Day Posted March 3, 2019 Author Share Posted March 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, Inglorius said: I've probably hijacked this thread then my original point which I still stand by is the one in my last post. If we are solely to confine discussions to the precise title of the thread then that's not something I agree with, looking back over previous threads there have been numerous and substantive digressions which haven't been stopped by moderators so why start now. Haven’t stopped the thread, I just see no reason to carry on this discussion between you and me that’s all. The topic will remain open and I’m happy to discuss with others and read conversations between others as I do across the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inglorius Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Just now, David said: Haven’t stopped the thread, I just see no reason to carry on this discussion between you and me that’s all. The topic will remain open and I’m happy to discuss with others and read conversations between others as I do across the forum. But you're limiting the scope of the thread by not engaging in what you perceive as a digression from the original title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Tbh i don't think frank does know his best team. I'm not sure he even believes in the concept of a single 'best' team. He likes to rotate. Whether thats because of the age of the players, or fatigue or injuries, who knows? looking back i think we were in too much of a rush to build a completely new side and simultaneously target promotion. Given the age of the team, the expiring contracts, and the accumulation of dross, the fans would have accepted a longer term rebuild around younger players and a few experienced heads, especially if the football was good to watch. right now its hard to pick a team especially given our injuries and our post-albino weakness in central midfield. I know frank isn't a fan of 442 but sometimes the missionary position is the right one. keep it simple. Summat everyone understands...... Carson or Roos bogle Keogh Tomori Cole Holmes Mount. Johnson. Wilson Marriott Waghorn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inglorius Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 5 minutes ago, David said: Haven’t stopped the thread, I just see no reason to carry on this discussion between you and me that’s all. The topic will remain open and I’m happy to discuss with others and read conversations between others as I do across the forum. When I said stopped the implication was to have brought the discussion back on track not to lock the thread you totally misunderstand me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rammieib Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Carson Tomori Keogh Davies Forsyth Huddlestone Mount Wilson Waghorn Holmes Marriott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 3, 2019 Author Share Posted March 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, RamNut said: I'm not sure he even believes in the concept of a single 'best' team. He likes to rotate. Whether thats because of the age of the players, or fatigue or injuries, who knows? Only caught a bit of his RD interview after the game, I’m sure it was on there he mentioned something along the lines of he’s not interested in a consistent team but one that can win games which could back this theory up. I just can’t believe he would rotate and make as many changes as he has if players were fit. With him not looking to use injuries as an excuse, I think he’s aware that using it as an excuse would say that the rest of the squad simply aren’t good enough, something as a manager you would want to avoid for obvious reasons. I questioned Huddlestone’s ability to play 3 games a week, this is where rotation would come in, one or two changes, not wholesale changes we saw yesterday. Problem he has now, very few players are showing enough to retain the shirt, stick with the players he’s slammed for not changing anything, make changes he’s slammed for not knowing his best team with 2 months to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richinspain Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 1 hour ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: Roos Bogle Keogh tomori forsyth Mount Huddlestone Bryson Wilson Lawrence Martin Subs Carson,Waghorn,Wisdom,Lowe,mountjohnson,Marriott Much as I rate Marriott's,he is a poacher not a main striker and Wilson and Lawrence are better wingers. Waghorn is a poor man's Martin without the same ability to hold up the ball and bring others into the action,scoring on the overlap..... I like the idea that if Mount is having an off day or gets injured, we can replace him with Mount off the bench. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 2 hours ago, David said: Missed out Marriott. I wouldn’t have put the team out Frank did yesterday, but when you see these teams written down and they are all missing numerous key players, I’m not sure it’s fair to say he doesn’t know his best team. What I would say is he probably hasn’t been able to name his best team for a number of weeks now and the players that have come in haven’t showed enough consistency to keep the shirt. To echo his words last night, it’s not an excuse but it is a reason. We have the players capable of putting a decent team out that would give anyone a game on its day, what we don’t have is the quality in depth to come in and play the football Frank talks about. As we saw under McClaren, our troubles have come from not being able to find a Plan B to cope with the loss of key players. The fact he’s being called a tinker man says it’s not for a lack of trying. I can only disagree on the tinkering issue. As you have said, we don't know players fitness levels etc but in my eyes he finds an excuse to change the team way more than any manager I remember for a while. Players like Johnson, Evans, Nugent, Jozefzoon and Bennett can go from 0 minutes to a start and back to 0 minutes week to week. Holmes can be RB, RW, CM. Wisdom has played both full back roles but then vanished twice. Johnson pops up here and there. For a short time Malone and Forsyth were rotating. I'm not saying he hasn't been obstructed by fitness issues but I do think there's been a helping of unnecessary tinkering too. It seems as teams are all clicking now that we are very much a broken mess. We are all here picking teams and I don't like any of them that much. We all have 2 poorly disciplined midfielders and a slightly unreliable DM to do loads of work. And there's no way of avoiding it no matter who you pick. Most of us have Bogle at RB. I like him and I love that he's involved. But there's no options there and he's being exposed a lot. Which is expected but still, it's not helping. We have wingers full of flair but again a lack of discipline. Apart from Waghorn they all want to come inside for glory. They don't especially like getting behind the ball and just holding positions. They're like Andi Weimann's who want to skip off somewhere. Little Meerkat heads looking for a throughball. So I'm happy to have some excuses from Frank. But I definitely think he's made a couple of big ones too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, richinspain said: I like the idea that if Mount is having an off day or gets injured, we can replace him with Mount off the bench. ? Didn't you know he was a twin ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOB BIGGS Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 I can understand Frank’s dilemma at not knowing his best starting 11. The best 11 at home against a team that is struggling might not be the best 11 to play away against a high flying team or a team that are physically strong. We lack players with a physical presence in midfield for those games where we can expect a rough ride. Yesterday was a culmination of injuries, muddled thinking and desperation. So, for me, I’d put Carson, Bogle, Keogh, Tomori, Forsyth, Mount, Waghorn, Wilson and Marriott in when fit. I’m leaving King out of this although I thought he might have done a really good job. For the other 2, I’d be looking at Bryson, Johnson, Holmes, Huddlestone, Jozefzoon or Lawrence depending on the type of game we’re expecting. What a problem though! That’s 6 midfield players of varying quality, pace and strength. You can add Ball and Sibley to make 8. How great it would be if George Thorne could be a realistic 9th (I see he wasn’t in Luton’s squad yesterday). Of course, the problem with this is that 3 of the first 8 outfield players haven’t been fit for some time so some of the above replacements have come in and struggled. They’re not like for like midfield replacements though. We’ve lot loads of midfield players but in other ways, we haven’t got enough! Cole or Malone for Forsyth and Wisdom for Bogle are better fits in defence but constant chopping and changing rarely brings any benefit. Who’d be a manager.....apart from all of us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 3, 2019 Author Share Posted March 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, Alpha said: I can only disagree on the tinkering issue. As you have said, we don't know players fitness levels etc but in my eyes he finds an excuse to change the team way more than any manager I remember for a while. Players like Johnson, Evans, Nugent, Jozefzoon and Bennett can go from 0 minutes to a start and back to 0 minutes week to week. Holmes can be RB, RW, CM. Wisdom has played both full back roles but then vanished twice. Johnson pops up here and there. For a short time Malone and Forsyth were rotating. I'm not saying he hasn't been obstructed by fitness issues but I do think there's been a helping of unnecessary tinkering too. It seems as teams are all clicking now that we are very much a broken mess. We are all here picking teams and I don't like any of them that much. We all have 2 poorly disciplined midfielders and a slightly unreliable DM to do loads of work. And there's no way of avoiding it no matter who you pick. Most of us have Bogle at RB. I like him and I love that he's involved. But there's no options there and he's being exposed a lot. Which is expected but still, it's not helping. We have wingers full of flair but again a lack of discipline. Apart from Waghorn they all want to come inside for glory. They don't especially like getting behind the ball and just holding positions. They're like Andi Weimann's who want to skip off somewhere. Little Meerkat heads looking for a throughball. So I'm happy to have some excuses from Frank. But I definitely think he's made a couple of big ones too Fitness issues are one thing, injuries another. Take yesterday Wilson on the bench, when I saw the team I looked at it and thought this is a reaction to Monday, even down to Roos who you could argue the only mistake he’s really made is the goal Forest scored. Was only after we found out he was ill just a couple of days before and sounded like he didn’t really want to use him. Would be interested to know how many more we’re forced changes that we’ve not known about? Not looking to defend every team selection and blame it on fitness issues or injuries, I think it’s just as likely we’re seeing more rotation than we’re used to through experience of his playing days. I know the old school, back in my day, will say play the same team week in week out, these lot don’t know how well they’ve got it in their pink boots. But Frank spent the most of his career playing for a club regularly competing in Europe during the week, games which the big clubs would rest players ahead of. Maybe his thinking is to keep the players fresh with the amount of games we have to play, problem is as I’ve said before I don’t believe we have the quality needed to come in and play the football he wants to play, a problem which is worsened by the loss of key players to injuries this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Roos, bogle, Keogh, Davies, Cole, Huddlestone, Mount, Holmes, Josefzoon, Waghorn, Wilson Bench: Carson, Malone, Tomori, Johnson, Lawrence, Bennett, Marriott Don’t buy we can’t put out our strongest team, imo the players who are out wouldn’t make that much difference. Tomori for example is not a particular downgrade on Davies, would only have him in for experience. Granted our squad depth has been weakened, but overall really only Mount would make a marked difference to the team at the moment compared to what we’ve got at the minute. And if we’re that reliant on a 19 year old were in trouble. Imo injuries don’t ever help matters as they reduce your options, but yo blame how horrific our recent performances on them is just ludicrous imo. This isn’t even a crisis really injury wise given what we have available, and the level of performance recently is inexcusable for a team in even the top half of the championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Our players are not looking fresh - they are wilting at the first cross or challenge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Come the end of the season this question gets much harder when the loan players leave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 3, 2019 Author Share Posted March 3, 2019 8 minutes ago, Millenniumram said: but yo blame how horrific our recent performances on them is just ludicrous imo. I haven’t “blamed” at all, just highlighted the difficulty Frank has had with injuries so it’s unfair to say he doesn’t know his best team. As for ludicrous, you’ve just left our second and third top goalscorers on the bench! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, David said: I haven’t “blamed” at all, just highlighted the difficulty Frank has had with injuries so it’s unfair to say he doesn’t know his best team. As for ludicrous, you’ve just left our second and third top goalscorers on the bench! Wasn’t aimed at you, more at frank making excuses (haven’t seen the interview but heard some say he blamed the injuries, may be an exaggeration), I get the point of the thread certainly. I have indeed and while I toyed with the idea of Lawrence and Marriott, I actually think that team looks more balanced without them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 3, 2019 Author Share Posted March 3, 2019 Just now, Millenniumram said: Wasn’t aimed at you, more at frank making excuses (haven’t seen the interview but heard some say he blamed the injuries, may be an exaggeration), I get the point of the thread certainly. I have indeed and while I toyed with the idea of Lawrence and Marriott, I actually think that team looks more balanced without them. Oops, 2+2=5, sorry! Frank hasn’t blamed injuries either by the way, in fact he wasn’t looking to use them as an excuse. Jozefzoon looked bright coming off the bench against Brighton, but apart from Hull away he hasn’t really showed enough to starting for me, not ahead of Lawrence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Ram Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Just some observations. Can't believe how many leave Tomori out of the side. If it's Keogh and Davies centrally surely Tomori gets in at right back? Unless Marriott and Waggers play as a central striker pair they can't play in the same team. Waggers has done nothing out wide. Finally a number are saying how much we have missed Mount and Lawrence. We miss the Mount we saw up until Xmas. He has been invisible since Santa delivered the pressies. And is the Messiah Tom the same Tom that half on here use as scapegoat number two after our Captain?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamikaze Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Our Under 18's I'd say... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 Roos Bogle, Keogh, Tomori, Forsyth Wilson, Bird, Mount Waghorn, Marriott, Lawrence Subs: Carson, Wisdom, Huddlestone, King, Bennett, Jozefzoon, Nugent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.