Kirchner- A risk or a potential reward

[kevinhectoring]

1 hour ago, Tyler Durden said:

Not sure where you are deriving your straw poll to say Rooney did a great job at Derby?

Off the pitch he treated all the staff affected with empathy and it's obvious his core values align to behaving towards people in the right manner and being respectful of them.

On the pitch he did OK with the resources he had at his disposal, not going to say anything more about that, and our away record quite rightly draws scrutiny.

Don’t get me wrong, I thought he was good in some areas, and weak in others

But literally every football fan I speak to, when I tell them who I support, tells me what a great job Rooney did for us. It’s like he’s Judy Dench, or the Queen

[Elwood P Dowd]

It does make you wonder why CK did, what he did, his Derby bid and the events at his company must have surely irrevocably damaged his business reputation.

Edited July 22, 2022 by Elwood P Dowd

[Leeds Ram]

The Forbes article is genuinely quite shocking and if even some of the allegations are true then thank god we didn't go through with the sale. I'm not sure what kind of bloke can go around in a Ferrari and a private plane when his employees aren't getting paid... Another question has to be asked that if there is so little money in the company accounts  how did he get to preferred bidder status?  Did he simply show them previous company accounts and present them as his own personal wealth? Given that sponsorship's have been dealt out and money seemingly not paid, clearly we're not the only ones who have been involved with him. Clearly he didn't have the personal wealth to buy the club outright, so I feel vindicated if not terrified that I was right not to be overly trusting of cryto bro. 

[alram]

20 minutes ago, Elwood P Dowd said:

It does make you wonder why CK did, what he did, his Derby bid and the events at his company must have surely irrevocably damaged his business reputation.

can you imagine if he had took us over

 

it would have been like those guys that took over notts county and brought sven in.

 

and the only thing that was stopping the deal was the cash not being delivered, imagine if he had managed to find a way to transfer it.

 

its not worth thinking about.

Edited July 22, 2022 by alram

[Ram-Alf]

14 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

  how did he get to preferred bidder status?  Did he simply show them previous company accounts and present them as his own personal wealth? 

I said in a previous post...that the internet is a wonderful tool for + or - projects, It's documented that large companies were chucking his company millions of $s, I assume they went into the companies bank account, A simple print off with references, Bank statements, Company credentials, All the things that's needed to move forward, It's been said that Q, EFL and even Nixon "SAW THE FUNDS" what did they see...£23million pounds stacked against a wall or a bank statement saying there's money there and has been transferred. 

Now for an old timer like me I can struggle with the intricacies of the Internet, But there's organisations out there...legitimate/illegal that can produce miracles out of thin air.

My question is this...what did the 3 above see?  

[Tyler Durden]

33 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said:

Don’t get me wrong, I thought he was good in some areas, and weak in others

But literally every football fan I speak to, when I tell them who I support, tells me what a great job Rooney did for us. It’s like he’s Judy Dench, or the Queen

But then can we as Derby fans speak with authority on the intimate goings on at another football club.

One can only base your opinion on what information you are supplied with, inevitably through the mass media and social platforms. 

[kevinhectoring]

Not clear yet that he’s a crook. Key question is whether he used Slync funds for personal benefit. All the Forbes talk about him having sole control of the company investment account points to fingers in the till.  We’ll see - I guess he goes to jail in that case

If he didn’t embezzle, the question then is whether the slync product is a winner, ie whether investors will continue to support the business. Dunno where this stands  But if they do continue to invest,  he might be sacked as an employee and if he remains  his role is bound to change. His antics will have significantly changed the economics of the next round of funding - so his shareholding will be diluted. Costly. Maybe Mike Ashley will step in and buy slync on the cheap ? 
 

The private jet was a sign that even though he was a mere multi millionaire, he wanted to act like a billionaire - instead of wanting to work hard to ensure he became one.  

 

[kevinhectoring]

10 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

I said in a previous post...that the internet is a wonderful tool for + or - projects, It's documented that large companies were chucking his company millions of $s, I assume they went into the companies bank account, A simple print off with references, Bank statements, Company credentials, All the things that's needed to move forward, It's been said that Q, EFL and even Nixon "SAW THE FUNDS" what did they see...£23million pounds stacked against a wall or a bank statement saying there's money there and has been transferred. 

Now for an old timer like me I can struggle with the intricacies of the Internet, But there's organisations out there...legitimate/illegal that can produce miracles out of thin air.

My question is this...what did the 3 above see?  

 

for ‘proof of funds’ maybe he gets Goldman to confirm he is a major shareholder in a company worth 100s of millions ? And maybe that was done in December 
 

As for the cash actually required for the purchase, we’ve got no reason to think the cash wasn’t sent. What we don’t know is whether any of the cash came from eg  slync or from Stretford. If it had all come from CK, you wouldn’t think there’d have been a problem with AML 

[Elwood P Dowd]

22 minutes ago, alram said:

can you imagine if he had took us over

 

it would have been like those guys that took over notts county and brought sven in.

 

and the only thing that was stopping the deal was the cash not being delivered, imagine if he had managed to find a way to transfer it.

 

its not worth thinking about.

He must have known when it came down to the final payment he didn't have the ability to make it, did he expect the tooth fairy to intervene? He started out on a course where the only real outcome was the loss of his reputation, its difficult to understand the mindset behind these actions. 

They do say never try to get into the mind of a nutter.

[May Contain Nuts]

Again, it wasn't Slync buying us. Their balance sheet would have no bearing on his takeover attempt. It's not clear whether an administrator or the EFL are even allowed to see those accounts when it isn't that company buying the club.

It could be have been the case that Kirchner very much intentionally tried to buy us as an individual specifically to stop any prying eyes exposing the state the company is in.

The real questions that need to be asked are, what is the standard procedure for showing proof of funds which is acceptable by law which instructs the administrators and the EFL, and can it be tightened up so situations like this don't continue to happen.

Edited July 22, 2022 by Coconut's Beard

[Ram-Alf]

9 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

 

It could be have been the case that Kirchner very much intentionally tried to buy us as an individual specifically to stop any prying eyes exposing the state the company is in.

 

Makes sense, CK buys DCFC it all goes through and now the owner of DCFC, What are the chances of him borrowing monies against DCFC to fund any "losses" to his company?

[RadioactiveWaste]

3 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Makes sense, CK buys DCFC it all goes through and now the owner of DCFC, What are the chances of him borrowing monies against DCFC to fund any "losses" to his company?

When there was a reference to "chasing a highly lucrative investment vehicle" in one of his communications to slync employees, you just know we would have been down the swanie if he had taken us over.

[Ram-Alf]

6 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

When there was a reference to "chasing a highly lucrative investment vehicle" in one of his communications to slync employees, you just know we would have been down the swanie if he had taken us over.

I've posted on a few occasions that it made no sense CK buying us without the ground, It would make sense if we were the "highly lucrative investment vehicle" ?‍♀️

[RadioactiveWaste]

1 minute ago, Unlucky Alf said:

I've posted on a few occasions that it made no sense CK buying us without the ground, It would make sense if we were the "highly lucrative investment vehicle" ?‍♀️

Yeah, just can't help but think"how on earth is buying an insolvent sports team "lucrative "?

Borrowing against it then throwing it back into insolvency is one highly unethical way to do it.

Obviously, running the club successfully at a profit would be the ethical thing, but, my faith in cK doing that,......

[Crewton]

I don't buy this "Rooney was under no pressure" argument and I never will. The pressure on Rooney was to give fans and staff hope while the administration and sale process was ongoing and the threat of liquidation was real. That takes willpower and character, irrespective of the financial rewards. 

His total buy-in to Kirchner's fantasy is a separate matter and one he'll have to come to terms with. I'm pretty sure his personal embarrassment over that was a major factor in his decision to leave. 

[RadioactiveWaste]

10 minutes ago, Crewton said:

I don't buy this "Rooney was under no pressure" argument and I never will. The pressure on Rooney was to give fans and staff hope while the administration and sale process was ongoing and the threat of liquidation was real. That takes willpower and character, irrespective of the financial rewards. 

His total buy-in to Kirchner's fantasy is a separate matter and one he'll have to come to terms with. I'm pretty sure his personal embarrassment over that was a major factor in his decision to leave. 

100%. Whether out of loyalty or he felt responsible,or he just decided it was the right thing to do, he himself decided he was going to try to save the club. It was an almost impossible task and a huge burden that he willingly took upon his shoulders and I'll always respect him for that.

The will of the manager,fans, squad, coaching,staff, city, everyone last season was all essential to us being here now and whatever anyone can snip at, Rooney played more than his part.

 

[swanny]

I work with a few VC backed tech start ups. Whilst im lucky that none have behaved like this, the VC funding world is a little bit smoke and mirrors, fake it till you make it at times.  

 

I wonder whether the whole thing is a confidence pitch to his investors. Invesors likely to be getting nervous about payments to staff and less than stellar performance of the business. suggestions in the press that they were trying to cover up the poor figures.

 

So maytbe this was all a confidence trick (hes so wealthy and confident that hes buying a football team) for investors now so deeply into 'Slunc' that sometimes they'd be prepared to fund another round of investment. maybe we were a part of the plan for another round of investment to keep slync going. 

 

all sounds very similar to this lot: https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/dec/20/why-wework-went-wrong

[kevinhectoring]

1 hour ago, Coconut's Beard said:

 

Again, it wasn't Slync buying us. Their balance sheet would have no bearing on his takeover attempt

 

Sure it’s nothing to do with the slync balance sheet. But the valuation of slync (one would have been agreed amongst the investors) would be important to q/efl, because it’s a major factor in ascertaining CK’s wealth (because he’s a major shareholder).
 

That valuation would be mostly driven by projected turnover and earnings.
The Forbes article suggests current turnover might have been overstated so there’s every chance the investors provided funding based on an inflated valuation. 

Edited July 22, 2022 by kevinhectoring

[LERam]

2 hours ago, Unlucky Alf said:

I said in a previous post...that the internet is a wonderful tool for + or - projects, It's documented that large companies were chucking his company millions of $s, I assume they went into the companies bank account, A simple print off with references, Bank statements, Company credentials, All the things that's needed to move forward, It's been said that Q, EFL and even Nixon "SAW THE FUNDS" what did they see...£23million pounds stacked against a wall or a bank statement saying there's money there and has been transferred. 

Now for an old timer like me I can struggle with the intricacies of the Internet, But there's organisations out there...legitimate/illegal that can produce miracles out of thin air.

My question is this...what did the 3 above see?  

I honestly think after reading that article, that he has transferred the money out his company "investing" account, of which he only has access.

He's got this money sitting in his account or a holding account which he has shown as proof

He's gone to transfer millions, money laundering has asked more questions, he's got cold feet as its not really his own personal wealth.

I think his crypto story is fabricated as he knows it's impossible for anyone to verify it.

 

[kevinhectoring]

1 minute ago, LERam said:

I honestly think after reading that article, that he has transferred the money out his company "investing" account, of which he only has access.

He's got this money sitting in his account or a holding account which he has shown as proof

He's gone to transfer millions, money laundering has asked more questions, he's got cold feet as its not really his own personal wealth.

I think his crypto story is fabricated as he knows it's impossible for anyone to verify it.

 

On this basis he likely goes to prison