Ince, Bent, Martin

[cloughandtaylor]

Ince is better because of the formation change, I still think Ince in the free roaming roll works best.

The hat trick will give his confidence a massive boost.

[Day]

Just now, super rams said:

Ince is better because of the formation change, I still think Ince in the free roaming roll works best.

The hat trick will give his confidence a massive boost.

But last season we was playing 4-3-3 with Ince and that was what made us stump up £4m+

[RicME85]

42 minutes ago, Daveo said:

I don't think Ince works with Martin in the team. I think we see the best of Ince with Bent.

No trolling. 

Agreed. Bent's movement gives Ince more space.

[cloughandtaylor]

2 minutes ago, Daveo said:

But last season we was playing 4-3-3 with Ince and that was what made us stump up £4m+

With Martin in the side we aim for 4-3-3, but end up playing 4-3-2-1 with Martin usually playing CF and holding the ball up to bring in Ince or Weimann into play. Ince is usually stuck out wide, man marked, with Bent in the side we do more of a proper 4-3-3, because Bent will interchange positions with the other 2. For me this gives Ince more freedom to roam and not be stuck out on the wing. Ince is a gifted player and like all gifted players let him move around the final third of the pitch where he can get into space and damage the opposition.

So yep I agree Ince is more suited to Bent up front, in a better 4-3-3 formation

[Dr. Gonzo]

back end of last season the goals were coming and the defending was rubbish, but there was no spine left, after thorne and martin, (and to some extent buxton)  were out, lots of flair, but no spine, this is also more than likely why keogh was on the ropes, we've got a few layers to add a backbone this year if we slip a disc, (sorry about these puns) i reckon daveos probably right,and its bloody good news to find out we might actually have an effective plan B now we actually strengthened where we were so vulnerable last year, summer brought no papering over cracks, they pretty much identified everything, and rectified it. personell wise at least. looking at the team clement has picked against the better teams, it seems he wants a solid team and formation, hence the inclusion of butterfield, johnson and thorne, thats a tough trio. DONT LOSE TO THEM! for the weaker teams maybe we are going to see abit more of this 4.2.3.1 malarky. or 4 2 4 as it is playing n their half.  we've such a flexible squad now, once the players are having more games in these roles, maybe we'll see some serious rams domination in the second half of the season. fingers crossed. 

[RamNut]

Ince did pretty well with martin in the team last year.

 

[Ambitious]

Ince is a player you have to give a bit of freedom too. I'm not saying he's a luxury player, because he's sensible on the ball and isn't afraid to put his foot in. However, in order to get him among the goals, you have to give him a sense of freedom in the final third. 

He's a 20-25 goal a season player at this level, it's just getting it out of him. McClaren could and Clement did tonight. 

[Day]

Just now, Ambitious said:

Ince is a player you have to give a bit of freedom too. I'm not saying he's a luxury player, because he's sensible on the ball and isn't afraid to put his foot in. However, in order to get him among the goals, you have to give him a sense of freedom in the final third. 

He's a 20-25 goal a season player at this level, it's just getting it out of him. McClaren could and Clement did tonight. 

When Martin wasn't in the team dropping deep.

[RamNut]

Keeper should have saved two of them.

[i-Ram]

I think Martin plays the way he does because he runs funny. It's like his inner thighs are stitched together.  Sometimes makes me laugh out loud when he does try to sprint. As you were.

[G STAR RAM]

4 minutes ago, RamNut said:

Keeper should have saved two of them.

I actually think a good keeper would have saved all 3.

[Day]

I used to rate Frank Fielding, thought he was hard done by 

[Srg]

Don't think Bent did a great deal tonight either, nothing that someone else couldn't have done. Missed the one glorious chance he had, and the linesman curtailed another. 

That said, don't really recall seeing Ince play centrally when Martin has played, so it's hard to judge apples with apples. 

[sage]

1 hour ago, Bris Vegas said:

One game doesn't really tell us much. Afterall, with Bent/Ince spearheading our attack last season we were utterly defenceless in midfield and shipped goals for fun.

That said, of the game I've seen this season, Brmingham away we created loads of chances with those two as well.

What exactly did we play today? 4-3-3? 4-2-3-1? 4-4-2?

 

4-2-3-1 till Butterfield came on

[jagerbob]

1 hour ago, sage said:

4-2-3-1 till Butterfield came on

Yep Johnson was sat pretty deep. So was hendrick, and to put it kindly you dont even notice Hendrick is there in that position. We looked so much better when Hendrick went off and George came on.

[ketteringram]

1 hour ago, Srg said:

Don't think Bent did a great deal tonight either, nothing that someone else couldn't have done. Missed the one glorious chance he had, and the linesman curtailed another. 

That said, don't really recall seeing Ince play centrally when Martin has played, so it's hard to judge apples with apples. 

Exactly! Different position. 

[Rev]

Bent did nothing tonight, other than making the cross run to pull a defender away for Ince's 2nd, or supplying the pass for his 3rd.

[YorkshireRam]

3 hours ago, Daveo said:

Bent is a poacher, plays higher up the pitch, this allows Ince to come in more central and cause problems.

Had Martin played tonight he would have dropped deeper trying to hold the ball up, this is how Martin likes to play and would have Forced Ince out wide. 

I'm not saying drop Martin. I just don't think we will see the best out of them together.

This is an excellent point, the amount of space Ince had tonight was scary but was this because Bristol weren't tightly marking enough or because Bent was pulling them higher up the pitch?

Probably a mixture of the two but we can agree it was against poor opposition tonight so not the best example really. It'll be interesting to see how they fare if they both play vs Ipswich.

In my opinion, the reason Ince hasn't succeeded this season thus far is because he didn't seem to be taking many risks going forward. I can't remember him trying to attempt anything like the chance he created for himself for his first goal tonight, it's clear he's got the ability to pull it off, it's just he never seemed to try to. 

Hopefully tonight will give him the confidence to carry on trying because we saw last season, Ince can win a game entirely on his own!

[Dimmu]

IMO it's obvious if Ince plays in the middle, it works better with Bent than Martin. Martin and Ince would be searching those same pockets and be on each others way.

Byt the way, Ince had more tackles than any other our player yesterday. Freedom suits him well.

[ramsbottom]

6 hours ago, YorkshireRam said:

This is an excellent point, the amount of space Ince had tonight was scary but was this because Bristol weren't tightly marking enough or because Bent was pulling them higher up the pitch?

Probably a mixture of the two but we can agree it was against poor opposition tonight so not the best example really. It'll be interesting to see how they fare if they both play vs Ipswich.

In my opinion, the reason Ince hasn't succeeded this season thus far is because he didn't seem to be taking many risks going forward. I can't remember him trying to attempt anything like the chance he created for himself for his first goal tonight, it's clear he's got the ability to pull it off, it's just he never seemed to try to. 

Hopefully tonight will give him the confidence to carry on trying because we saw last season, Ince can win a game entirely on his own!

That's because in a 4-3-3 with Martin he'd have been down the touchline instead of in the centre.  Same with the 2nd goal, he starts in a central position.  As for the 3rd, he's wide but Bent was wider creating the space for him to turn and run into.  I still think Martin will be back in for Saturday as his hold-up play will be needed in away games, but it's nice to know we could potentially rotate a bit more at home against (no offence to Brizzle) lesser teams where we know we can control the game.