cannable Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 4 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said: I love Martin. I thought he did alright today. But let’s stop blaming the midfield for when he doesn’t do well. If he plays badly, it’s on him. No excuses. We can’t keep crying out for a 2014 Craig Bryson. It’s not an excuse though when it’s a reason Everybody knows he is slow, everybody knows that he doesn’t have the legs to constantly run the channels Even if you can’t get runners off of him, get players close to him and let him do a Shefki Kuqi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 35 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said: Martin's day at Derby has gone. Time for him to move on. Oh dear, he did it ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimmu Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 I haven't read every single post from the topic so I'm not sure has someone pointed this one out... We all know his strenghts and those really are beneficial for us. At the same time, his weaknesses are as obvious as his strengths and IMO makes us pay, especially against better teams. For example, the last two games has been good example how his lack of movement is very, very detrimental to our defensive shape when we don't have the ball. He should be the first line of defense and unfortunately for the rest of the team, that's non-existent. Cocu got it horrible wrong when we tried to play Rooney behind him. That made it two immobile players to guide WBA's build-up where we want it to.... 45 minutes was enough for Cocu but that was suicidal tactic straight from the start. I think we should look for other options upfront. He is good option against about half of the teams in this league, so would be useful surely but also I think we could do better with someone else leading the line. After all, we should be aiming to win these games we have recently played. I'm pretty sure this my concern was shared with Lampard (and I have to reluctantly admit, Rowett). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 34 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: Yes, of course. But he was available and he did work hard and there was some nice link up today. He's shown he's as good as he was in Mac1 days, the supporting cast however sometimes aren't. The Blackburn game wasn't that 'long ago'. If it had been Waghorn or Marriott up there you'd have to say there wasn't enough creativity today, but before we equalised and until the Hamer gaff we certainly looked better. How much do you think one striker can do, even Vydra needed Hudds! I mean I don’t disagree with some of what you’re saying, but he isn’t as good as he used to be back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyinLiverpool Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 7 minutes ago, David said: Oh dear, he did it ? rising to the challenge... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 2 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said: rising to the challenge... Unlike Martin ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 30 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said: I love Martin. I thought he did alright today. But let’s stop blaming the midfield for when he doesn’t do well. If he plays badly, it’s on him. No excuses. We can’t keep crying out for a 2014 Craig Bryson. The 2014 Bryson will be nothing compared with the 2021 Knight and Sibley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkFruitsRam7 Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 37 minutes ago, cannable said: It’s not an excuse though when it’s a reason Everybody knows he is slow, everybody knows that he doesn’t have the legs to constantly run the channels Even if you can’t get runners off of him, get players close to him and let him do a Shefki Kuqi I understand. But whenever Martin doesn’t play well, it’s “he didn’t get the support”. No-one else gets that sort of treatment. I just find it frustrating when people can’t seem to accept that he might just have had a bad game. FWIW, I thought he was one of our better players today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 16 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said: I understand. But whenever Martin doesn’t play well, it’s “he didn’t get the support”. No-one else gets that sort of treatment. I just find it frustrating when people can’t seem to accept that he might just have had a bad game. FWIW, I thought he was one of our better players today. Martin doesn’t play well when he has support but his touch is off or he makes bad decision Martin not being in the game because he’s isolated isn’t his fault, it is a lack support Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 51 minutes ago, Srg said: I mean I don’t disagree with some of what you’re saying, but he isn’t as good as he used to be back then. I think he is, I think most of the rest of the team isn't yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyinLiverpool Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 5 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: I think he is, I think most of the rest of the team isn't yet That's like saying WWE is competitive; it's the rest of the world that's fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 17 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said: That's like saying WWE is competitive; it's the rest of the world that's fixed. So we're as good as under Mac1 are we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB SPORTS Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 1 hour ago, cannable said: It’s not an excuse though when it’s a reason Everybody knows he is slow, everybody knows that he doesn’t have the legs to constantly run the channels Even if you can’t get runners off of him, get players close to him and let him do a Shefki Kuqi Chrissy's technical standard is premier league, the issue that stops him being a premier league player is his National League pace. That's why he isn't playing in the premier league (or as far i can remember linked with a transfer to a premier league club). The players around him have to make up for his lack of mobility either by very accurate passing and being in the right position to receive the ball off him(that takes a lot of energy and perception). This is why now with youngsters we need to change to someone who maybe less technical but has more pace and directness. Unfortunately i don't think he will be here next season as we will need his wages to pay for some incomings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 1 minute ago, SIXTEEN AGAIN said: This is why now with youngsters we need to change to someone who maybe less technical but has more pace and directness. Waghorn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 1 hour ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said: I understand. But whenever Martin doesn’t play well, it’s “he didn’t get the support”. No-one else gets that sort of treatment. I just find it frustrating when people can’t seem to accept that he might just have had a bad game. FWIW, I thought he was one of our better players today. If there aren't other players up with him who is he going to pass to? That's what I would think people mean by support and its a valid point. There was a sublime sideways pass he made from our left back position today and it made for a good move forwards. You need players with Martin's skill - ready runners alone will not deliver against good teams. I rate Martin highly but if we are looking to improve we need someone a bit quicker but who also has his skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB SPORTS Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: Waghorn. Probably, but i think we will look to a younger model for the future. I like Waggy he is the new Johnny Russell of the team, with respect to teamwork he is the glue. But for a new main striker i think Phil will fish in a different pond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, SIXTEEN AGAIN said: Probably, but i think we will look to a younger model for the future. I like Waggy he is the new Johnny Russell of the team, with respect to teamwork he is the glue. But for a new main striker i think Phil will fish in a different pond. How will he afford the bait? Sell Marriott? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 Martin is an excellent footballer and a joy to watch, but he’s the definition of one dimensional. You either have to buy into him or not, McClaren did and he was such a joy to watch. He’s the best at what he does, but the worst at what you want a striker to do that isn’t played like him. Cocu needs to make his choice and I think he will eventually leave. He will always be liked here and there’s not many players that have accolade in the last decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean (hick) Saunders Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 The better and more confident the team is, the more we will get out of CM. I think we need to keep him for next season and improve the attacking midfield and we will be there or there abouts. CM will play his part as he always does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeedsRam1999 Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 4 hours ago, RoyMac5 said: Probably not but he can't run around at pace so that's it really. Lots of nice link up with Sibley, et al, and a couple of decent clearing headers, a reasonable shot and yet more freekicks not given. I thought Sibley was a bit selfish at times, and could have played him in but you can understand it. As for the ref, I bet Rooney finds it an eye-opener not being 'the big boys' that they favour so often! Thought we had a few free kicks today that weren’t given. Obviously has a lack of pace but makes up for it in other areas. Just need forwards who are willing to play off him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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