IlsonDerby

On 14/01/2024 at 09:36, AndyinLiverpool said:

According to transfer markt, 97 minutes in total since 7th November in the league. 20 minutes since Christmas.

Just read this…

8 hours ago, Millenniumram said:

Not sure I subscribe to that squad profile. This is coming from a club in Charlton who find themselves in mid table, so to be honest, I’m not sure why we should be following their model.

For what it’s worth, this is how I’d roughly assess our squad:

Top class players who are clearly capable of stepping up to the Championship: Cashin, Mendez-Laing, Hourihane, Wilson

Good League One players: Nelson, Forsyth, Bird, Nyambe, Collins, Barkhuizen, Wildsmith, Smith, Sibley, Vickers, Embleton, Elder

Poor League One players: Waghorn, Fornah, Washington, Bradley, Thompson, John-Jules

Players not capable (or not ready) at League One level: Rooney, Ward

Note: This is based on our squad from the first half of the season, so I have included Embleton and John-Jules, but not Oduroh.

As you might expect, most of our players fall within the “good” category - which is why we’ve found ourselves in and around the top six. And that’s not a problem - you need enough of those players to create a strong squad depth. 

But I think it’s those players in the top category that are the difference makers in getting top two. They’re naturally hard to come by of course, since they really shouldn’t be playing at this level, so you would never expect too many players in that list. But I do think a couple of additions of that quality would propel the entire team to one that is too good for this league - and that is the level you need to show to achieve automatic promotion.

The trouble for me is, finding top quality players on a budget is hard. And looking at those players in the bottom two lists - there are a lot signed under the current regime. I had a lot of hope for the new recruitment team, but so far they’ve performed very poorly. That needs to change this window.

That isn’t the make up of their squad now. It’s what the owners hope to move towards to get them up. 
 

Also Rooney not ready? Ward not ready? I know Ward made the mistakes that led to penalties but considering he’s played a number of seasons at this level I don’t see how he isn’t ready for it… also on Rooney - he was doing well before his injury. A breathe of fresh air. He got spanked by Borges for Man City U21 but I reckon most premier league full backs would have had issues against him never mind a league 1 centre back. 

41 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Excellent L1 players ready to step up to the level above:

 Mendez Laing, Nelson, Cashin, Wilson, Wildsmith,  Nyambe

 Decent L1 players who will need replacing eventually at the level above:

Forsyth, Hourihane, Waghorn, Collins, Bird, Barkhuizen, Washington, Smith, Rooney, Bradley 

 Academy products:

Brown, Weston, Robinson, Hawkins, Fapetu, Bardell, Cox, Wheeldon, Thomspson, Radcliffe 

What about the players your lists are missing? Ie elder / Sibley etc? 
 

Think the Bird rating is a bit odd considering championship clubs are interested in him? 

Tried to do this for our squad. 
 

Obviously this is really subjective. I was undecided on a few so kept them between strong L1 and average L1. 
 

Elder was in team of the year last time he was at this level but hasn’t had opportunity to get a run of games. The keepers? Both could do a job in the division above but haven’t seen them play regularly at that level. Hourihane has quality and has done it before at that level but is getting older. Barkhuizen has purple patches where he looks very capable of stepping up but then has the opposite of purple spells too. 
 

Have included Thompson Fornah and TJJ on the prospects as I think there’s enough there to not be writing them off as league 1 players yet but haven’t shown enough to be strong L1 players like Cashin etc. 

An interview with the people who run Charlton said that moving forwards they hope to have a squad with 3 groups. 

8 excellent L1 players ready to step up to the level above. 
 

8 decent L1 players who will need replacing eventually at the level above. 
 

8 academy products. 
 

Had me wondering - how does our squad compare to this profile? Do we have around 8 of each? I’d include Cash and Bird as first teamers rather than academy products for the purpose of this as they’re fully established. I see academy products being not yet established. Maybe a D Robinson or a D Brown perhaps a Fapetu. 
 

Anyway again how do we think our squad stands up to that sort of profile? It makes sense to me to aim for something like that and then you aim to do it again in the championship… 

3 minutes ago, Anag Ram said:

He was dreadful when he first came to Derby but when he got fitter, he was useful as an irritant. By then, though, he had lost his spark and had to use his ‘experience’ to wind up the opposition.

Was a good player in Leicester’s side.

We’re remembering it differently. He was a massive wind up merchant but his ability on the ball was still a step up compared to the rest of the team. 

Some concerns and grumblings about players we are linked to made me think about where we are now and what are the profiles of players we can look to be signing in our position. 
 

I think the profiles we are able to sign are split into 3: 

Young players we’d be taking a risk on (Savage) 

Players coming into prime years who have shown something at L1/L2 level but not higher (CBT) 

Players past their best struggling for playing time higher up the pyramid (Smith) 

Id rather group 1 be permanent signings so we reap the reward of any successes but acknowledge there’s a level of quality available to us in prem loans that we’d struggle to sign permanently. 
 

Group 2 have to be right for the club in terms of cost but even if they’ve shown signs of quality they’ll be inconsistent and frustrating otherwise they wouldn’t be signing for us in league 1. 
 

Group 3 is fine as long as they’re seen as short stop gaps whilst the squad is being build from the first two groups. A 6 month loan for smith makes sense. Signing him for free on a 2- 3 year deal wouldn’t for me. 

3 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

Mire importantly  did daddy pass on his football 'skills' to the lad? Such as running around chasing shadows?

Where does this come from? 

Savage rubbed people up the wrong way but to reduce a player who spent a career as long as he did at the top level to running around a lot. Easily more technically gifted than anyone else in our side when Clough brought him back in from The cold. 

28 minutes ago, Anag Ram said:

Yeah, would there be this much attention for him if his surname wasn’t Savage?

Bit offensive to reduce our scouting to ‘oh he’s Savage’s lad’ 😂

27 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

He's not getting a game at a team in absolute crisis

He’s played 28 times ain’t he? We’re only in January. 
 

Averaging 55 minutes an appearance so not just 5-10 minutes here or there. 

Some potential for chants with this name

12 hours ago, Mckram said:

Is it just me that finds it crazy we will offer £300k when he will be free in the summer?

I can only assume we have a fee for Cashin or something already arranged for us to be throwing that money around on someone with 6 months left.

If we have sold anyone then it makes sense that it isn’t announced until we’ve done our business so asking prices don’t go up.

2 ways to spin this: if we’re paying a fee for him his agent can’t be asking for silly signing on fees and wages which usually comes with free agents who are entering their prime years. 
 

secondly it depends what the club feel he will be worth both in resale value and in whether he provides the edge to take us up. 
 

say for example the club go to £400k but believe he’d be worth £1m this summer if he was on a 3 year contract (not out of the realms of reality considering we’ve bid £300k and he’s only got 6 months left) then that’s completely different to the days where we’d sign someone for more than they’d be worth on resale. 
 

we’d also face more competition in summer too… 

4 hours ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said:

Odd one.  Think we need better.  He'll get more games at Stockport.

Got 4 goals from midfield for a team in absolute crisis? 1 goal per 7 matches for that s**** is nothing to be sniffed at. 
 

Also have to look at it that there’s a big chance we lose bird either now or in summer - will Hourihane still be here after summer? I’m not so sure. Same with regards to Smith. 
 

That’d leave us with Fornah and Thompson? Add Savage to them and a more senior player on a free in summer and you’ve got some decent options. You’ve got youth and legs. 
 

Id be very much for us making transfers that seem cheap but have potential for the players to grow with us. 
 

people always used to say they want us to be like Brentford well Brentford never signed players in their prime. They signed good players from underperforming teams based on their chairman’s model and developed them before selling them on for a fortune. 

No idea how posh haven’t take the lead there. Christ it was comical 😂

Keystone cops defending from posh there 😂

7 minutes ago, Carnero said:

Where are you watching this game?

Abroad via their channel

Posh look a different level to Charlton. 
 

Alfie May looks furious at his team as he presses time after time to turn around and see no one has gone with him. 

He’s a signing where just by having him tied to a longer deal he should instantly be worth more than we pay if we can get it over the line. 
 

We have to accept our place that we are a stepping stone to bigger things at the moment and so resale value has to be considered. 
 

Id be happy to sign anyone who’ll retain their value (injuries permitting) as we won’t end up with any butterfield in for £4m out for a Mars bar type situations that ultimately emptied the coffers. 

5 minutes ago, Returning ram said:

Lots to take from that game, Sibley, Fornah nowhere near good enough to command a starting place, Vickers still the back up keeper. Thompson, hopefully fitness held him back and we need another forward when it's not working for Collins.

Hopefully we have a good Jan window, otherwise injuries to key players will cost us.

My heads gonna fall off. Collins not working? He’s banged them in this year ffs. 

f****** woeful that. 
 

Football is football. Doesn’t matter that it’s the BSM trophy. Football is about momentum and being ruthless. Absolutely w*** that. 
 

Trip to Wembley gone. 6 days until Our next game too so hardly a ‘game we could have done without’ either. 
 

2 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Will probably only be 29,999 as there was one poster on here said he wouldn't be going while Warne is still here...

I always round up tbf so we’re all good 

Play Fornah, Elder, Sibley, have a mix of U21s and players who could do with a rest on the bench (NML Foz) 

go for it. Winning a trophy is winning a trophy - it won’t feel crap watching them lift it at the national stadium when we take 30k down there. 

13 hours ago, Ambitious said:

He’s not been given a proper run of games, but what I really like the bits I’ve seen. I think he has a lot of potential, it wasn’t long ago most people had him down with Nyambe and Nelson as our best signing of the summer. 

Bird, I feel, gives us too many 6/10 games. He isn’t impactful enough. No doubt he’s a technically good footballer and he obviously is a great character around the club. He’s a good player for us, no doubt, but it wouldn’t be difficult for us to sell him and improve the side IMO. Similarly to losing Knight, ironically, the guy we picked up as part of the deal has come in and been much improved on the Knight we saw and had last season. 

Think I agree that I’d like to see a lot more of Fornah. Felt he’d done alright then played that pass that led to Cheltenhams goal and that was it not really seen since. 
 

I think he has that look about him where he is so laid back on the ball that some fans worry when in fact he’s in complete control of what’s happening. 

On 03/01/2024 at 09:40, Ghost of Clough said:

Unfortunately, he's just not very good, and at 24 he's unlikely to improve by much in the future. It's as if our recruitment team went searching for a "more athletic Korey Smith". Neither are good enough to play the sole DM role, and neither offer enough going forward to play further forward. Bird gets criticised for a lack of end product, but he's like De Bruyne in comparison to Fornah.

Garbage. You can praise Bird without sniping at a young player with potential. 
 

Rubbish fan base. 

3 hours ago, TomTom92 said:

Derby's recruitment in the fullback areas has been diabolical in the past 30 years. If i had to make an all time XI from the past 30 years i'd be looking at Fozzy, Brayford or Bogle. All solid championship full backs in their prime, but hardly a good return. Anyway moan over, well done Fozzy. 

Put some respect on Gareth Roberts name