Boxing Thread

[Comrade 86]

7/5 Woodley? Having some of that. Hope this proves worth the late night!!

[Comrade 86]

Bit close for comfort that was! 

[Alph]

3 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

Keith Thurman wins SD.

116-112, 115-113, 113-115

I can't believe the decision. Thurman schooled Garcia. I had him winning 8 of the first 10 rounds (with the others barely anything in it). He gave the last two rounds away knowing he was well ahead. I can't believe one of the judges scored it towards Garcia. He wasn't even the aggressor despite being behind throughout.

Thurman's movement is sublime. Defensively he's a rock, and he's got a mean uppercut. Thought he was going to end it within the first two rounds as he rocked Garcia with some huge punches.

Credit Garcia though. Better defensively than he's given credit for, and he's got a solid chin. But how on earth a judge called him to win. He was far too tentative throughout the fight. Didn't want to engage.

Crazy stuff. But judges see different things, prefer different styles. It's weird. I get those favouring a more aggressive style, but Garcia rarely showed any aggression. What could he have seen to award him 7 rounds?

 

Not watched it yet.  That's tonight sorted.

What a weekend!

[The_Sheriff]

Would Thurman beat brook? 

[Bris Vegas]

26 minutes ago, Simsy said:

Would Thurman beat brook? 

IMO Thurman is the most gifted Welterweight in the world.

His recent fights have only been close because he has a habit of easing off for the last few rounds. He's incredibly intelligent, in and out of the ring, and that helps.

He has the same thought process in the ring as Floyd Mayweather. He knows that if he doesn't knock his opponent out, then just make sure he wins seven of the 12 rounds. That's all you need. Seven rounds.

In most of his recent fights, he has won 7/8 of the first 10 then just coasts the last two. I don't think he will do that again though as his last two fights were scored much closer than they should have been.

Brook andThurman are the strongest welters out there. It's all in the legs. Both are really stong. Brook has a better one-two, but what edges it for me is Thurman's movement. It's superb.

Welter has some great fighters though. They're going through a golden generation in that weight class with so many decent names out there.

Pacquiao, Khan, Brook, Thurman, Porter, Garcia, Berto, Errol Spence, Timothy Bradley, Lamont Peterson, Adrien Broner, Devon Alexander, Lucas Matthysse... Loads of prospects coming through too like Erickson Lubin.

[The_Sheriff]

3 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

IMO Thurman is the most gifted Welterweight in the world.

His recent fights have only been close because he has a habit of easing off for the last few rounds. He's incredibly intelligent, in and out of the ring, and that helps.

He has the same thought process in the ring as Floyd Mayweather. He knows that if he doesn't knock his opponent out, then just make sure he wins seven of the 12 rounds. That's all you need. Seven rounds.

In most of his recent fights, he has won 7/8 of the first 10 then just coasts the last two. I don't think he will do that again though as his last two fights were scored much closer than they should have been.

Brook andThurman are the strongest welters out there. It's all in the legs. Both are really stong. Brook has a better one-two, but what edges it for me is Thurman's movement. It's superb.

Welter has some great fighters though. They're going through a golden generation in that weight class with so many decent names out there.

Pacquiao, Khan, Brook, Thurman, Porter, Garcia, Berto, Errol Spence, Timothy Bradley, Lamont Peterson, Adrien Broner, Devon Alexander, Lucas Matthysse... Loads of prospects coming through too like Erickson Lubin.

Yeah it's got to be the best division

[Mostyn6]

I enjoy reading your boxing posts @Bris Vegas 

[Bris Vegas]

3 hours ago, Mostyn6 said:

I enjoy reading your boxing posts @Bris Vegas 

Thanks. Though I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic? I've only really been into boxing for about four/five years but I've grown really fond of the sport and have gotten to meet so many cool people.

Like football, boxing goes quite deep too. So many prospects that fall just short. So many that rise up, have that one chance and once falling short drop way down the ladder.

 Think I've mentioned before but a good friend of mine fought Carl Frampton for the world title on the undercard of Froch/Bute. Since that defeat, his first pro loss, he's never really recovered (ability wise).

He has like 6 losses on his record now. It's disappointing, but it happens.

[Mostyn6]

8 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

Thanks. Though I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic? I've only really been into boxing for about four/five years but I've grown really fond of the sport and have gotten to meet so many cool people.

Like football, boxing goes quite deep too. So many prospects that fall just short. So many that rise up, have that one chance and once falling short drop way down the ladder.

 Think I've mentioned before but a good friend of mine fought Carl Frampton for the world title on the undercard of Froch/Bute. Since that defeat, his first pro loss, he's never really recovered (ability wise).

He has like 6 losses on his record now. It's disappointing, but it happens.

No sarcasm. I've lost love for the sport cos I have the perception that those running the sport are more interested in Pay Per View numbers than boxing ability, and that feels inherently wrong to me. It may have always been this way and I was just oblivious to it, but I'm an idealist and expect integrity. 

I've kind of turned my back on the sport. But reading your posts keep me a little bit in the loop. 

[YouRams]

1 hour ago, Mostyn6 said:

No sarcasm. I've lost love for the sport cos I have the perception that those running the sport are more interested in Pay Per View numbers than boxing ability, and that feels inherently wrong to me. It may have always been this way and I was just oblivious to it, but I'm an idealist and expect integrity. 

I've kind of turned my back on the sport. But reading your posts keep me a little bit in the loop. 

Mostly Eddie Hearn's doing he suckered everyone in putting good fights on, got the buzz back around boxing and is now milking it with pay per views. Saturday was a domestic dust up never a pay per view, I refuse to pay for them and just stream.

[Mostyn6]

1 hour ago, YouRams said:

Mostly Eddie Hearn's doing he suckered everyone in putting good fights on, got the buzz back around boxing and is now milking it with pay per views. Saturday was a domestic dust up never a pay per view, I refuse to pay for them and just stream.

I was annoyed that it wasn't in Ultra HD, considering paid £16

[tomsdubs]

The PPV prices over here are very reasonable compared to the states. Kovalev vs Ward in HD was $70 and the US undercards are garbage. Glad Garcia lost, his dad is one of the biggest tossers out there. Thurman is the real deal and I'm glad he put on a performance and didn't get robbed.

Boxing became my firm #2 sport about 6 years ago. I don't talk about it much online because the keyboard warriors and know it alls are a real annoyance. The way some people talk about boxing is just ridiculous. I've got a ticket to Joshua - Klitschko ticket so will be there, more going for the experience though than expecting a top tier fight. Not sure what Wlad has left and not sure how much credit Joshua will get for a win. Think he needs a spectacular KO to really send out a message that gets him some credit.

[Alph]

3 hours ago, tomsdubs said:

The PPV prices over here are very reasonable compared to the states. Kovalev vs Ward in HD was $70 and the US undercards are garbage. Glad Garcia lost, his dad is one of the biggest tossers out there. Thurman is the real deal and I'm glad he put on a performance and didn't get robbed.

Boxing became my firm #2 sport about 6 years ago. I don't talk about it much online because the keyboard warriors and know it alls are a real annoyance. The way some people talk about boxing is just ridiculous. I've got a ticket to Joshua - Klitschko ticket so will be there, more going for the experience though than expecting a top tier fight. Not sure what Wlad has left and not sure how much credit Joshua will get for a win. Think he needs a spectacular KO to really send out a message that gets him some credit.

The thing with people talking about boxing online, especially twitter, is that they are just bitter

Everyone is a bum. The heavyweight division is a joke. He hasnt fought anyone good, he payed the judges blah blah blah.

There are no bums. There's levels. Like any sport. If these lads are bums then why don't the YouTube ninjas and twitter gangsters go and fight?

"Joshua has only fought tin cans/ Mike Tyson is a legend" - who did Mike Tyson fight in his first 20 fights? No denying he was a scary fighter but take a look who he fought when he was growing. 

You just can't please people. It has the most abusive fans. 

We could have had tickets for Joshua but we can't make it. But it could go down in history as the time a legend passed on the baton to a legend. You never know. Gutted.

But yeah, so many trolls online with boxing. Waaaaay more than football. Far worse

[Bris Vegas]

The trolls in boxing wouldn't last 30 seconds in the ring with these so-called 'bums'.

@Alpha is spot on. There are many talented fighters out there, but ultimately there are levels. While AJ destroyed Charles Martin, its not like they plucked Martin out of a US bar somewhere. 

The paths for some boxers are much easier than others. Hearn deserves huge credit for paving the way for a number of world title victories for the Brits, but the amount of titles in today's game makes it easier to become a world champion.

Having said that, on the flip side, if it wasn't for the large number of titles then excellent match-ups such as Brook v Porter in the IBF wouldn't have got the recognition or exposure it deserves.

British boxers have a huge advantage though in that it's a small country, allowing for competitive training and easy availability in terms of sparring with top quality opposition.

In Mexico, with the country being so big, it's particularly hard in certain states for fighters to really get those quality rounds of sparring under their belts. It's expensive too, considering the average pay is much less.

I met up with David Haye's sister and brother-in-law while they were on vacation out here. They couldn't believe the quality of the gyms out here compared to the UK. They say the gyms here are like a throwback to the 70s in terms of equipment and accessibility. 

UK boxing is on a massive high at the moment, and IMO it has the potential to get even better.

 

 

 

[tomsdubs]

3 hours ago, Alpha said:

The thing with people talking about boxing online, especially twitter, is that they are just bitter

Everyone is a bum. The heavyweight division is a joke. He hasnt fought anyone good, he payed the judges blah blah blah.

There are no bums. There's levels. Like any sport. If these lads are bums then why don't the YouTube ninjas and twitter gangsters go and fight?

"Joshua has only fought tin cans/ Mike Tyson is a legend" - who did Mike Tyson fight in his first 20 fights? No denying he was a scary fighter but take a look who he fought when he was growing. 

You just can't please people. It has the most abusive fans. 

We could have had tickets for Joshua but we can't make it. But it could go down in history as the time a legend passed on the baton to a legend. You never know. Gutted.

But yeah, so many trolls online with boxing. Waaaaay more than football. Far worse

Loads of people online call top 20 ranked fighters bums, I instantly think all their opinions are a load of **** as soon as they go down that avenue. Boxing is the toughest sport, they don't realise how fit these guys are and how easy they make it look. I can barely hold my arms up and block for 3 rounds let alone fight back. Classic tonight heard lads talking about the Haye Bellew fight: "I knew Bellew would win". Oh really? No one knew that just look at the odds. Bellew was 4-1 down on the cards then Haye got injured and he still couldn't hurt Haye who had a completely detached Achilles tendon. Haye was clearly hurt in the ring entrance hence why he swung for the hills from the off. Now when you watch back you can see the crazy wide stance he used to try and avoid his tendon going. It was only 96-93 officially at the time of the stoppage!

I love boxing but 80% of the fans are complete muppets, makes fans at football matches seem like top tier experts.

Mike Tyson didn't have massive competition and as soon as his youth wore off he was a shadow of his former self, prison absolutely wrecked him as well. At his peak though a total animal. I'll talk some boxing here though you guys seem more level headed and reasonable, I just can't do this bums and frauds etc allegations.

 

[Alph]

25 minutes ago, tomsdubs said:

Loads of people online call top 20 ranked fighters bums, I instantly think all their opinions are a load of **** as soon as they go down that avenue. Boxing is the toughest sport, they don't realise how fit these guys are and how easy they make it look. I can barely hold my arms up and block for 3 rounds let alone fight back. Classic tonight heard lads talking about the Haye Bellew fight: "I knew Bellew would win". Oh really? No one knew that just look at the odds. Bellew was 4-1 down on the cards then Haye got injured and he still couldn't hurt Haye who had a completely detached Achilles tendon. Haye was clearly hurt in the ring entrance hence why he swung for the hills from the off. Now when you watch back you can see the crazy wide stance he used to try and avoid his tendon going. It was only 96-93 officially at the time of the stoppage!

I love boxing but 80% of the fans are complete muppets, makes fans at football matches seem like top tier experts.

Mike Tyson didn't have massive competition and as soon as his youth wore off he was a shadow of his former self, prison absolutely wrecked him as well. At his peak though a total animal. I'll talk some boxing here though you guys seem more level headed and reasonable, I just can't do this bums and frauds etc allegations.

 

Yeah I wasn't having a dig at Mike Tyson. 

These idiots don't seem to grasp how dangerous this sport is. They'd have Anthony Joshua stepping in with Deontay Wilder 5 fights ago. Who's going to take responsibility if he gets put in a wheelchair? If he's eating through a straw what will be the comments then? They going to pay his bills?

Reading twitter tonight after Fury announced his comeback in May

"You're a fraud"

"Go destroy that hype job"

"Go bang out Joshua"

"You're back and getting knocked out"

He's a world champion. He's undefeated. He worked up to find his level. He beat a legend

His rival is a world champion. An Olympic gold medalist. He's undefeated and worked up to find his level. 

People talk like this is two blokes off the street about to have a water fight. Trained fighters who need to stay healthy and valuable. 

Although I did hammer that Swiss guy that Haye fought because he kept dropping to the deck. Either that's a dangerous mismatch or he's turned up to collect money. No way was he a professional boxer at that level getting dropped like that.

[tomsdubs]

36 minutes ago, Alpha said:

Yeah I wasn't having a dig at Mike Tyson. 

These idiots don't seem to grasp how dangerous this sport is. They'd have Anthony Joshua stepping in with Deontay Wilder 5 fights ago. Who's going to take responsibility if he gets put in a wheelchair? If he's eating through a straw what will be the comments then? They going to pay his bills?

Reading twitter tonight after Fury announced his comeback in May

"You're a fraud"

"Go destroy that hype job"

"Go bang out Joshua"

"You're back and getting knocked out"

He's a world champion. He's undefeated. He worked up to find his level. He beat a legend

His rival is a world champion. An Olympic gold medalist. He's undefeated and worked up to find his level. 

People talk like this is two blokes off the street about to have a water fight. Trained fighters who need to stay healthy and valuable. 

Although I did hammer that Swiss guy that Haye fought because he kept dropping to the deck. Either that's a dangerous mismatch or he's turned up to collect money. No way was he a professional boxer at that level getting dropped like that.

Honestly reading Twitter replies to boxers is just mind boggling, some of the cowards that have a pop is absolutely astounding. The way the media went after Fury after becoming the best HW on the planet was a joke. He may have said some stupid stuff but I just wished they'd leave the guy alone. Fighters want to stay as healthy and relevant for as long as possible, they always take the safest route to the most money it's simple common sense and we'd all do the same. Blows my mind that casuals all moaned about Joshua's early fights, he moved way faster than most HW prospects.

Joshua vs Wilder is my dream match up right now, that fight would be huge assuming AJ does the business in April. Think Wilder gets schooled, he lost all the rounds to a poor Washington. Straight forward KO IMO for AJ there.

You're right about the danger though, these casuals don't understand how hard these guys punch. They treat these fighters like video game marionettes, just there for their entertainment. They wouldn't be so flippant if they were taking sledgehammers to the head for a living.

[Tombo]

59 minutes ago, tomsdubs said:

Honestly reading Twitter replies to boxers is just mind boggling, some of the cowards that have a pop is absolutely astounding. The way the media went after Fury after becoming the best HW on the planet was a joke. He may have said some stupid stuff but I just wished they'd leave the guy alone. Fighters want to stay as healthy and relevant for as long as possible, they always take the safest route to the most money it's simple common sense and we'd all do the same. Blows my mind that casuals all moaned about Joshua's early fights, he moved way faster than most HW prospects.

Joshua vs Wilder is my dream match up right now, that fight would be huge assuming AJ does the business in April. Think Wilder gets schooled, he lost all the rounds to a poor Washington. Straight forward KO IMO for AJ there.

You're right about the danger though, these casuals don't understand how hard these guys punch. They treat these fighters like video game marionettes, just there for their entertainment. They wouldn't be so flippant if they were taking sledgehammers to the head for a living.

The problem was that there hasn't really been anyone to test Joshua. Early on, yes he was facing guys who he was expected to beat. That's how it always works, you build confidence and get a good undefeated streak to start you off.

AJ is similar to Tyson in many aspects. Firstly back in the day, people would ask Tyson the same questions - "When will you face someone who'll take you the distance?" And the response is always the same for both "We're trying to find someone!"

AJ, just like Tyson, walks into a match with a guy that his corner are thinking "okay, this guy will be a big test now" and he demolishes them way early than anyone expected. The only guys to really test him were Breazeale and Whyte, not to be taken lightly, they were big big contenders. Even so, Breazeale he dominated fairly well, the guy just had a good chin.

So I too never understand why AJ gets accused of only fighting 'bums'. They've always tried to fight guys to challenge him and he's always exceeded expectation. The fact that he effortlessly knocked out a guy who was world champion to win his first world honours says a lot. Maybe Martin wasn't the strongest champ in the division but he's got some quality, otherwise he wouldn't have been anywhere near the belt. They don't just hand out world titles.

[tomsdubs]

11 minutes ago, Tombo said:

The problem was that there hasn't really been anyone to test Joshua. Early on, yes he was facing guys who he was expected to beat. That's how it always works, you build confidence and get a good undefeated streak to start you off.

AJ is similar to Tyson in many aspects. Firstly back in the day, people would ask Tyson the same questions - "When will you face someone who'll take you the distance?" And the response is always the same for both "We're trying to find someone!"

AJ, just like Tyson, walks into a match with a guy that his corner are thinking "okay, this guy will be a big test now" and he demolishes them way early than anyone expected. The only guys to really test him were Breazeale and Whyte, not to be taken lightly, they were big big contenders. Even so, Breazeale he dominated fairly well, the guy just had a good chin.

So I too never understand why AJ gets accused of only fighting 'bums'. They've always tried to fight guys to challenge him and he's always exceeded expectation. The fact that he effortlessly knocked out a guy who was world champion to win his first world honours says a lot. Maybe Martin wasn't the strongest champ in the division but he's got some quality, otherwise he wouldn't have been anywhere near the belt. They don't just hand out world titles.

I agree but my only exception is Martin was kind of a handout, the guy he fought collapsed with knee ligaments gone after a round or two. It was a total gift, Martin was always losing to AJ even if AJ had a bad night. Martin was lucky to even get a title shot for a vacant belt against an average opponent. Breazeale has since shown he has an awesome chin against Ugonoh so the fact AJ did that to him tells me that AJ's power is supreme in the division. Fury, Wilder, Tyson or whoever you look at had just as steady if not easier building fights than AJ. You need to balance learning the pro game and making sure you don't throw your guy in the deep end too quick.

Intrigued to see how Hughie fairs against Parker, it's a massive step up for him but it opens up a lot of big fights if he does it. Wanted Haye to win just for all the potential HW possibilities. Fury, Fury, AJ, Haye, Wilder & Parker. Plus loads of fringe contenders moving up.Think Wlad is past it and will be retired by AJ.

[Tombo]

21 minutes ago, tomsdubs said:

I agree but my only exception is Martin was kind of a handout, the guy he fought collapsed with knee ligaments gone after a round or two. It was a total gift, Martin was always losing to AJ even if AJ had a bad night. Martin was lucky to even get a title shot for a vacant belt against an average opponent. Breazeale has since shown he has an awesome chin against Ugonoh so the fact AJ did that to him tells me that AJ's power is supreme in the division. Fury, Wilder, Tyson or whoever you look at had just as steady if not easier building fights than AJ. You need to balance learning the pro game and making sure you don't throw your guy in the deep end too quick.

Intrigued to see how Hughie fairs against Parker, it's a massive step up for him but it opens up a lot of big fights if he does it. Wanted Haye to win just for all the potential HW possibilities. Fury, Fury, AJ, Haye, Wilder & Parker. Plus loads of fringe contenders moving up.Think Wlad is past it and will be retired by AJ.

Yeah he was a handout, but he was in that opportunity, end of story. He may have been about on par, perhaps only marginally worse, than the guys AJ was beating before.

But yeah, exactly right that most guys have easier runs than AJ did early on. They used to say early on that he needs to be tested with someone who can take him the distance and nobody can. It's going to have to take Wlad to do it, and if he can't, then nobody can. If he knocks out Wlad, old or not, then we'll just have to accept that every fight he has will end in a KO one way or another. There's probably no safer and more careful fighter in the division than Klitschko.