FlyBritishMidland

Derby 2 Bristol R 1

FRGS Collins

On 21/11/2023 at 13:20, AndyinLiverpool said:

He seems like a lightweight. When things are going poorly, it's like he's notplaying.

We'd lose way more than we'd gain by moving the best midfielder in the world out of position to accommodate Maddison. He's light years behind Bellingham and Foden.

Fair point about Bellingham but I think the lightweight bit is harsh.  Could of my mates are Leicester STH’s and I watched a bit of them on Sky last season just for the banter and if it wasn’t for him they’d have been dead and buried well before the season ended.

You would have to use this game @admira wouldn’t you!!  A true sliding doors moment.  And nearly 10 years later I’ve still never watched it on TV or YouTube, not even highlights.  I went on one of the club coaches and when I got home I watched my saved recording of the 5-0 demolition of F****t.  Just so I could go say that was the last game I watched.

1 minute ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Is Paul even a 'League One expert'? He's only proven as an expert in getting Rotherham (a club he spent 19 out of 23 years at prior to joining us) promoted from the division.

In the interest of balance, 3 seasons as manner in League 1 and promoted in each of them.  Unfair to include those as player, coach or whatever as he’s not been in those roles with us.

4 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Imagine how Warne would have done with us last season without the good start (and squad) from Rosenior. 😉

That would be Rosenior’s 1.56 points per game v Warne’s 1.68 😉.

13 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

They managed to stay up without him. So he's no great shakes is he. All this yo-yoing is vaguely acceptable when it's Prem to Championship, or if you are Rotherham. But he has shown no sign of being a good long-term manager for this club. I wonder when the 'established in the Championship' aims will fade. 

In the interest of balance, they only just stayed up last season.  They averaged 1.5 points per game under Warne and then just under 1 point per game under Matt Taylor, who’s now been sacked.  Without the good start under Warne, they probably would have gone down last season.

58 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Like being 3-0 up, 75 minutes on the clock, and having used only 1 sub, with Robinson and Weston both on the bench. By the end of the game, we use only 3 out of 5 subs and leave both Robinson and Weston on the bench. Just like that?

Now that’s what I don’t get.  One minute it’s I’ll put some of the kids on if we’re 3 goals up.  But when we’re 3 goals up and he makes his last change at 84 mins he doesn’t do that and says he’d used all the sub breaks.  That’s why I think he’s focused on the moment and not the long term plan. 

38 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

If there was an obvious reason? He gets pulled off when others get left on. He doesn't get a start when others do. So if he's picked to play he must be a good person - he played how many consecutive games at fullback? It's obviously that he doesn't play a game that Warne likes/wants. Hourihane said as much for himself, if you don't play the way Warne wants you don't play.

When he's had a good run in a forward position and done squat then I'll agree with you. FFS he was on for how long the other match and hit the bar with a blistering shot. 

7 hours ago, BondJovi said:

Of course, I'd be bloody stupid to state feelings as facts without that person directly telling me.

The performance against Crewe was rubbish. The substitutions/tactical changes had zero impact on the match. The manager chose to put on a defender when losing the game instead of giving a chance to a player who had scored and asissted in his pervious game.

Do you think Weston was buzzing when a defender got sent on before him when the team needed goals? Maybe next time he needs to score a hat trick and then Warne might take note...

In terms of momentum, I was referring more to the feel good generated around the academy. Of course we can still have a good season, but this reluctance to ultilise our squad could be our undoing. Given the number of players out of contract in the summer, these cup competitons would have been a good time to see if we had anyone in the academy who could step up. Their chances are now seriously limited before January. Makes even less sense when the cash isn't flowing.

Warne has not sent out the right messages regarding the academy, intentional or not and just when it looks like that has changed, he blows it. What is the point in investing heavily in keeping our cat 1 status if the figurehead won't utilise it. He has only really used those players in a game against a fellow U21 team. Right now, there is not a clear pathway.

A lof of fans have their concerns about his use of the squad, confused as to why he didn't do something that seemed like the most obvious thing to do. What concerns me most about this is that it seems like a complete lack of forward planning, the Wolves U21 game was not in the long term thinking, only decided a few days before.

Am I stupid for having concerns about his long term management of this club? This run of games up to Christmas is vital. If we aren't secure in those play off spots, it doesn't look good for him. I would have more patience if I could see that there was some long term thinking happening, if we were trying to do this with a young squad. But it all feels very Rowett like to me.

 

 

 

The bit in bold is something I’ve been mulling over.

I don’t think Warne is a good long term planner or strategist, he focuses on short term wins.  This may explain his promotions followed by immediate relegations.  In some way, who can blame him when you see the flak for a defeat.  I think we’ll see less U21 layers used in the EFL Trophy, which is a shame as it’s an ideal stage to gain experience.  He wants the short term wins.  He’s more Mourinho than Fergie - Mourinho built teams for the short term, Fergie built clubs to leave a legacy.

For what it’s worth I wouldn’t say I’m pro-Warne but I’m pro-stability as I do think give a manager time we’ll benefit in the long run.  But I’m wavering as to whether Warne is that manager.

Didn’t go and listened on the radio so it’s difficult to comment on the performance.  Although it did sound like we were huffing and puffing a bit in the second half and ran out of ideas.

As others have said, I do think Warne missed a trick by not using more of the academy players.  He hinted at it on Saturday but it didn’t happen.  After some promising performances last week it would have been an ideal opportunity to give a few more some minutes. It would have been an ideal next step in their development - higher profile competition, bigger crowd but not massive, tougher opposition.  This could then lead to more time in EFL Trophy games and minutes in league matches as the season wears on.  Given the number of players out of contract, easing some in during this season could save us a few quid in the summer.

2 hours ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

 

Is that normally how it works? Football management seems a bit of an anomaly in that it almost always is the manager who pays the price, yet in all other organisations I’ve worked in both in the public and private sector, a poor performing employee is given every opportunity to improve and if they persist with their underperformance they are more often than not managed out of the business or repurposed into a different role, it’s rarely been a manager that’s sacked despite their supposed accountability. I’ve always found in the real world as opposed to the football world that poo rolls downhill. 
This is more an observation on football management versus other industries than a specific observation on Warne. 
I guess in football the players are a business asset and less disposable than perhaps employees in the broader sense of other industries 🤔 

I get what you mean but I see it a little differently.  The way I translate it is a football manager/head coach is a bit like a head of department in a business.   If that department, as a collective, isn’t performing then it’s the head who gets replaced.

1 hour ago, admira said:

Is this in the wrong thread?  I’m going for FA Cup 1st round v Hartlepool.  Lost 2-1.  1984 if I remember correctly.

9 minutes ago, BodminRam said:

Derby 1-3 Crewe Alexandra

As things stand, Derby are heading out of the FA Cup in the first round for the first time in their history...ever.

No, in 84/85 we went out in the 1st round to Hartlepool.

Edit: beaten to it by @DCFC_Sloth.

8 hours ago, David said:

 

I wonder if @The Baron will state this in the next edition of the podcast?  Just to clear up any confusion.

23 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I believe the only way may be on Bet365. Deposit £5 then watch through the 'in play' feature

As long as I do that some time today it should work?

Top performance against one of the challengers.  I think that was more like how Warne wants us to play, or how’s he’s described his type of football.  High press, win the ball early, move it quickly.  If we can do that consistently, we’ll be fine.

To be outside the top 6 on goal difference going into the last international break of the year is a nice place to be.  We’ve had a stuttering start and are in touch, others have yet to have a wobble.  I think now to the next break around February will be a key period.

Was this The King’s last game?  Watford in 1982?

Very sad news.  I never met B4 but you form a picture in your mind.  His positivity was fantastic, his glass wasn’t just half full, it was full to the brim and overflowing.

His positive views about the club, how we would win every game, we could overturn the points deductions, his interesting valuations of players.  The posts that I miss and always made me smile the most were when a poster said they couldn’t get to the game and the solutions he would offer.  Simply brilliant.

Now let’s go and get promotion!!

My condolences to his family and friends.

RIP B4 🐏.

Derby 1 Barnsley 1

FRGS Barkhuizen

It was introduced for the clear and obvious but it’s used for everything.  Just look at the 2 pens in the Man Utd game this week.  Neither were penalties, no appeals, not obvious errors but VAR intervenes.

I think his use of the academy players last night is another example of Warne’s man management.  As a group they’ve experienced a few days training with the first team, being involved in the match day prep and played minutes in a competitive fixture.  And all of this in a safe environment.  They’ve played at PP in front of a handful of fans, rather than 25k+ groaning at every mistake, even if one of them doesn’t make it it will probably affect them.  And against another U21 team, which in my view will have been less pressure.

At the fans forum, Warne said he’d seen young players take steps back in their careers by being rushed too soon.  I think he’s doing his best to avoid that scenario, for the sake of the individual and the club.  A smart move.

7 hours ago, Mucker1884 said:

1/  I never said he called anyone useless.  Someone else posted that.

2/  He did, however, bellow "Aaagh!  You are a bloody disgrace", seemingly in the general direction of a targeted/specific individual.

3/  Rightly or wrongly (The latter it seems, judging by your account) I always assumed that the phrase "For missing the target from there, you want bloody shooting" referred to a training ground shot on goal, not the taking of a corner?  Shows what I know!  

4/  I like how we have diverted attention away from the much criticised Mr Warne.  Which is nice.  😁

 

 

🐏

 

Indeed, you are correct about point 3…….

On 06/11/2023 at 19:47, RoyMac5 said:

I'm curious about what recent evidence you have of Warne being a good man manager? Do you think Bradley will agree or Hourihane?

I think @Caerphilly Ram has pretty much answered that for me 👍.  I think multiple player interviews, here and Rotherham, clips from We Are Derby, etc seem to support the view.  And the busy period last season when we went a long unbeaten run support the view as, in my view, that’s more about man management to keep the players going and motivated than develop tactics and formations on the training ground.

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

This is the longest this season, beating Oxford and Cheltenham, both on 50 pages.

The longest ever matchday thread was Sheff Weds on the last day of the 20/21 season - 88 pages. 2nd (79 pages) and 3rd (75) were in November 2020 (Wycombe and Boro). There were a lot of 50+ page matchday threads in that 20/21 season, potentially the majority of them.

Unlike you to produce some stats!!

I might be over-thinking this but I reckon we’ll go on a decent run after the international break.  Maybe not unbeaten but a decent points per game.

This is going to sound bizarre but we’ll be entering the hectic part of the season where we’ll have a lot of games. With cup games there’ll be quite a few midweek games, so a lot of Saturday, Tuesday, Saturday.  PW has been quite vocal about his dislike for a busy schedule.  But I think we’ll do better in this period, just look at last season. Ironically we’ll benefit from less time on the training ground, less time to over-think and more just getting on with it and dealing with the games.  When we’ve had more time on the training ground in an international break, we’ve put in a poor performance.

I think he’s a good man manager and good at building a strong team ethic and relationships. I just think he’s a bit one dimensional when it comes to football and tactics.  If he had better tacticians around him, I think he’d do a lot better.