Gary Teale Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 We once used to win the reserve league year on year but non of the players produced or part of it were ever that good, a few steady eddy back up players like Jackson and boets but that's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Thats here and now I presume but it's not just about that is it but as your pushing me I wouldn't be averse to seeing Morch in goal. Gjokaj or Hanson CBs now and again. Hoggy at LB. Lowe anytime soon . Dawkins ,Dales and Wassell as midfield cover. I'll ask you a question lol did you know Hughes was ready for 1st team action because I wasn't sure at the time but credit Cloughie/Wassell for that he's been a revelation. Clough will know when some of these players are ready. PS Hendrie at RB who is John Hendries son looks solid. genuine question. It wasn't loaded. I have no problem personally if we never spent another penny on transfers if the crop coming through are up with the O'Brien, Hendrick, Hughes and Bennett level. I have no problem with not spending money at all, seeing how Burley constructed a squad never spending any, and given that recent decent players like Commons and Green were free transfers too. I haven't seen any of the youngsters so wouldn't want to judge them as good or not good enough to break through to the first team. In the history of youth development though, only about 1% of players make it, which is a sad statistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 The truth is I'm not sure it's not and exact science with young players but I'm fairly confident we have some good ones in Cloughies set up . Trouble is the 1st team is about here and now and fans get impatient . I do some times think people need to look at the club set up a bit more which is not always easy when we are fed Top 6 is a must and every defeat hits hard. I think top 6 will be down the line but you never know it may just happen this season if we get Jeff fit. Russell is a good signing so who knows lol the reason people get pissy about the whole top six thing, if it even is that, .... I'll digress a bit, Personally I don't put a league position on it. If we finished 20th, but all of our players were doing their best and it was their level, it'd be acceptable, not ideal, but acceptable. When I judge Derby, I ask if the players are at 7/10 of their ability. When I compare against other teams, I do it on ability and not on wages or transfer fees because they don't win games or guarantee quality....so for me, if the team was full of youth players and getting beat, people would accept it as that would be somewhat expected as young lads are learning the game. The criticism stems from the team not performing to it's abilities, not the fact that we aren't top of the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcdcfc28 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Tick tock tick tock... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 not too much has got better under him. I don't think it would be possible to disagree with that statement more, even if I had been a trent end season ticket holder for 60 years. Absolute mad comment - to say Jewell left the club in the same health and position as Clough currently is in, is just absolute madness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Teale Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 This is different these are young lads growing together . The reserve league often had out of favour 1st team players supplementing the team. No it didn't, very rarely did a first team player play only when coming back from injury. Also quite regularly we put first team players in. Growing together? They are never going to play them all at once, it's about producing players good enough for the first team. We even won the reserve title under clough a rein but I don't think any player from that squad has broken through Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 I don't think it would be possible to disagree with that statement more, even if I had been a trent end season ticket holder for 60 years. Absolute mad comment - to say Jewell left the club in the same health and position as Clough currently is in, is just absolute madness. where did you dig that quote from? did you delete most of the post or something? I doubt I would post that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 where did you dig that quote from? did you delete most of the post or something? I doubt I would post that Yes, it's the post at the very top of this page.. Clough will be remembered as the bloke who babysat. Nothing has got worse under him, apart from the feeling of optimism, not too much has got better under him. Is the latter bit of your first paragraph - I understand you put not too much has got better, rather than nothing as got better - but for me, we're incredibly better both on and off the pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Yes, it's the post at the very top of this page.. Is the latter bit of your first paragraph - I understand you put not too much has got better, rather than nothing as got better - but for me, we're incredibly better both on and off the pitch. well, we were relegation battling or midtable nobodies prior to Billy, we were the same under Jewell, and we are the same right now! So factually not much has got better. When people look back, what will be the highlight of Clough's tenure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 well, we were relegation battling or midtable nobodies prior to Billy, we were the same under Jewell, and we are the same right now! So factually not much has got better. When people look back, what will be the highlight of Clough's tenure? Putting the club in a healthy position, reducing the wage-bill and ridden the club of all the cob-webs (for me) and consistently playing above reasonable expectation. I'll remember him fondly, and if he was to leave now I'd shake his hand and say thank you and hope the next person coming in doesn't **** the club up again. The reason people are so angry now is because we're not in the top 6 - even though we have absolutely no right at all to be in there, he has built up a team obviously people think are capable - otherwise why the anger? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Putting the club in a healthy position, reducing the wage-bill and ridden the club of all the cob-webs (for me) and consistently playing above reasonable expectation. I'll remember him fondly, and if he was to leave now I'd shake his hand and say thank you and hope the next person coming in doesn't **** the club up again. The reason people are so angry now is because we're not in the top 6 - even though we have absolutely no right at all to be in there, he has built up a team obviously people think are capable - otherwise why the anger? Why does Clough get the credit for that? They are things that WOULD have happened regardless of manager! They are orders from his bosses. Clough didn't get a £20m budget and say "you know what...erm..... I'm gonna only spend £1m..........erm..... I'll also get the wages down.....". The club had a plan, Clough was part of it. He did his job. I personally would say he helped nurse the club back to health, but he's not the one with the healing hands. I can only speak for myself and the people I've spoken to... but I'm not angry cos we're not in the top 6, I've said elsewhere that I don't put a league position as a measure. It's down to performances, seeing players playing to the best of their ability and seeing us reach optimum of our ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Why does Clough get the credit for that? They are things that WOULD have happened regardless of manager! They are orders from his bosses. Clough didn't get a £20m budget and say "you know what...erm..... I'm gonna only spend £1m..........erm..... I'll also get the wages down.....". The club had a plan, Clough was part of it. He did his job. I personally would say he helped nurse the club back to health, but he's not the one with the healing hands. I can only speak for myself and the people I've spoken to... but I'm not angry cos we're not in the top 6, I've said elsewhere that I don't put a league position as a measure. It's down to performances, seeing players playing to the best of their ability and seeing us reach optimum of our ability. A lot of managers would have relegated us IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 A lot of managers would have relegated us IMO Not even Jewell would have got us relegated in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Not even Jewell would have got us relegated in my opinion. He was having a decent stab at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnram Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Why does Clough get the credit for that? They are things that WOULD have happened regardless of manager! They are orders from his bosses. Clough didn't get a £20m budget and say "you know what...erm..... I'm gonna only spend £1m..........erm..... I'll also get the wages down.....". The club had a plan, Clough was part of it. He did his job. I personally would say he helped nurse the club back to health, but he's not the one with the healing hands. I can only speak for myself and the people I've spoken to... but I'm not angry cos we're not in the top 6, I've said elsewhere that I don't put a league position as a measure. It's down to performances, seeing players playing to the best of their ability and seeing us reach optimum of our ability. He gets the credit because he is the one who was responsible for the actions in ridding us of the overpaid under-skilled players that he inherited. That was no mean feat, having to gradually shift out the dross and replace them with the committed team that we see now. I am enjoying most of the football that we are playing, I like the passing and movement, the confidence in receiving a ball with two players up your ass before laying it off. I have seen huge improvements in the way that we are playing and do not understand why you have come to the conclusion that the improvement will suddenly stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 He gets the credit because he is the one who was responsible for the actions in ridding us of the overpaid under-skilled players that he inherited. That was no mean feat, having to gradually shift out the dross and replace them with the committed team that we see now. I am enjoying most of the football that we are playing, I like the passing and movement, the confidence in receiving a ball with two players up your ass before laying it off. I have seen huge improvements in the way that we are playing and do not understand why you have come to the conclusion that the improvement will suddenly stop. the improvement stopped about 3 years ago, regressed, then improved again, then regressed again and improved again to where we are now. Sexy football under Clough isn't brand new since Will Hughed got into the side! We had it when Bueno was in the side too. When we have improved enough so much that Will Hughes actually wins us games, then we can get truly excited, but he doesn't. He's no Giles Barnes in promotion season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnram Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 the improvement stopped about 3 years ago, regressed, then improved again, then regressed again and improved again to where we are now. Sexy football under Clough isn't brand new since Will Hughed got into the side! We had it when Bueno was in the side too. When we have improved enough so much that Will Hughes actually wins us games, then we can get truly excited, but he doesn't. He's no Giles Barnes in promotion season. I was also a fan of Bueno but he is a different player to Hughes. Hughes is totally involved in moving the ball around the pitch. He may not be the one who passes the final ball but it is probable that he has been involved along the way at critical times taking players out of play. Regarding Giles Barnes, it is sad what has happened to him since his injuries I did always feel that because he was very fast, the people around him as a youngster failed to develop him properly as a footballer. There will always be improvement and regression at the stage that Derby are at as key players come and go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smiffy Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 He has not put the club in a better financial position, he has knocked millions off gate reciepts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcdcfc28 Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 He's put us in a healthy position? Really? Is that it? How hard can it be to flog aload of deadwood for peanuts , buy some league one and two players and then spend over a million on a non goal scoring striker who doesn't make the first eleven on a regular basis? Granted he's worked well on a small budget, but so does a dozen other managers in this league. Why so much praise? He's done very average, look at his win ratio of 33.77%. How many times have we put a good run of back to back wins together under Clough in (almost) five years? I was a Clough fan until the defeat to florist in 2010. Players playing all over the place, no passion, criticism of certain individuals and the pathetic attempt at a interview after the game.http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/d/derby_county/9326949.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 He's slightly better than Tommy Docherty and Colin Addison........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.