being satisfied with it provided we play pretty football in 1/3 games. 

I don't think we've been that good since 13/14, barring the odd game here and there. We never achieved the same heights of performance, and that's reflected in our lower league standings in the two subsequent years. 

Yes you are right we didn't hit the heights of 13/14 barring the odd game and we still made the top six, if we could see real progress that would be something.

[Howard Canitbé]

16 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

Yes you are right we didn't hit the heights of 13/14 barring the odd game and we still made the top six, if we could see real progress that would be something.

But McClaren had a full season to progress and we finished outside the play-offs. Not exactly progress was it, despite the same system and manager?

[PodgeyRam]

11 minutes ago, Howard Canitbé said:

But McClaren had a full season to progress and we finished outside the play-offs. Not exactly progress was it, despite the same system and manager?

We did make progress of a sort. The style changed slightly, but we were still a nice team to watch. I think we were a bit more savvy in our energy use than in the past, but we were still on course to bet our points total from the previous season before Buxton, Martin, Bent, Grant, Eustace and Mascarell got injured. Not to mention that Thorne wasn't fit either.