Lawrence and Bennett Convicted of drink driving

[Millenniumram]

2 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

???

No-one who was present, who didn't get in the cars (or see them get in the cars) deserves any sort of hitback on this. They're not getting smashed, they're not getting wasted. They're all having a chat with their mates. 

A completely normal activity.

Maybe they weren’t, but other players were. They weren’t stopping them, they were filming them and encouraging them. They should know how footballers should be acting, taken responsibility and stopped them before these videos emerged painting our club in a poor light. 
 

[cannable]

5 minutes ago, Millenniumram said:

Some men aren’t professional athletes paid a lot of money to keep themselves in peak condition for a 9/10 month period. There’s also a difference between having a drink, and taking it to a stupid level where players are throwing up and noones stopping them.

Are you judging them by the standards of an average footballer or are you judging them by the standards you in your head believe a footballer should adhere to? 

[desirelines]

3 minutes ago, Archied said:

we live in a world now where far too many do just as they please at the expense of others and face little or no consequences 

That maybe true, but I'd counter that we also live in a world which is quick to judge and espouse sentiments akin to the "hang 'em and flog 'em" brigade you find under the line on most Daily Mail articles and on Twitter. These lads need to be punished, of course. But I don't like the idea of a society where there's no chance for rehabilitation, reform, or redemption. 

[Millenniumram]

2 minutes ago, Archied said:

Wasn’t quoting you but yes there was a poster stating they were considering finding another club

Fair enough, that’s not the right move

[AdamRam]

6 minutes ago, Millenniumram said:

Yeah I agree with that too. Don’t have a problem with the players who left at 8 as the club organised it. But don’t think the club should be organising anything In a pub without staff being there. Sad state of affairs, but Some footballers can’t be trusted. Annoyed with the club as well, they need to be making better decisions. They couldn’t have known it would get this bad though. They’d think the players would at least act like adults.

I’m as disappointed in the club as the players, we all saw the videos and bar bill of one of their previous visits to the establishment, if not this time then this was a disaster waiting to happen.

I also can’t get my head around players posting this on social media, they couldn’t of been that worried about the consequences if they are prepared to do that, or maybe they are just that daft they thought they would get away with it.

[RandomAccessMemory]

Remember last season, after the play-off semi, the bar bill, the videos that came out of the players doing the Conga, singing, whatever, did any of you laugh at those?

If you did and are now criticising the players for getting drunk on Tuesday (not the drink driving, that obviously should never have happened) then it's very hypocritical.

We need to be very, very clear that we can't treat them all the same, 2 of them have been charged for breaking the law and will also have to face the consequences of that, another we know was definitely in one of the cars and is now paying a huge price for that decision.

The others that have been mentioned and are in certain videos, we have no idea about when they left, how much they drank, etc etc. If it were not for the awful events of later that night these videos would not be making the press and we would be non the wiser.

What I'm trying to say is there are probably loads of other videos out there of nights out that are the same but nothing bad happened and so we never found out about them. There are probably also the same sort of videos of players from other clubs, I can't imagine it's a Derby only thing.

Don't confuse what happened later on that night with what you see on the videos.

[Archied]

3 hours ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

To everyone saying that we should get rid instantly, listen to what @Mafiabob is saying.

I hope he doesn’t mind me using him as an example (it’s all out there), but he is someone who made mistakes, knew exactly what he had done and worked hard to grow as a person. Now he’s doing fantastic work to help others.

By all means, fine them, suspend them and shame them. But don’t sack them. That would suggest that there is no chance of repentance. 

Mate a little slap on the wrist means nothing , it’s when your life is going down the pan that you change your attitude and behaviour ,, I’m willing to bet that mafiabob will have been to hell and back to reach the point he’s at now ,,, I know I have and having been there myself then worked as a counsellor in prison rehabs I have half a clue how this stuff works

[Millenniumram]

3 minutes ago, cannable said:

Are you judging them by the standards of an average footballer or are you judging them by the standards you in your head believe a footballer should adhere to? 

Perhaps the latter, but there’s plenty of players around who don’t even drink at all. I’m not saying we need a squad of non drinkers, but there’s plenty out there who don’t go stupid like this. Would much rather we built a team around them, even if it’s not just these players who act the way they did.

[SaintRam]

2 minutes ago, RandomAccessMemory said:

Remember last season, after the play-off semi, the bar bill, the videos that came out of the players doing the Conga, singing, whatever, did any of you laugh at those?

If you did and are now criticising the players for getting drunk on Tuesday (not the drink driving, that obviously should never have happened) then it's very hypocritical.

We need to be very, very clear that we can't treat them all the same, 2 of them have been charged for breaking the law and will also have to face the consequences of that, another we know was definitely in one of the cars and is now paying a huge price for that decision.

The others that have been mentioned and are in certain videos, we have no idea about when they left, how much they drank, etc etc. If it were not for the awful events of later that night these videos would not be making the press and we would be non the wiser.

What I'm trying to say is there are probably loads of other videos out there of nights out that are the same but nothing bad happened and so we never found out about them. There are probably also the same sort of videos of players from other clubs, I can't imagine it's a Derby only thing.

Don't confuse what happened later on that night with what you see on the videos.

Indeed.

It bothers me that players that have probably done nothing wrong (again, admitting the possibility they were in or knew about the cars) are being lumped in with the absolute imbeciles who broke the law and put lives in danger.

[therealhantsram]

1 hour ago, CornwallRam said:

If that article is correct and Keogh was found unconscious in wreck of Lawrence's car by the emergency services, what does that imply about the drivers' actions? 

Now it's very low on detail so my preliminary conclusion may well be incorrect. Quite separate from the drink driving issue, anyone can be involved in an RTA, but there are certain legal requirements you have to fulfil when you are. This article suggests that the drivers might not have acted with absolute probity after the incident. That's without any consideration of the merits of leaving your unconscious skipper alone.

I guess this story originates from the audio that's been doing the rounds and to print it, the Mail would have had to verify it with someone, probably someone in the emergency services, before they ran it.

They don't include the other allegations from the audio.  But the fact that this bit now seems authentic, does then to give credence to the rest of the pathetic story.

 

[atherstoneram]

On 25/09/2019 at 18:02, DCFC1388 said:

Does anyone know any facts regards the crash & drink driving? For all we know they could have slightly blown over the drink limit, could be half a pint over the limit. If they are 3 or 4 times then fair enough thats beyond ridiculous but until facts are out there how can people be calling for them to be sacked

As someone has said the weather etc was poor so the crash could be weather related not drink related. Ive seen that a large group of the players were out for a meal so could easily be half a drink over the limit, easy to do at a meal.

Maybe lets just wait for facts before calling for their heads.

I personally am not bothered what punishment the club dishes out.

If it was indeed inclement weather that night that is more reason not to drink and drive, The fact is it is drink related though isn't it, they were found to be over the limit after an RTC. Every accident has a cause and drink seems to be the factor in this accident no matter what/if any other underlying cause. Because they are "professional" people the judiciary are likely to come down harder on them, maybe even a custodial sentence if high over the limit. Huddlestone has not helped Bennetts cause One little bit by posting pics of him on social media throwing up in the toilets through drink or not. The fact that a Third party was not injured or killed by these antics is a stroke of luck.

[ThePrisoner]

Just now, therealhantsram said:

Mail would have had to verify it

You're giving a lot of credit to the Daily Mail there! ?

[Millenniumram]

2 minutes ago, AdamRam said:

I’m as disappointed in the club as the players, we all saw the videos and bar bill of one of their previous visits to the establishment, if not this time then this was a disaster waiting to happen.

I also can’t get my head around players posting this on social media, they couldn’t of been that worried about the consequences if they are prepared to do that, or maybe they are just that daft they thought they would get away with it.

Yeah I certainly don’t think the club should be encouraging stuff like this. Think they’ve let players get away with too much for too long and it’s been to our detriment. Need to be strong now and take decisive action to change things and build a better culture under which we may actually succeed.

In all fairness, it was on Snapchat which is closed, so I can kind of understand it. But it should be something they should be finding entertaining Really- not in the season.

[RandomAccessMemory]

Just now, SaintRam said:

Indeed.

It bothers me that players that have probably done nothing wrong (again, admitting the possibility they were in or knew about the cars) are being lumped in with the absolute imbeciles who broke the law and put lives in danger.

Exactly!

How must they feel that they're being dragged into this?

If they were aware of the drink driving it doesn't reflect well at all, but we have no idea if they were even there at that point.

[Papahet]

4 minutes ago, RandomAccessMemory said:

Remember last season, after the play-off semi, the bar bill, the videos that came out of the players doing the Conga, singing, whatever, did any of you laugh at those?

If you did and are now criticising the players for getting drunk on Tuesday (not the drink driving, that obviously should never have happened) then it's very hypocritical.

We need to be very, very clear that we can't treat them all the same, 2 of them have been charged for breaking the law and will also have to face the consequences of that, another we know was definitely in one of the cars and is now paying a huge price for that decision.

The others that have been mentioned and are in certain videos, we have no idea about when they left, how much they drank, etc etc. If it were not for the awful events of later that night these videos would not be making the press and we would be non the wiser.

What I'm trying to say is there are probably loads of other videos out there of nights out that are the same but nothing bad happened and so we never found out about them. There are probably also the same sort of videos of players from other clubs, I can't imagine it's a Derby only thing.

Don't confuse what happened later on that night with what you see on the videos.

The difference is we’ve started the season dogshit, don’t look like improving. Are currently 18th in the league ..should be working harder to improve the position not out on the lash.

The post Leeds celebrations warranted IMO, let your hair down after a hard fought victory with a potential place in the Prem to follow.

[Mafiabob]

13 minutes ago, Millenniumram said:

They all could have stopped those that did. Must take more responsibility for me. Maybe getting rid of them all is a little harsh, but they certainly need to reprimanded and taken out of the team for a while, until they learn how a pro footballer should act.

I like this response a lot better than your initial post about it. Taking responsibility is paramount. Hanging them and putting them in stocks isn’t the way.

I will see them in much better light if they try to make amends to the ones they have done wrong to, remorseful and maybe change as people for the better 

[EraniosSocks]

5 minutes ago, RandomAccessMemory said:

Remember last season, after the play-off semi, the bar bill, the videos that came out of the players doing the Conga, singing, whatever, did any of you laugh at those?

If you did and are now criticising the players for getting drunk on Tuesday (not the drink driving, that obviously should never have happened) then it's very hypocritical.

We need to be very, very clear that we can't treat them all the same, 2 of them have been charged for breaking the law and will also have to face the consequences of that, another we know was definitely in one of the cars and is now paying a huge price for that decision.

The others that have been mentioned and are in certain videos, we have no idea about when they left, how much they drank, etc etc. If it were not for the awful events of later that night these videos would not be making the press and we would be non the wiser.

What I'm trying to say is there are probably loads of other videos out there of nights out that are the same but nothing bad happened and so we never found out about them. There are probably also the same sort of videos of players from other clubs, I can't imagine it's a Derby only thing.

Don't confuse what happened later on that night with what you see on the videos.

Hold on. I kind of get the celebration of the Leeds game being followed by a drink and a party as it was such a momentous occasion winning in that fashion at Elland Road and making Wembley.

 

But Tuesday was a fiasco. Team building exercises are fantastic but to end in that way is a joke. Never want to see those included have the divine luck of wearing a ram on there chest ever again.

[DarkFruitsRam7]

2 minutes ago, Papahet said:

The difference is we’ve started the season dogshit, don’t look like improving. Are currently 18th in the league ..should be working harder to improve the position not out on the lash.

The post Leeds celebrations warranted IMO, let your hair down after a hard fought victory with a potential place in the Prem to follow.

That’s key, as is the fact that the next game post-Leeds was over a week later. Still not a huge fan of what happened there, but it’s not as bad as this week’s events.

[Millenniumram]

1 minute ago, Mafiabob said:

I like this response a lot better than your initial post about it. Taking responsibility is paramount. Hanging them and putting them in stocks isn’t the way.

I will see them in much better light if they try to make amends to the ones they have done wrong to, remorseful and maybe change as people for the better 

That’s what they should all be aiming to do. I’m not against people getting second chances, and I hope this event spurs all involved into changing the way they act and becoming more responsible people as a result. People can change and I hope they do and they sort their lives out in the future- but for a couple of them at least, that future shouldn’t be here imo.

[Mafiabob]

18 minutes ago, Archied said:

You are spot on ,the thing is people rarely change unless unless the consequences of not changing are too painfull

They do change..... there’s hope