A Ram for All Seasons Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 The only thing that I don't like about Keir Starmer is his voice, which sounds too much like Rik Mayall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 13, 2020 Author Share Posted January 13, 2020 20 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said: The world has been badly run by egotistical men for too long. About time women were given a go in charge. Dont even know where to start with this comment so will probably leave it for tonight ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbob Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 22 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said: The world has been badly run by egotistical men for too long. About time women were given a go in charge. It would be funny watching Johnson lose the plot when debating with someone he assumes is a maid. Good point. We need another Maggie Thatcher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 13, 2020 Author Share Posted January 13, 2020 18 minutes ago, bigbadbob said: Good point. We need another Maggie Thatcher Nah, she wasnt a patch on Teresa May Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 1 hour ago, ariotofmyown said: Life must be hard getting so worked up by a culture war then exists mostly in your head. I wouldn't say I get overly worked up about the culture wars but to suggest they mostly exist in my head is ridiculous. Just a few examples from numerous articles a quick google search returned; https://www.politico.eu/article/democrats-republicans-us-immigration-global-warming-education-how-everything-became-the-culture-war/ https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-04-10/the-culture-war-threatening-to-rip-through-european-politics https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/dec/07/study-finds-uk-politics-mired-culture-wars-brexit-donald-trump We're surrounded by culture wars, from the serious to the mundane. A good example is the movie, Joker. It came out to negative early critic reviews followed by glowing audience reviews and the reason I bring it up now is that its just been nominated for 11 oscars iirc today much to the dismay of the twitterati that are still angrily moaning about the 'entitled whiney white incel main character'. Its a good job its not up for a BAFTA, I'm not sure it would even qualify. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ariotofmyown Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 7 hours ago, maxjam said: I wouldn't say I get overly worked up about the culture wars but to suggest they mostly exist in my head is ridiculous. Just a few examples from numerous articles a quick google search returned; https://www.politico.eu/article/democrats-republicans-us-immigration-global-warming-education-how-everything-became-the-culture-war/ https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-04-10/the-culture-war-threatening-to-rip-through-european-politics https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/dec/07/study-finds-uk-politics-mired-culture-wars-brexit-donald-trump We're surrounded by culture wars, from the serious to the mundane. A good example is the movie, Joker. It came out to negative early critic reviews followed by glowing audience reviews and the reason I bring it up now is that its just been nominated for 11 oscars iirc today much to the dismay of the twitterati that are still angrily moaning about the 'entitled whiney white incel main character'. Its a good job its not up for a BAFTA, I'm not sure it would even qualify. A film is disliked by critics but loved by the public? I didn't realise things had got so serious, I'm fully into this war now. I'm going to spend all day furiously looking for examples where the enemy has suggested that legacy systems are excluding everyone bar white men. It's the single biggest threat to world peace and keeping things like they always have been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 33 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said: A film is disliked by critics but loved by the public? I didn't realise things had got so serious, I'm fully into this war now. I'm going to spend all day furiously looking for examples where the enemy has suggested that legacy systems are excluding everyone bar white men. It's the single biggest threat to world peace and keeping things like they always have been. Well feel free to ignore the political links I posted and just focus on the film despite the fact I have repeatedly said the culture war infects everything from the sublime to the ridiculous. The Joker was just another example of how disconnected the media are from the average person, it wasn't so much the bad ratings it got as to why it was getting those bad reviews. Not sure if your last couple of sentences were serious or not, given an earlier post I think the former in which case lets just say that you're entitled to your opinion and I'm entitled to mine and leave it there, I think continuing this discussion further would be a massive waste of both of our time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ariotofmyown Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 6 minutes ago, maxjam said: despite the fact I have repeatedly said the culture war infects everything from the sublime to the ridiculous. No hyperbole is big enough for the culture war. It is literally a battle for survival. It's worse than the Somme and Hiroshima combined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 9 hours ago, ariotofmyown said: The world has been badly run by egotistical men for too long. About time women were given a go in charge. It would be funny watching Johnson lose the plot when debating with someone he assumes is a maid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 21 minutes ago, maxjam said: Well feel free to ignore the political links I posted In all honesty, do you think it's wise to post media links to "culture war" examples? We've spent many posts discussing the malign influence of the media on our lives, as they seek to only generate heat and never to cast light. Stop for a minute to think how badly you are being played here. A war requires two sides. On one side we have those who are trying a bit too hard to make society a fairer place On the other side we have people like you who get wound up about it and for some reason think it's the most important thing in the world The "culture war" only exists because in the middle we have the media (clue is in the name) continually laying out the battleground, looking for examples of the former to enrage the latter Instead of posting media articles (remembering that they exist to generate clicks and nothing else), are there any examples in your real day-to-day life where the "culture war" is causing you a problem? I can honestly say that in my day-to-day life, if I ignore the media I don't see it anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 14, 2020 Author Share Posted January 14, 2020 21 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: On one side we have those who are trying a bit too hard to make society a fairer place That's a very watered down version of the truth. Classic example from the previous page or 2...how is electing a leader based on their gender fair? Fair is electing a leader with the best qualities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 56 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: In all honesty, do you think it's wise to post media links to "culture war" examples? We've spent many posts discussing the malign influence of the media on our lives, as they seek to only generate heat and never to cast light. FWIW I made the point of only posting articles from neutral or left leaning outlets. 56 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: Stop for a minute to think how badly you are being played here. I wouldn't say I'm being played, I would argue that you are. Despite everything thats gone on in the past 3 years I've still got what I wanted, Brexit and anyone but Corbyn. If the left want to form an effective opposition or future government then I'd suggest its them that need to stop playing the game. 56 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: On one side we have those who are trying a bit too hard to make society a fairer place That is highly subjective and based soley on your point on view. 56 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: On the other side we have people like you who get wound up about it and for some reason think it's the most important thing in the world Yeah I moan about it as once your eye's are open to it you see it everywhere. I wouldn't say it overly concerns me although imo it has played a large role in Trump, Brexit etc. The divide has never been greater and as you are perhaps slowly finding out for yourself, its the left shifting further to the left that is fueling this division. 56 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: Instead of posting media articles (remembering that they exist to generate clicks and nothing else), are there any examples in your real day-to-day life where the "culture war" is causing you a problem? I can honestly say that in my day-to-day life, if I ignore the media I don't see it anywhere. Day-to-day life its mostlly 'roll your eyes' moments such as the BAFTAs/Joker etc. When it comes to the media and politics etc those things have real world impacts however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 37 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: That's a very watered down version of the truth. Classic example from the previous page or 2...how is electing a leader based on their gender fair? Fair is electing a leader with the best qualities. No one is electing a leader based on their gender. It's a democratic election of the leader, people can vote for who they like. Those saying it they will only vote for a female candidate are merely expressing opinions. We can both disagree with their opinion - none of it has any bearing on the outcome Again - you're playing the exact part that the media want. The outraged. FWIW - it's not a "watered down" take -it's the truth. It's the media that offer a "spiced-up" version Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 10 minutes ago, maxjam said: Day-to-day life its mostlly 'roll your eyes' moments such as the BAFTAs/Joker etc. When it comes to the media and politics etc those things have real world impacts however. but no actual examples come to mind? Good to know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ariotofmyown Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 35 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: That's a very watered down version of the truth. Classic example from the previous page or 2...how is electing a leader based on their gender fair? Fair is electing a leader with the best qualities. As women make up 50% of the population, you could perhaps expect half the leaders of Labour to have been women. For many reasons though, there have been less women Labour MPs than men, so you could expect the same % of Labour leaders to be women as there are women MPs. You would expect 0% of Labour leaders to be women only if the world was controlled by men. And this is Labour who have usually advocated women's rights. The Tories, who usually thinking women are for breeding and cleaning, have had 2 woman leaders. The Tories!! The ex-Tory Amber Rudd described the PM as the sort if man she wouldn't like to get in a taxi with late at night. On live TV. A female opposition leader would destroy him at PMQs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 14, 2020 Author Share Posted January 14, 2020 11 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: No one is electing a leader based on their gender. It's a democratic election of the leader, people can vote for who they like. Those saying it they will only vote for a female candidate are merely expressing opinions. We can both disagree with their opinion - none of it has any bearing on the outcome Again - you're playing the exact part that the media want. The outraged. FWIW - it's not a "watered down" take -it's the truth. It's the media that offer a "spiced-up" version I'm not outraged. Just pointing out that you was factually incorrect when you said that one side is trying to make things fairer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 14, 2020 Author Share Posted January 14, 2020 4 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said: As women make up 50% of the population, you could perhaps expect half the leaders of Labour to have been women. For many reasons though, there have been less women Labour MPs than men, so you could expect the same % of Labour leaders to be women as there are women MPs. You would expect 0% of Labour leaders to be women only if the world was controlled by men. And this is Labour who have usually advocated women's rights. The Tories, who usually thinking women are for breeding and cleaning, have had 2 woman leaders. The Tories!! The ex-Tory Amber Rudd described the PM as the sort if man she wouldn't like to get in a taxi with late at night. On live TV. A female opposition leader would destroy him at PMQs. By the same token I assume that we can expect 50% of coal miners and refuse collectors, just for example, to be women? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 23 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: but no actual examples come to mind? Good to know Lots of examples you just don't accept them. I mentioned roll your eyes moments such as the BAFTAs/Joker and most other subjects are off topic for this forum, for example it will be interesting to see how the left resolves Islam/LGBT (both protected groups) especially given that it will be played out in public as the LGBT agenda gets rolled out in more and more schools. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/birmingham-lgbt-protest-ban-school-same-sex-education-court-ruling-a9218101.html I find it interesting that certain people on this forum were saying its your democratic right to protest when it comes to XR causing mayhem in London yet the LGBT/Islam issue (and subsequent banning of protests) has caused very little stir in the media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 12 minutes ago, maxjam said: Lots of examples you just don't accept them. I mentioned roll your eyes moments such as the BAFTAs/Joker and most other subjects are off topic for this forum, for example it will be interesting to see how the left resolves Islam/LGBT (both protected groups) especially given that it will be played out in public as the LGBT agenda gets rolled out in more and more schools. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/birmingham-lgbt-protest-ban-school-same-sex-education-court-ruling-a9218101.html I find it interesting that certain people on this forum were saying its your democratic right to protest when it comes to XR causing mayhem in London yet the LGBT/Islam issue (and subsequent banning of protests) has caused very little stir in the media. OK, feel free to ignore my point about posting media links to news articles on "culture war" subject as being a bad idea, and keep posting stuff. I suppose it proves how deeply ingrained the "war" is on both sides. Why does it matter how the "left" resolves the Islam/LGBT issues? The "left" aren't in power, it doesn't matter what they think any more than it matters what you think on the "right". As you argued on an earlier point - the law is the law, leave it at that. What the two sides on the "culture war" think doesn't actually make any difference. Apart from to the ad revenue of the sites that host the arguments Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 24 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: By the same token I assume that we can expect 50% of coal miners and refuse collectors, just for example, to be women? I don't think giving more examples of the patriarchal societies assumed gender roles is quite the burn you think it is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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