Raul Albentosa to Betis

[Jordy]

Is it any wonder he's never looked good considering the games he's been involved in? 

Derby 2 - 0 Chesterfield

Derby 2 - 2 Birmingham
Norwich 1 - 1 Derby
Derby 0 - 1 Middlesborough
Wolves 2 - 0 Derby
Wigan 0 - 2 Derby
Derby 1 - 1 Brentford
Millwall 3 - 3 Derby
Derby 0 - 3 Reading

He's only been involved in two wins, neither against good sides, so as a defender it's going to be really difficult to put in a good performance when you've never played well with that team.

During those games, there were very few good Derby performances by anyone. Imagine if we were judging Forsyth, Christie, Hendrick, Grant, Keogh, Buxton etc purely on games from late January onwards? Bear in mind towards the end of the season we only won two games (both of which were against teams which got relegated). Albentosa is yet to have the chance to play in a confident Derby team which goes on to win a game against a half decent championship club, that could be all it takes.

[richinspain]

Se trata de un central de gran de envergadura, muy agresivo en la marca, nada lento pese a su altura y especialista en el juego aéreo, aunque tiene ciertas limitaciones con el balón en los pies.

From that article in the op

"he is a big centre half, a very aggressive marker, not at all slow despite his height and a specialist in aerial play, although he has got certain limitations with the ball at his feet"

Doesn't sound like the Raul that we signed. Maybe there is hope!

[Albert]

Is it any wonder he's never looked good considering the games he's been involved in? 

Derby 2 - 0 Chesterfield

Derby 2 - 2 Birmingham
Norwich 1 - 1 Derby
Derby 0 - 1 Middlesborough
Wolves 2 - 0 Derby
Wigan 0 - 2 Derby
Derby 1 - 1 Brentford
Millwall 3 - 3 Derby
Derby 0 - 3 Reading

He's only been involved in two wins, neither against good sides, so as a defender it's going to be really difficult to put in a good performance when you've never played well with that team.

During those games, there were very few good Derby performances by anyone. Imagine if we were judging Forsyth, Christie, Hendrick, Grant, Keogh, Buxton etc purely on games from late January onwards? Bear in mind towards the end of the season we only won two games (both of which were against teams which got relegated). Albentosa is yet to have the chance to play in a confident Derby team which goes on to win a game against a half decent championship club, that could be all it takes.

​This is exactly the thing. People have written off a defender who looks class in a much better league than our own, because he struggled to perform on his non-preferred side, while seemingly carrying an injury, after leaving his previous team, while the rest of the side was in meltdown. You shouldn't judge a player on a handful of games, and to judge him on that handful of games is completely laughable. 

I hope he's given time to have a good preseason and a real crack at it next season, because he is the kind of player who could end up doing very well for us. 

[sage]

​This is exactly the thing. People have written off a defender who looks class in a much better league than our own, because he struggled to perform on his non-preferred side, while seemingly carrying an injury, after leaving his previous team, while the rest of the side was in meltdown. You shouldn't judge a player on a handful of games, and to judge him on that handful of games is completely laughable. 

I hope he's given time to have a good preseason and a real crack at it next season, because he is the kind of player who could end up doing very well for us. 

​Would accept £600k? £800k? £1m?

[RIMBAUD]

To be fair - people can only judge him on what they have seen. Whether or not that is accurate is the issue.

[RIMBAUD]

Perhaps the player himself has decided he doesn't fancy it here. (?)

[robglosta]

​This is exactly the thing. People have written off a defender who looks class in a much better league than our own, because he struggled to perform on his non-preferred side, while seemingly carrying an injury, after leaving his previous team, while the rest of the side was in meltdown. You shouldn't judge a player on a handful of games, and to judge him on that handful of games is completely laughable. 

I hope he's given time to have a good preseason and a real crack at it next season, because he is the kind of player who could end up doing very well for us. 

​This. 

[Albert]

​Would accept £600k? £800k? £1m?

It depends entirely on how much it would take to bring someone in of similar quality in his role. The going rate for a good to top centrehalf at this level is in excess of £1.5 million at this point, so factoring in the costs of transfers (agents, etc.) I'd be looking at the £1.6-2 million mark. That of course depends on what the backroom team think of him. If they reckon they got a real duffer and want him gone, they could try to let him go at cost. If they think he's looked brilliant in training and will be class next season then £3 million+ might be short of the mark to get him. 

At the end of the day it's up to Paul and the team to decide who they want. ​If they don't want him, and other teams are interested, I can image him moving on, but we'll see what eventuates. 
 

To be fair - people can only judge him on what they have seen. Whether or not that is accurate is the issue.

​If I've seen next to nothing on something, I'd be keeping my mouth shut and seeing what happens. Just because someone has seen something doesn't mean it's enough to draw conclusions, and we certainly haven't seen Raul in a fair context to judge at this point. I wouldn't go around going "he's the best in the league", but equally the criticism leveled against him is premature to say the least. 

[cannable]

Did anybody watch the Norwich game (away obviously)? Raul was a rock that day and would have won MOTM if Hanson hadn't have made his debut. I think the reason he played so well was because we were defending for 90 minutes and not getting hit on the break every now and again, which he struggles with due to his mobility. I'm guessing that during his time at Eibar he'd have had many games where they were being pinned back in their own halves, heading and kicking anything in sight, which is probably why he looked so impressive as that kind of game suits him. I've not given up hope yet but I do agree with the majority that think he's underwhelmed thus far. 

​THIS

 

I just don't think he's the type of centre-half we're looking for. I bet Albentosa would have looked quality in Billy's promotion side.

[RIMBAUD]

It depends entirely on how much it would take to bring someone in of similar quality in his role. The going rate for a good to top centrehalf at this level is in excess of £1.5 million at this point, so factoring in the costs of transfers (agents, etc.) I'd be looking at the £1.6-2 million mark. That of course depends on what the backroom team think of him. If they reckon they got a real duffer and want him gone, they could try to let him go at cost. If they think he's looked brilliant in training and will be class next season then £3 million+ might be short of the mark to get him. 

At the end of the day it's up to Paul and the team to decide who they want. ​If they don't want him, and other teams are interested, I can image him moving on, but we'll see what eventuates. 
 

​If I've seen next to nothing on something, I'd be keeping my mouth shut and seeing what happens. Just because someone has seen something doesn't mean it's enough to draw conclusions, and we certainly haven't seen Raul in a fair context to judge at this point. I wouldn't go around going "he's the best in the league", but equally the criticism leveled against him is premature to say the least. 

​Have you formed an opinion of him?

[Albert]

​Have you formed an opinion of him?

​Not really. From what I've seen he's not been fully fit, and tactically our weaknesses defensively seem to come from further up the field, and to such an extent that you could have thrown John Terry in there in the run we were in, and he'd have likely looked poor. 

I'll be very interested to see what he looks like after a preseason. 

[RIMBAUD]

Albert, I agree with your assessment.

(But people are forming an opinion, aren't they? Even on the little they have seen and I reckon that's ok.)

[eddie]

Albert, I agree with your assessment.

(But people are forming an opinion, aren't they? Even on the little they have seen and I reckon that's ok.)

​Opinions, even based on first impressions, are fine.

What gets my goat is when people are sticking their fingers in their ears shouting 'lalalala', keeping their eyes tightly closed and refusing to acknowledge that they might have been a teensy bit premature in their judgement for the next five years despite evidence which conflicts with said first impressions.

Exhibit A, Bucko.

[Albert]

​Opinions, even based on first impressions, are fine.

What gets my goat is when people are sticking their fingers in their ears shouting 'lalalala', keeping their eyes tightly closed and refusing to acknowledge that they might have been a teensy bit premature in their judgement for the next five years despite evidence which conflicts with said first impressions.

Exhibit A, Bucko.

​Good ol' people with Bucko. The number of times people have said "he was rubbish until [insert any random period of time they feel like at the time]" does get annoying. He didn't look out of place even on his debut for the club, and the only times he ever, and I mean ever, looked poor was when he was either carrying an injury, or coming back from one. And he's had a few since coming here, but has otherwise always been at worst solid, and at best arguably our best defender. 

The problem is that defender's jobs are so reliant on the structure in front of them, and one match winning tackle generally isn't enough to swing opinion, like a match winning goal. I always find it funny that Bucko's winner against Forest did more to shift many's opinions than seasons of good performances ever could. 

It's going to be very interesting to see how we shape up next season. I still think a lot of the "defensive woes" that people thought we had come down ultimately to how we played, and the sore lack of a Eustace or Thorne in the deep midfield role at times last season. Without that role, playing as we did was always going to leave gaps and let players run at centrehalves. To put it bluntly, it doesn't matter who the centrehalves are, you're not meant to have players running at them one on one as often as our style allowed. 

Hopefully we'll have Thorne back ready and raring to go, and a full set of centrehalves to choose from. 

[SouthernRam]

If losing Albentosa was the expense of getting in a quality, first team leader at the back - potentially who knows the league - then I'd be happy with that (in my opinion)

[Dimmu]

He did the basics so well that I'd be intrigued to see what he could do now, playing week in week out

[Gary Teale]

Warnock had played for England and shotten played in the prem, just because a player has played in a good league doesn't mean anything, he only did half a season in the top flight in Spain. I base a player on what I see I couldn't care less where he came from, reputation or how much he cost. Up to now he has looked woeful for me if I'm honest, he may turn out to be a great player no one knows but he hasn't shown any good attributes thus far. He may be unhappy but it's never stopped anyone I've seen be able to tackle, read the game or just go even go and win his headers. 

[i-Ram]

​Opinions, even based on first impressions, are fine.

What gets my goat is when people are sticking their fingers in their ears shouting 'lalalala', keeping their eyes tightly closed and refusing to acknowledge that they might have been a teensy bit premature in their judgement for the next five years despite evidence which conflicts with said first impressions.

Exhibit A, Bucko.

Exhibit B, Bucko falling out with MacLaren (perhaps or perhaps not involving a coffee cup) and the latter then losing the dressing room because of his refusal to totally deny any interest in Mike Cashley's Newcy Dollar.

[MuespachRam]

Is it any wonder he's never looked good considering the games he's been involved in? 

Derby 2 - 0 Chesterfield

Derby 2 - 2 Birmingham
Norwich 1 - 1 Derby
Derby 0 - 1 Middlesborough
Wolves 2 - 0 Derby
Wigan 0 - 2 Derby
Derby 1 - 1 Brentford
Millwall 3 - 3 Derby
Derby 0 - 3 Reading

He's only been involved in two wins, neither against good sides, so as a defender it's going to be really difficult to put in a good performance when you've never played well with that team.

During those games, there were very few good Derby performances by anyone. Imagine if we were judging Forsyth, Christie, Hendrick, Grant, Keogh, Buxton etc purely on games from late January onwards? Bear in mind towards the end of the season we only won two games (both of which were against teams which got relegated). Albentosa is yet to have the chance to play in a confident Derby team which goes on to win a game against a half decent championship club, that could be all it takes.

​OR you could say that the reason we lost all those games was BECAUSE we played him....?

Rubbish player, cant play football, the sooner we are shot of him the better, what was Stevie thinking buying this carthorse.?? no wonder they sacekd him!

[YorkshireRam]

​OR you could say that the reason we lost all those games was BECAUSE we played him....?

Rubbish player, cant play football, the sooner we are shot of him the better, what was Stevie thinking buying this carthorse.?? no wonder they sacekd him!

​Do you really believe that?

Albentosa played relatively well in those games, certainly was not at fault for any of the goals...

I really don't understand your desire to sell him when he's only played a limited amount of games, especially when he has played okay.

He's a highly rated player, surely we should give him this season where he can get a run of consistent games before making a verdict on him?