archied Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Been mulling this over given our recent debates on here is football entertainment ? Is it entertainment in the sense of a film ,theatre ,pop concert ,? you see to me football is sport and all this entertainment fixation is a recent thing brought in by sky and corporate sponsorship, sport in its truest form is not predictable in terms of results , quality of match,bout or whatever it be , what im hearing on here to my mind are not Derby fans ,or sports fans they are either old Derby fans who have been tainted by this modern idea that football or any other sporting match up can be controlled or contrived to be an entertaining spectacle within certain parameters or or they are newer fans who are being led to believe that that is what sport / football is it's not sport is competition and the aim is to win / beat the opponent and that was always where the excitement lay for those who got hooked on a club , we are now being blighted with the casual football watcher who sits in front of sky television and demands to see the most expensive players hogged by fewer and fewer clubs turn out a scripted formula of what is expected to get viewing figures up very very much like WWF, im a Derby fan , hooked since the age of five , I will watch the odd game on sky as a neutral but that is light entertainment ,there's no heart and soul in it for me , there's no passion , there's no excitement , there's no hurt ,there's no edge of the seat ,it means nothing to me it makes me sad to see posters on here who I'm sure believe they are Derby fans allow themselves to become so diluted ,so mislead that they are switching off from THEIR club if they are not Chelsea ,Man U , Man City,arsenal and compounding the problem by being happier to boost the viewing figures and pockets of the sky darlings than support their own club , but hey crack on , give up your season tickets ,stop going and tune in to sky WWF/ fantasy football, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ossieram Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 It is a sport and the aim is to beat your opponent. Do Rugby fans come away from games moaning about the lack of entertainment, are tennis fans miffed if Murray doesn't hit at least 4 drop volleys in a game, or if the British curling team don't do triple salco's as they go down the ice? I go to see Derby win and couldn't give a toss if the ball goes in off Keoghs left knacker or a 40 yard thunderbolt by Tom Ledley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 The way I see it; there is no reason a side can’t be attractive and successful. So if you’re given a licence to build there is no reason you shouldn’t build an attractive side. Unexpected seasons of success based on ugly football are also enjoyable. There is absoloutely no excuse for a manager, who has time, to build an ugly side. I loved the winning run under Mac 2 and 06/07 because you appreciated that the football was s*** out of necessity. You knew teams wouldn’t score against us and that Ince or Barnes would produce some magic. Clough and Burley took longer but eventually built attractive sides that played football that was to a standard above this division. I can accept and enjoy both former scenarios. BUILDING ugly is just ‘no’. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tibbs Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 23 minutes ago, ossieram said: It is a sport and the aim is to beat your opponent. Do Rugby fans come away from games moaning about the lack of entertainment, are tennis fans miffed if Murray doesn't hit at least 4 drop volleys in a game, or if the British curling team don't do triple salco's as they go down the ice? Nobody remembers the Hungarian curling team of 1950 though do they, but the football team? Of course they do. Same with the Dutch and Germans in the 70's, the Brazilian world up winning team of 1970, France and Argentina in the 80's.... eh even us as a nation in 1990! Football's probably the most expressive sport in the world so let's not pretend it isn't and is on par with Chess and Darts just because they're sports. People are getting ate up about the word "entertainment", I'm pretty sure nobody chooses willingly to watch Championship football to be entertained for £40 a pop. If they do they're daft. To watch a team trying to play good football though? That shouldn't be too much to ask for. It is 'the beautiful game' after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Its like synchronised swimming but with tackling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Ram Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Football, for me, is enjoying watching a team on the same wavelength. In that team, I expect two or three to be “ not quite at it” having a bad day, things not coming off for them but understanding what should be happening if all things were equal. The result isn’t the be all and end all for me, although a win is always most welcome. I enjoy seeing players up for spilling blood for the team if they have to, united in the cause, and having confidence in their teammates ability and being almost telepathic regarding what so and so will do when they’ve got the ball, where he expects another so and so to be to receive it and move it on. You don’t go to listen to a symphony and have a few of the orchestra playing difficult jazz while the others play what they are supposed to. 11 guys, (ideally) all knowing their role, playing as a cohesive unit, a team, that’s football and entertainment to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 At the end of the day it's a load of blokes (or birds) kicking a pigs bladder round a field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkFruitsRam7 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 51 minutes ago, archied said: I'm a Derby fan , hooked since the age of five , I will watch the odd game on sky as a neutral but that is light entertainment ,there's no heart and soul in it for me , there's no passion , there's no excitement , there's no hurt ,there's no edge of the seat ,it means nothing to me This. ******* this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 I have heard watching your own team described as war without deaths. The historian AJP Taylor described war as long periods of boredom interrupted by short bursts of excitement. The same could also be said of following your own team. Whilst those short bursts of excitement may define you to others or casual fans, those of us who are devoted still find joy, comradeship and a sense of belonging like no other during those long periods of so called boredom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 1 hour ago, archied said: Been mulling this over given our recent debates on here is football entertainment ? Is it entertainment in the sense of a film ,theatre ,pop concert ,? you see to me football is sport and all this entertainment fixation is a recent thing brought in by sky and corporate sponsorship, sport in its truest form is not predictable in terms of results , quality of match,bout or whatever it be , what im hearing on here to my mind are not Derby fans ,or sports fans they are either old Derby fans who have been tainted by this modern idea that football or any other sporting match up can be controlled or contrived to be an entertaining spectacle within certain parameters or or they are newer fans who are being led to believe that that is what sport / football is it's not sport is competition and the aim is to win / beat the opponent and that was always where the excitement lay for those who got hooked on a club , we are now being blighted with the casual football watcher who sits in front of sky television and demands to see the most expensive players hogged by fewer and fewer clubs turn out a scripted formula of what is expected to get viewing figures up very very much like WWF, im a Derby fan , hooked since the age of five , I will watch the odd game on sky as a neutral but that is light entertainment ,there's no heart and soul in it for me , there's no passion , there's no excitement , there's no hurt ,there's no edge of the seat ,it means nothing to me it makes me sad to see posters on here who I'm sure believe they are Derby fans allow themselves to become so diluted ,so mislead that they are switching off from THEIR club if they are not Chelsea ,Man U , Man City,arsenal and compounding the problem by being happier to boost the viewing figures and pockets of the sky darlings than support their own club , but hey crack on , give up your season tickets ,stop going and tune in to sky WWF/ fantasy football, This is misguided and muddled - muddled over what 'entertainment' means and also trying to define what Derby fans should be. When I watched Kevin Hector , Alan Durban and Bruce Rioch years ago I enjoyed their skill with the ball and it was entertaining. The same could be said when watching Eranio and Baiano play their first home games their skill and the interplay and passing was entertaining and added something distinct from and no less important than the result of the game. There are lots of things that contribute to making watching football entertaining winning after falling behind, a 0-0 draw between two skilful sides can be entertaining .It's different to entertainment at a concert etc and that perhaps explains why so many us have kept following the Rams for so long. Don't understand what you mean by "they are either old Derby fans who have been tainted by this modern idea that football or any other sporting match up can be controlled or contrived" and "they are not Derby fans"# Get over yourself You won't define me nor many other fans who i speak to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamRam Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 52 minutes ago, ossieram said: It is a sport and the aim is to beat your opponent. Do Rugby fans come away from games moaning about the lack of entertainment, are tennis fans miffed if Murray doesn't hit at least 4 drop volleys in a game, or if the British curling team don't do triple salco's as they go down the ice? I go to see Derby win and couldn't give a toss if the ball goes in off Keoghs left knacker or a 40 yard thunderbolt by Tom Ledley. So are you saying it’s the end result that matters and what happens in the previous 90 minutes is irrelevant. You can probably understand why attendances are dipping then, as you will probably get as much if not more enjoyment by staying at home and watching the score updates. Doesn’t mean you are less of a fan, you want derby to win, you just don’t want to lose the will to live watching the kind of football being served up recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Football when watching your own team is for me all about winning, scoring goals and getting as high up the footballing ladder as we can. Don’t give a f*** how we do it, as long as it’s sustainable long term. Some of our performances won’t yield results in the long term at the movement however as we don’t have enough control, and good teams will exploit that. That’s the problem atm, I don’t mind us not having 70% possession as long as we are playing a style that will yield results long term, and for that we need some fluidity and control. When a neutral however I view things entirely differently, football to me is a passing game, players like xavi and Andrea Pirlo epitomise how football should be played imo. Players passing the opposition off the park, and a team working as almost a completely synchronised unit, for that reason Barca circa 2012 were the best team at “football” in history imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Different for everyone innit? But would Ronnie O'Sullivan have such appeal if his playstyle was slow and cautious? Would Anthony Joshua be selling out stadiums if his knockouts were wins on points? When you think of your favourite teams to watch in the 80's, 90's who do you think of? What's your most memorable sporting moments? Who held the 100m record before Usain Bolt? Was he as famous? Entertainment is a part of it. For the viewer at least For competitor I'd say it's important to enjoy what you're doing. How can you be the best you can be if your not truly embracing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamRam Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 1 hour ago, archied said: Been mulling this over given our recent debates on here is football entertainment ? Is it entertainment in the sense of a film ,theatre ,pop concert ,? you see to me football is sport and all this entertainment fixation is a recent thing brought in by sky and corporate sponsorship, sport in its truest form is not predictable in terms of results , quality of match,bout or whatever it be , what im hearing on here to my mind are not Derby fans ,or sports fans they are either old Derby fans who have been tainted by this modern idea that football or any other sporting match up can be controlled or contrived to be an entertaining spectacle within certain parameters or or they are newer fans who are being led to believe that that is what sport / football is it's not sport is competition and the aim is to win / beat the opponent and that was always where the excitement lay for those who got hooked on a club , we are now being blighted with the casual football watcher who sits in front of sky television and demands to see the most expensive players hogged by fewer and fewer clubs turn out a scripted formula of what is expected to get viewing figures up very very much like WWF, im a Derby fan , hooked since the age of five , I will watch the odd game on sky as a neutral but that is light entertainment ,there's no heart and soul in it for me , there's no passion , there's no excitement , there's no hurt ,there's no edge of the seat ,it means nothing to me it makes me sad to see posters on here who I'm sure believe they are Derby fans allow themselves to become so diluted ,so mislead that they are switching off from THEIR club if they are not Chelsea ,Man U , Man City,arsenal and compounding the problem by being happier to boost the viewing figures and pockets of the sky darlings than support their own club , but hey crack on , give up your season tickets ,stop going and tune in to sky WWF/ fantasy football, If it makes you sad why are you bothered if fans turn up? Obviously you are our no 1 supporter who goes to every game and is happy no matter what, which gives you the right to be judgemental against other so fair enough. i still goto all homes games bar a couple when other commitments get in the way, and a few away games, so whilst obviously not on your level of support still think it’s a chore going to games at the moment. I don’t mind it when I have had a few, but even then admit to buying an extra pint or two at half time because it’s more entertaining than what’s happening on the field, and makes it a bit more entertaining when I finally make it to my seat. So I too must apologise to living up to your standards, and will keep an eye out for you at Boro with your no 1 fan badge on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ossieram Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 10 minutes ago, AdamRam said: So are you saying it’s the end result that matters and what happens in the previous 90 minutes is irrelevant. You can probably understand why attendances are dipping then, as you will probably get as much if not more enjoyment by staying at home and watching the score updates. Doesn’t mean you are less of a fan, you want derby to win, you just don’t want to lose the will to live watching the kind of football being served up recently. I enjoy being at the game and trying to create an atmosphere by singing and shouting and cheering the team on, that's what I enjoy doing and if we win it's all the much better. But that's just me and I don't expect everybody to be the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamRam Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 4 minutes ago, ossieram said: I enjoy being at the game and trying to create an atmosphere by singing and shouting and cheering the team on, that's what I enjoy doing and if we win it's all the much better. But that's just me and I don't expect everybody to be the same. That’s fair enough, still think anyone would have struggled in the first 45 minutes on Tuesday to enjoy that :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie20 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 18 minutes ago, AdamRam said: If it makes you sad why are you bothered if fans turn up? Obviously you are our no 1 supporter who goes to every game and is happy no matter what, which gives you the right to be judgemental against other so fair enough. i still goto all homes games bar a couple when other commitments get in the way, and a few away games, so whilst obviously not on your level of support still think it’s a chore going to games at the moment. I don’t mind it when I have had a few, but even then admit to buying an extra pint or two at half time because it’s more entertaining than what’s happening on the field, and makes it a bit more entertaining when I finally make it to my seat. So I too must apologise to living up to your standards, and will keep an eye out for you at Boro with your no 1 fan badge on. You go to the games, even accepting that the quality on offer at the moment is, in you opinion, not much by way of entertainment. In my book, whether I agree with your view or not, that makes you a fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamRam Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, DC-1975 said: But in his last fight, when the opponent was just there to survive (much like QPR), he wasn't very entertaining. I'm sure you'll pay for the next fight though! Maybe it takes both teams to entertain? Didn’t he win by a knock out and was on the front foot throughout the fight? I could understand where you were coming from if it was just one game and we were trying to be entertaining.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamRam Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, Wolfie20 said: You go to the games, even accepting that the quality on offer at the moment is, in you opinion, not much by way of entertainment. In my book, whether I agree with your view or not, makes you a fan. As much as I don’t think GR is the answer, I would have to agree with him that I’d happily take 30 games of us winning without playing entertaining football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Kevin Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 For me it's changed over the years ,40 to 50 odd years ago two wrong words about Derby would have got someone a good slap went everywhere home and away . Even during the third division days still went and sometimes fell asleep watching them after a good Friday nighr out and couldn't stand on the Popside so sat in the stands. Even to this day I am affected by our results happy when we win pissed off if we lose , I will not miss many home games ,but I am not enjoying what I see and I just hope it improves. I am quite frankly bored shitless watching a pedestrian team even if we win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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