Kelle Roos

[Bob The Badger]

14 minutes ago, Millenniumram said:

Then I don’t think you understand the modern game at all. You watch City, Liverpool play - the best teams in the country

They are playing on a level that surpasses anything we have ever seen. It's an entirely different game.

You don't think the team under Mac would have coped now with Carson in goal?

And you think Cox's team that won this Division would have struggled without a passing keeper?

Or Jim Smith's team?

It isn't a question of hoof it or have a ball playing keeper. There are shades of gray.

You don't NEED a passing keeper to get out of this division, but you do NEED one who can stop goals.

As for a clean sheet today. That's irrelevant when he didn't have a single real save to make.

They did have the ball in the net with him beaten and could have then equalized at the end when they hit it into the side netting.

I'm talking about his body of work as a whole.

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

1 hour ago, Millenniumram said:

Very harsh assessment there. There were a couple of dodgy moments today from Roos for sure (the end of that first half was dreadful goalkeeping, and there were a couple of other flappy moments as well)- but on the whole I actually thought he had a decent game. Didn’t have a great deal of saves to make, but he started a few attacks off with some good distribution, which is something that’s very important in a modern goalkeeper.

I must admit when he first came into the side I had my doubts, but I think I was being overly critical- you have to look at him in context to other goalies in the division. If you do that, you actually realise he’s a good player. Think people have to realise that you’re not gonna get a goalie who’s all round game is perfect in this league- Roos obviously has poor command of his box, we all know that, but you get a goalie who’s good at that, and the chances are he’s no good at passing. All a bit of a balancing act. Carson for example, he’s much better on crosses, but no good on the ball. Another good goalie at this level, but no improvement on Roos overall imo. Recalling him wouldn’t improve matters.

In fairness, I’m sure with some quality scouting (something we don’t have) that we could find a better player than Roos. He’s not a top player at this level. But he’s not the biggest weakness in the team imo, and improving on him isn’t a priority. A Keogh replacement is.

You've said it yourself there, he didn't have a lot to do but the number of mistakes he made when he did have something to do was frightening. Imagine if he did have a lot to do, they'd have scored a few. 

We can't go the whole season flapping at crosses - it's the simple part of being a goalkeeper and Roos makes it look the hardest. 

[Sparkle]

He is doing ok 

[adzy]

We need a better keeper. If I was the opposition manager I would be telling them to stick floaters into the box in the hope of a mistake. Hes not a bad keeper. Im sure he will do fine and he has other good qualities like shot stopping and distribution.

But I feel it would be hard to be promoted with Roos as number one.

[hintonsboots]

6 minutes ago, adamscybot said:

to stick floaters into the box in the hope of a mistake.

 

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

14 minutes ago, adamscybot said:

We need a better keeper. If I was the opposition manager I would be telling them to stick floaters into the box in the hope of a mistake. Hes not a bad keeper. Im sure he will do fine and he has other good qualities like shot stopping and distribution.

But I feel it would be hard to be promoted with Roos as number one.

I would too cos he can’t catch s h i t 

[Millenniumram]

1 hour ago, Bob The Badger said:

They are playing on a level that surpasses anything we have ever seen. It's an entirely different game.

You don't think the team under Mac would have coped now with Carson in goal?

And you think Cox's team that won this Division would have struggled without a passing keeper?

Or Jim Smith's team?

It isn't a question of hoof it or have a ball playing keeper. There are shades of gray.

You don't NEED a passing keeper to get out of this division, but you do NEED one who can stop goals.

As for a clean sheet today. That's irrelevant when he didn't have a single real save to make.

They did have the ball in the net with him beaten and could have then equalized at the end when they hit it into the side netting.

I'm talking about his body of work as a whole.

It may be a different level, but it’s very much the same game. You obviously don’t need a distributor of the ball as good as Ederson in the 2nd tier, but you still need one who’s as good relative to the division. You can’t just say because it’s the championship that it doesn’t matter, because we’re still trying to play with a similar philosophy, and that still requires players with similar strengths, relative to others in the league. I’m sorry, but you just simply won’t get out this division without a goalkeeper who can play the ball if you’re trying to play the possession style that we are. That’s the way it is. Just like being a good shot stopper obviously is, being able to pass is also a needed requirement of a goalkeeper these days.

To answer your question, yes Macs team would’ve struggled from a distribution sense with today’s Carson in goal. In fact we did struggle a bit during Mac 2 in that respect, and that was with Carson of a few years ago who was much better on the ball than last season. Arthur Cox’s team was in an entirely different era, so I’m not sure how that’s relevant.  

Of course there are different levels between being unable to pass and being prime Neuer, but you’ve still got to have someone who’s pretty damn component. Regardless, the point isn’t that it’s the only consideration in a good goalie, just that it is a trait that has to be considered. As I say, I don’t think Roos is one of the best goalies in the division, and I’m sure we could get better. But the trouble is, it’s extremely hard to find a goalkeeper at this level that has everything, so comparing Roos to other goalies in the league, he’s still pretty good, despite his obvious flaws.

That’s the point I’m making here, I’m not trying to say he’s perfect or didn’t do anything wrong today, I’m trying to say that it’s a ridiculous over exaggeration to criticise him as a player overall quite as much as you did in your OP, based on the odd error today that didn’t actually cost us anything. Frankly I find it a little strange to make a thread like this after such a brilliant performance today. You may disagree, but I can’t see how, with so many other issues in the squad, replacing Roos is as much of a priority as you suggest. Perhaps better coaching may be a more pertinent point.

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

3 hours ago, Bob The Badger said:

He’s a major problem who is going to cost us games.

The defence has played terrible when it comes to defending set pieces, but I’m starting to wonder if they have half an eye on the ball and half an eye on Flapper behind them.

His valiant double attempt at the end of the first half to drag Preston back into a game that should have been out of sight was like watching a blind man on acid trying  to herd blind cats on acid….on ice.

I’ve not been confident in the guy from the get-go, but that lack of confidence is now serious concern.

I’m sure the transfer window opens at midnight GMT on January 1st, but just in case, if I was Cocu I’d be buying a ticket to New Zealand for 31st December so I can hit the transfer window early.

Or we could just call Carson back. because a bad Carson is better than this.

He made a very good save today and his kicking was excellent. He didn't catch one that he should have, but one mistake in the whole match? Don't think he was poor today. His distribution was excellent. On this logic, how about we criticise Waghorn for missing a couple of good chances? Don't make Roos a scapegoat. I think Carson was excellent though.

[derbydaz22]

No way is Carson as bad as Roos on crosses I think Roos is probably the worst keeper I can ever remember at Derby for commanding his area and I’m old enough to remember Steve Cherry with the direct corner against Plymouth.

[Millenniumram]

1 hour ago, CHCDerby said:

You've said it yourself there, he didn't have a lot to do but the number of mistakes he made when he did have something to do was frightening. Imagine if he did have a lot to do, they'd have scored a few. 

We can't go the whole season flapping at crosses - it's the simple part of being a goalkeeper and Roos makes it look the hardest. 

I don’t disagree that he made a couple of mistakes today under no pressure, the one at the end of the first half was properly appalling - I said as much in the match thread. And it is concerning of course, I’m not gonna lie, I do worry when he comes for the ball. But the thing is, on the whole, he’s not exactly done a terrible job as our goalie, he’s made some top saves, so to suggest they’d have scored with any shot they had today is extremely harsh imo. And to jump on here after a game we’ve kept a clean sheet in and slam the goalie as an idiot seems OTT to me as well.

As I say, the flapping is without a doubt a massive weakness of Roos game, think we all know that and I won’t deny that it really ain’t good. And of course, I’d much rather we had a goalkeeper who could command his area better. But the point is, goalkeepers in this division just aren’t that good overall, we’ve seen that with the likes of Camp and Sluga this season. So most goalies you sign who can command their box, will most likely have some other weakness. So can you really guarantee that they’ll be better than Roos overall? I’m not sure. What we really need to do is improve our goalkeeping coaching to improve that area of Roos game, cause it’s clear to all it’s a weakness, and whatever is being done about is obviously isn’t working.

[Bob The Badger]

13 minutes ago, Theres’s Only Wan Chope said:

 Don't make Roos a scapegoat. 

How can I make him a scapegoat when we won?

It's better talking about this after a win than it being knee-jerk.

Didn't make a mistake? 

Maybe you were ordering your pie just before half time.

And when did he make this good save? I'll admit I had to go and relieve the old prostrate once, but I cannot remember one.

[Bob The Badger]

13 minutes ago, derbydaz22 said:

No way is Carson as bad as Roos on crosses I think Roos is probably the worst keeper I can ever remember at Derby for commanding his area and I’m old enough to remember Steve Cherry with the direct corner against Plymouth.

I don't think any Derby player ever suffered as bad for one mistake as he did for that.

After traveling to Plymouth feeling like utter crap with a heavy cold and getting them back to the BBG, I thought we were in the semi's. That was a very tough loss.

 

[Mckram]

Totally agree he’s not good enough.

I fail to see how anybody can protect him. 

He’s not even that good at playing the ball out...today he was nearly caught in possession and always plays the ball to a defender who is marked and invites pressure.

Feel sorry for Hamer, he must be awful. 

 

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

48 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

How can I make him a scapegoat when we won?

It's better talking about this after a win than it being knee-jerk.

Didn't make a mistake? 

Maybe you were ordering your pie just before half time.

And when did he make this good save? I'll admit I had to go and relieve the old prostrate once, but I cannot remember one.

One mistake, so what? He didn’t catch the ball on a wet afternoon. And yes he did make a good save 2nd half from close range. Maybe you were ordering your pie then. 

[Derby blood]

For me Roos is a weak link, can not catch a ball, can not punch a ball, and is our worst goal keeper since Frank Fielding, for me he needs replacing in Jan, could have cost us the game when he came out flapping at the end of the first half. Also he does not command his 6 yard box. Decision making is also very poor. 

[rynny]

Just now, Derby blood said:

worst goal keeper since Frank Fielding

So not as good as Grant, Butland and Carson? 

[RamNut]

18 minutes ago, Theres’s Only Wan Chope said:

One mistake, so what? He didn’t catch the ball on a wet afternoon. And yes he did make a good save 2nd half from close range. Maybe you were ordering your pie then. 

No, he was squeezing his prostate. 

 

[RamNut]

I’m still in favour of giving Roos 46 games to prove himself.

today he was flappy 

[hintonsboots]

5 minutes ago, RamNut said:

No, he was squeezing his prostate. 

 

 

[RamNut]

You can see him decide to come for a cross;

he looks as if he is making a decisive move;

then just at the critical moment, you can see the doubt flash across his face

he wonders whether Bob the Badger is relieving his prostate.....and he just loses it. 

It’s understandable.  

I’ve found that I now have the same problem just as i’m approaching a roundabout