RodleyRam Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 I've got to say I'm now totally unhappy about cloughs reign. I get he has done some good but IMO the cons outweigh the pros. Why oh why does he refuse to give players such as Jacobs any real chance. I mean bringing him on in the 89th minute is just pointless. Just wanted to point out that we were winning 1-0 up until the 80th minute against Leicester... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbobram Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Just wanted to point out that we were winning 1-0 up until the 80th minute against Leicester... the games not 80 mins long though, got to see the game out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodleyRam Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 I believe that the sands of time are running out for clough and the majority of objective rams fans will come to look back on him as one of the worst managers the club have ever had. I would totally disagree with that sentence! Whenever Clough leaves the club we will be in a far better position than when he came. Most objective fans will recognise that and to put him in the category of 'worst ever' managers is bordering on the ridiculous. Have we got relegated under Clough? Have the performances been an embarrassment week in, week out? Are we close to financial melt down as a result of Clough's management? Have we seen anything other than relatively steady improvement in performances and league position in the last 5 years? Worst manager in history?! What are you basing that assessment on? The Clough legacy - fantastic, progressive academy, philosophy of how we're run as a club, largely within our means with an emphasis on hard work and nurturing talent and how we play football (for the most part) on the pitch will stand anyone coming in after him in a far better position than when he took over. Assuming that we continue to progress in the manner in which we have, I for one will view him as one of the better managers we've had in our history. All opinions though innit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodleyRam Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 the games not 80 mins long though, got to see the game out. Yes but the point was being critical of not seeing Jacobs until the 89th minute, which didn't take into account that we weren't behind until the 83rd minute... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tibbs Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 If we don't get rid of him soon the name "Clough" will be remembered for all the wrong reasons at this club. Yeah, everyone will remember the 5 midtable finishes over us being Champions of England.... Outrageous comment! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Yeah, everyone will remember the 5 midtable finishes over us being Champions of England.... Outrageous comment! Was you alive when we were champions of England? Tell me your fondest memories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilkoRam Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Was you alive when we were champions of England? Tell me your fondest memories. Why does that matter when discussing how the name Clough will be associated with our club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Why does that matter when discussing how the name Clough will be associated with our club? It matters because the person I was speaking to mentioned what people remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rammieib Posted September 25, 2013 Author Share Posted September 25, 2013 Ambitious - I am curious to know what you believe Nigel (not the board/owners) are achieving here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSheep Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 I've read a lot of posts now about how Nigel has transformed the club, worked wonders changing it all, reducing the wage bill, bringing on youth etc. although I do thank and appreciate Nigel for the youth setup these weren't decision made by him were they. It's not like he came in and turned to the board and said "no no, put your chequebooks away I've got a better idea" and than took it upon himself to rid the club of high earners and bring through young players. Any manager coming in at the same time would have had the same blueprint handed to them. The same conditions to work under. Any other manager would have reduced the wage bill and relied more on youth because they had to. This was the new plan of the club, not Nigel. If you think he's done a good job then that's one thing but to list some of his achievements as 'reducing the wage bill' and 'brining in youth' is like listing 'he takes training sessions'. In short they were part of the job description. Run the team so the club can be somewhat self sufficient. It's not like managers in the past didn't put youth players in. Addison, Barnes, Holmes, Nyatanga off the top of my head. Using youth players isn't ground breaking.On the flip side you can easily list under his faults as 'too narrow in the search of new players' we don't appear to have the most extensive scouting process. I also don't see his ability to spot raw potential, or nurture raw potential. How many signings that have "failed" do people chalk up to 'didn't kick on'? No manager has a 100% record when it comes to signings but, as is the case with most things, the good must outweigh the bad.guessing it was aimed at me and my previous post. I am not saying that what he did was achievements. What I was saying was that it seems people just look over what he has done like he has done nothing. And it sometimes takes the piss. Some people on here make him sound like he is the worst manager to grace the earth(after billy Davies ) And I honestly wouldn't care if he got sacked tomorrow by the way as I don't think he could take us any further. But never the more he is a solid championship manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McMuffin Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Yeah, everyone will remember the 5 midtable finishes over us being Champions of England.... Outrageous comment! This season hasn't finished yet! Been watching for 20 years and the last 5 have been the most boring by far and that's reflected in the declining attendances. Watch them start to climb again once he's gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 8 games is nearly a fifth of the way through the season; and we are out of one of the 2 cup competitions. man utd have a track record of being able to put a run together that would put them back in contention following their worst start for years; but even the bookies dont put them as favs anymore. whereas your faith in us finishing within the top 6 is based upon what ? Given the only time we have ever come close to this after xmas is....anyone? I have never said I have faith in us finishing in the top 6. Using the last few seasons as a guide though, where we have made gradual improvement, we would finish above 10th which is going to have us on the very edge of the play offs at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bourneyesterday Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 I would totally disagree with that sentence! Whenever Clough leaves the club we will be in a far better position than when he came. Most objective fans will recognise that and to put him in the category of 'worst ever' managers is bordering on the ridiculous. Have we got relegated under Clough? Have the performances been an embarrassment week in, week out? Are we close to financial melt down as a result of Clough's management? Have we seen anything other than relatively steady improvement in performances and league position in the last 5 years? Worst manager in history?! What are you basing that assessment on? The Clough legacy - fantastic, progressive academy, philosophy of how we're run as a club, largely within our means with an emphasis on hard work and nurturing talent and how we play football (for the most part) on the pitch will stand anyone coming in after him in a far better position than when he took over. Assuming that we continue to progress in the manner in which we have, I for one will view him as one of the better managers we've had in our history. All opinions though innit. Look at the percentage of wins per games played. Where are the results of the this fantastic academy ? Will Hughes, who may go to be an England international or he may not, it certainly won't be for us, Anyone else ? Anyone knocking our door down to buy our young stars, no thought not. We are no further up the league in terms of position than when he took charge. I have seen clough snr's Derby, Mackay's Derby, A. Cox's Derby, Jim Smith's Derby and George Burley's Derby, all of whom played better football. Have you forgotten 5-2 at Florist, losing to ssausagehorpe at home, losing to Shrewsbury in the cup, losing to Crawley Town in the FA cup and it was'nt even reported as a shock because they had spent more than us. This manager has no more ambition than to be home in time for tea otherwise he would have walked away long since due to the lack of funds. Finally, despite repeated false statements from posters to this board the debt has not come down during Clough's managerial tenure , it could even be higher now than when he took over. You are right, football is all about opinions and mine for what its worth is that Nigel Clough will not be remembered positively once the dust settles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McMuffin Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Who's ready to turn the heat up in the next home game if the worst happens on Saturday? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cisse Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Who's ready to turn the heat up in the next home game if the worst happens on Saturday? I'm not. I'll be there supporting the team until my voice gets hoarse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptherams Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Just wanted to point out that we were winning 1-0 up until the 80th minute against Leicester... Every game we play poorly or concede weak goals for about 10 minutes either once or twice in a match. I remember a few years ago when it was the opposite. We would play badly for 70 minutes and have two good ten minute periods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Who's ready to turn the heat up in the next home game if the worst happens on Saturday? Why not if we win though? If he's not good enough then 3pts over Forest can't change that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 Why not if we win though? If he's not good enough then 3pts over Forest can't change that? There's always one who has to be sensible. What is hard to understand? If we win, go quiet and don't post. If we lose, boo and call for the managers head. It's so bloody simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnram Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 This season hasn't finished yet! Been watching for 20 years and the last 5 have been the most boring by far and that's reflected in the declining attendances. Watch them start to climb again once he's gone. I like your posts a lot. Like just a few others on here you only appear when Derby lose so that saves a lot of time reading through threads. You never usually write more than a line or two and never ever have anything constructive for me to read so I don't have to try and see things from your view point. You are correct, the season hasn't finished yet, there is almost 83% left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicester Ram Posted September 25, 2013 Share Posted September 25, 2013 First post be gentle... I like analogy to Moyes(I'm not saying Clough is Moyes). He was at a club that expects to win a trophy regularly. Yet he won nothing and was praised for doing a good job. We are a club that have won little, the average position for us over time has been towards the bottom of the top division and we do not have the budget to match teams in our division. What do we expect? What we want is another matter. What if Clough gets us up what do we expect then? If we stay up and consolidate how long until people complain that we should be in Europe? I'm grateful the club is no longer a laughing stock and is stable. You ask your work mates what they think of Derby now - I bet the majority of them think we're in a decent state. We play some good stuff at times, other times we are awful. What do I expect - top ten. What do I think - 8th (Russell is getting better, I'm sure we'll get a CB and I'm hoping for a right winger from Villa very soon). What do I want - the same as everyone. Finish top and stuff Forest twice - I've already got butterflys. You can stay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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