Wrestling/Wrestlemania

[Day]

Right, let’s get none debatable stuff out the way first.

It’s acting.

Storylines written, scripted, “fights”, rivalries pre decided.

The acting is worse than what is seen in Emmerdale and Coronation Street.

It’s not a sport and should not be on the sports channels or covered by sport media.

Great entertainment for children.

——— End of ———

So can anyone explain to me why so many grown men are into this juiced up lycra clad tripe to fill stadiums where they can barely even see the ring of terrible scripted acting? Just look at the state of it. 🤯

 

[May Contain Nuts]

It's athletics with a bit of fake drama thrown in, two or more people working collaboratively in an attempt to entertain an audience. and a good wrestling bout will tell a story through the in-ring stuff better than any promos could do.

I mean, it beats people trying to kill each other and then pretending they weren't trying to kill each other when someone dies as a result of repeatedly being punched in the head. https://news.sky.com/story/man-dies-after-being-seriously-injured-in-white-collar-boxing-match-in-nottingham-12847263 .

I'll take some goofy entertainment that isn't a sport over a  actual sport that should really be left in the dark ages any day.

That said I don't know why a grown adult would watch WWE in 2023, or at any point in the last 15-20 years tbh.

[Baj]

Think the best way of explaining it to me is - they're American.

[Day]

11 minutes ago, Kokosnuss said:

It's athletics with a bit of fake drama thrown in, two or more people working collaboratively in an attempt to entertain an audience. and a good wrestling bout will tell a story through the in-ring stuff better than any promos could do.

I mean, it beats people trying to kill each other and then pretending they weren't trying to kill each other when someone dies as a result of repeatedly being punched in the head. https://news.sky.com/story/man-dies-after-being-seriously-injured-in-white-collar-boxing-match-in-nottingham-12847263 .

I'll take some goofy entertainment that isn't a sport over a  actual sport that should really be left in the dark ages any day.

That said I don't know why a grown adult would watch WWE in 2023, or at any point in the last 15-20 years tbh.

Without fact checking this, I would guess deaths of wrestlers outnumber white collar boxing quite considerably to be fair.

Injuries, drug abuse that kind of thing.

Boxing, UFC, NFL, F1, Rally, so many can be dangerous in many ways.

As for the entertainment, I get it, just feel like there is an age where you move past it.....say school leaving age.

The whole character design if you like is surely targeting kids with the super hero type costumes.

I saw Ryan Conway the former Athletic reporter for Derby call it "real cinema" and that just 🤯

[May Contain Nuts]

50 minutes ago, David said:

Without fact checking this, I would guess deaths of wrestlers outnumber white collar boxing quite considerably to be fair.

Injuries, drug abuse that kind of thing.

Boxing, UFC, NFL, F1, Rally, so many can be dangerous in many ways.

As for the entertainment, I get it, just feel like there is an age where you move past it.....say school leaving age.

The whole character design if you like is surely targeting kids with the super hero type costumes.

I saw Ryan Conway the former Athletic reporter for Derby call it "real cinema" and that just 🤯

There are way more wrestler deaths exactly for the reasons you say, mainly historic drug abuse. It's usually not injuries sustained in the ring, they can of course happen but they tend to be accidental. The steroid abuse was a massive problem but there's at least been some attempt to tackle it with regular drugs tests, not sure if it's really a thing with the current crop.

And exactly - beyond school age / early 20s and it's all a bit silly if you're watching WWE. Small indie promotions can occasionally still be a good laugh though and seeing a 400lb fat bloke do a mid-air somersault defies logic.

There are inherent dangers involved in all sports, but not in many of them is causing damage the explicit intent. With MMA & boxing specifically (and almost exclusively) the entire aim of them is to hurt your opponent, pretending otherwise or that it's some sort of 'noble pursuit' is a big load of b******* as is the hand-wringing whenever someone does get hurt. There's a danger of crashing in F1 but it's not 200mph Demolition Derby where the last car running wins is it?

Just because all involved know the risks before going into a fight doesn't make it 'right'.

With boxing you've set out to knock someone unconscious or as close to it as possible before the ref calls time. Punching people until they become unconscious will inevitable lead to some degree of brain damage. You can't hide from it. The later-in-life impact of heading old-style footballs has been the subject of research but with advancements in production methods / lighter balls and schemes to reduce the amount of heading that takes place outside of professional football (whether any of it makes it to pro football we'll have to wait and see).

Is there sufficient research into the long term effects of professional boxing or does the bair-baiting style of sport simply continue unabated?

There's an age were you should stop watching wrestling but there's also an 'age' where a sport designed around the central premise of inflicting physical damage to your opponent in an attempt to prove that you're 'better' than them due to your physical characteristics should be moved past - and let's not pretend that boxing promos are any more sophisticated or any less about showmanship -  except we're not talking about the age of an individual and their watching habits we're talking about a societal 'age' and boxing as a professional sport - and some of the attitudes it promotes -  should, IMO, be left in the dark ages.

I will point out that I'm not talking abut boxing as a training aid, or something positive for underprivileged youth to focus on, where I'm sure it has many benefits.

I can't imagine a group of WWE fans going out on the lash and beating someone up the way that bunch of jacked up gym <redacted> who'd been to watch MMA attacked that bloke in the Merlin a few months ago? But that's the sort of attitude those sports promote.

https://www.derbyshire.police.uk/news/derbyshire/news/appeals/south/2022/november/man-injured-following-reports-of-a-fight-in-derby/

This topic is about wrestling though, and I agree it's just a bit crap really!

Edited April 3, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[Day]

12 minutes ago, Kokosnuss said:

There are way more wrestler deaths exactly for the reasons you say, mainly historic drug abuse. It's usually not injuries sustained in the ring, but they can of course happen but they tend to be accidental. The steroid abuse was a massive problem but there's at least been some attempt to tackle it with regular drugs tests, not sure if it's really a thing with the current crop.

And exactly - beyond school age / early 20s and it's all a bit silly if you're watching WWE. Small indie promotions can occasionally still be a good laugh though and seeing a 400lb fat bloke do a mid-air somersault defies logic.

There are inherent dangers involved in all sports, but not in many of them is causing damage the explicit intent. With MMA & boxing specifically (and almost exclusively) the entire aim of them is to hurt your opponent, pretending otherwise or that it's some sort of 'noble pursuit' is a big load of b******* as is the hand-wringing whenever someone does get hurt. There's a danger of crashing in F1 but it's not 200mph Demolition Derby where the last car running wins is it?

Just because all involved know the risks before going into a fight doesn't make it 'right'.

With boxing you've set out to knock someone unconscious or as close to it as possible before the ref calls time. Punching people until they become unconscious will inevitable lead to some degree of brain damage. You can't hide from it. The later-in-life impact of heading old-style footballs has been the subject of research but with advancements in production methods / lighter balls and schemes to reduce the amount of heading that takes place outside of professional football (whether any of it makes it to pro football we'll have to wait and see).

Is there sufficient research into the long term effects of professional boxing or does the bair-baiting style of sport simply continue unabated?

There's an age were you should stop watching wrestling but there's also an 'age' where a sport designed around the central premise of inflicting physical damage to your opponent in an attempt to prove that you're 'better' than them due to your physical characteristics should be moved past - and let's not pretend that boxing promos are any more sophisticated or any less about showmanship -  except we're not talking about the age of an individual and their watching habits we're talking about a societal 'age' and boxing as a professional sport - and some of the attitudes it promotes -  should, IMO, be left in the dark ages.

I will point out that I'm not talking abut boxing as a training aid, or something positive for underprivileged youth to focus on, where I'm sure it has many benefits.

This topic is about wrestling though, and I agree it's just a bit crap really!

Hard to argue against any of your points on boxing/mma and I'm guilty of enjoying them in the same way a Sunday roast despite hearing a vegan's arguments against animal cruelty.

Both also have that staged rivalry feeling to sell PPV, although in fairness it's a real fight and I guess you have to somehow motivate yourself to want to hurt the other guy, or be hurt yourself.

Wrestling is a skill in avoiding injury, maybe I would be into it if it really was a free for all jumping in the ring trying to literally damage the other guy.

I sound a bit of a sicko right here, I blame Jenifer Lawrence and Hunger Games 😬

[May Contain Nuts]

13 minutes ago, David said:

Hard to argue against any of your points on boxing/mma and I'm guilty of enjoying them in the same way a Sunday roast despite hearing a vegan's arguments against animal cruelty.

Both also have that staged rivalry feeling to sell PPV, although in fairness it's a real fight and I guess you have to somehow motivate yourself to want to hurt the other guy, or be hurt yourself.

Wrestling is a skill in avoiding injury, maybe I would be into it if it really was a free for all jumping in the ring trying to literally damage the other guy.

I sound a bit of a sicko right here, I blame Jenifer Lawrence and Hunger Games 😬

Oh absolutely I'm not telling anyone what to watch / enjoy / eat etc... although I may tell people what to drink occasionally!

I couldn't do without meat no matter how hard I thought about animal cruelty.

It's just food for thought, no expectation for anyone to change their viewing habits. I've never been drawn to boxing so it's easy for me to sit here and spout this stuff.

Edited April 3, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[Srg]

Can't enjoy modern day WWE. It's all too sanitised and too much is aimed at children. 90s WWE(F) was amazing. Currently, keep up with AEW instead as it keeps a bit more of an authentic feeling, and just prefer their style and stories. 

Yes, it's scripted, but so is TV drama. This is just the same thing.

[Day]

2 minutes ago, Srg said:

Can't enjoy modern day WWE. It's all too sanitised and too much is aimed at children. 90s WWE(F) was amazing. Currently, keep up with AEW instead as it keeps a bit more of an authentic feeling, and just prefer their style and stories. 

Yes, it's scripted, but so is TV drama. This is just the same thing.

Oh no, not you as well, ffs. 

[Srg]

12 minutes ago, David said:

Oh no, not you as well, ffs. 

Remember you saying this about NFL, and you changed your tune.

Comparing what WWE is now to other Wrestling is like night and day really. 

[Cisse]

 

[Day]

5 minutes ago, Srg said:

Remember you saying this about NFL, and you changed your tune.

Comparing what WWE is now to other Wrestling is like night and day really. 

Bit of a difference here between my gripes with wrestling and NFL at the time though! 

You're here basically arguing that Coronation Street is better than Hollyoaks 

[Anag Ram]

Homoeroticism

[TigerTedd]

I’ve always said it’s a soap opera for men, and you have to respect some of the athleticism. 

[TigerTedd]

1 hour ago, David said:

Hard to argue against any of your points on boxing/mma and I'm guilty of enjoying them in the same way a Sunday roast despite hearing a vegan's arguments against animal cruelty.

Both also have that staged rivalry feeling to sell PPV, although in fairness it's a real fight and I guess you have to somehow motivate yourself to want to hurt the other guy, or be hurt yourself.

Wrestling is a skill in avoiding injury, maybe I would be into it if it really was a free for all jumping in the ring trying to literally damage the other guy.

I sound a bit of a sicko right here, I blame Jenifer Lawrence and Hunger Games 😬

You want to watch some of the old mick foley and terry funk matches. 

[uttoxram75]

At least the modern American wrestlers are a bit athletic, not like the old Brit lads of the 70's as this early photo of Giant Haystacks shows....

 

[sage]

9 hours ago, Kokosnuss said:

It's athletics with a bit of fake drama thrown in, two or more people working collaboratively in an attempt to entertain an audience. and a good wrestling bout will tell a story through the in-ring stuff better than any promos could do.

I mean, it beats people trying to kill each other and then pretending they weren't trying to kill each other when someone dies as a result of repeatedly being punched in the head. https://news.sky.com/story/man-dies-after-being-seriously-injured-in-white-collar-boxing-match-in-nottingham-12847263 .

I'll take some goofy entertainment that isn't a sport over a  actual sport that should really be left in the dark ages any day.

That said I don't know why a grown adult would watch WWE in 2023, or at any point in the last 15-20 years tbh.

It's not as dangerous as @Boycie's electrical work.

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

37 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

At least the modern American wrestlers are a bit athletic, not like the old Brit lads of the 70's as this early photo of Giant Haystacks shows....

 

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

11 hours ago, David said:

Right, let’s get none debatable stuff out the way first.

It’s acting.

Storylines written, scripted, “fights”, rivalries pre decided.

The acting is worse than what is seen in Emmerdale and Coronation Street.

It’s not a sport and should not be on the sports channels or covered by sport media.

Great entertainment for children.

——— End of ———

So can anyone explain to me why so many grown men are into this juiced up lycra clad tripe to fill stadiums where they can barely even see the ring of terrible scripted acting? Just look at the state of it. 🤯

 

You think that's bad .  In America they do this every year and refer to them as athletes throughout.  Seeing them eat burgers like a pelican is truly horrific.

 

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

49 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

At least the modern American wrestlers are a bit athletic, not like the old Brit lads of the 70's as this early photo of Giant Haystacks shows....