Just a small tear in my eye for that Chris Martin sub

[AdamRam]

4 minutes ago, cannable said:

That’s just a sweeping generalisation of football though. Pressing is only popular because passing and possession was popular before it. 

Burnley were one of the first teams to catch on to pressing and they’ve consistently had a target man!

Of course it’s a sweeping generalisation, and there are still going to be teams that use different styles, they are now becoming few and far between though. If you are going to build your team around Martin, then you are playing to his strengths, but none of our previous X managers have. 

This is why he doesn’t play, he doesn’t suit our current style. It’s not just the pressing either, you want your front players to be interchangeable, pull the defenders around the pitch, similar to Liverpool (ok the players are slightly better). I’m not saying he is finished, I’m not even saying he can’t regain the fitness he had previously, I don’t think he is past it, in the right team he will probably thrive, just don’t think it will be here.

Time will tell though, feel free to bookmark and come back to me in 5, 10 games or at the end of the season, when he has proved me wrong.

[RoyMac5]

1 hour ago, AdamRam said:

This is why he doesn’t play, he doesn’t suit our current style.

No. He hasn't played regularly since Fulham (where he scored and played regularly until we stepped in) because he's been ill - since Reading. The beginning of this season is probably the first time he's been fit to play regularly.

[rynny]

2 hours ago, AdamRam said:

pull the defenders around the pitch

Martin did/does that, he often drifted out to the the wing, that's one of the reasons why Bryson/Russell/Ward always had so much space to run into. 

[europia]

Philip Cocu will be able to utilise CM as a useful stop gap until he starts to build the new squad. That could be good for Chris in his final season at PP, as I don't actually envisage that Cocu will seriously get his future squad shaped until after the Rooney circus has left town. 

[RoyMac5]

17 minutes ago, europia said:

... as I don't actually envisage that Cocu will seriously get his future squad shaped until after the Rooney circus has left town. 

Squads evolve. Now is what matters. How good will we be this season, not next. Until next season.

[europia]

4 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Squads evolve. Now is what matters. How good will we be this season, not next. Until next season.

That's generally been my view, but it seems this is truly a transitional season. We are suffering a bit due to the protracted departure of the Chelsea mafia. Could be good for some players like Martin and other fringe players though, to get championship game time. 

[B4ev6is]

I hope chris martin scores a screamer for Derby against leeds on saturday.

[AdamRam]

3 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

No. He hasn't played regularly since Fulham (where he scored and played regularly until we stepped in) because he's been ill - since Reading. The beginning of this season is probably the first time he's been fit to play regularly.

He has been out on loan twice since then, he also didn’t make the first team on either of them occasions on a regular basis.

[AdamRam]

3 hours ago, rynny said:

Martin did/does that, he often drifted out to the the wing, that's one of the reasons why Bryson/Russell/Ward always had so much space to run into. 

His game was never about running the channels or being able to play on the wing. Martin was one of, if not the best at what he did when he was playing regularly, I remember one of his last games for us against wolves when he was unplayable,  however nowadays just standing on the wing is no longer good enough.

[S8TY]

21 hours ago, cheron85 said:

That's a little harsh - From interviews and the way he plays I'd say Waggers is a smart player

I imagine it was more to do with him being dead on his feet by that point - He ran himself into the ground and he and Lawrence were kicked up in the air about every 5 mins by the Cardiff defenders

You're rather taken with hyperbole aren't you? We're only a few games into the season but the key problem we seem to have is scoring goals - We've tried several combinations of our 'newer' forwards so what's wrong with trying out Martin too?

And you harp on about others being obsessed with Martin's past yet you keep talking about the last few years

The ONLY thing that is relevant here is:

This season, this manager, this team - Is all that matters - If Cocu thinks a player might be useful then lets use him

I've already said fair play to Cocu for giving CM another chance so if you'd read what I'd written you'd see that i don't think there is anything wrong  with trying out Martin so why ask the question ???......and harp on pmsl....is it an obssesion to have an opinion based on what I've seen ? 

If Cocu thinks he might be useful then yes why not try him out but he's not been injured as far as i know and has had a full pre season and yet has not been involved prior to Cardiff so his selection might be due to Cocu wanting to try something different as opposed to being rated by Cocu.

I do think he can be a useful sub and would rather use him  than Bennett but my original post was in reaction to someone saying he should be in front of Waghorn.... but we all have opinions ....like I'd like to see Marriott and Waghorn up front in a two as the few times they've played together up front they've looked dangerous and link up well, Leeds and Wembley were two occasions 

[rynny]

8 hours ago, AdamRam said:

His game was never about running the channels or being able to play on the wing. Martin was one of, if not the best at what he did when he was playing regularly, I remember one of his last games for us against wolves when he was unplayable,  however nowadays just standing on the wing is no longer good enough.

Never said it was, he used to drift to the wing for the centre back to follow him, which is why I quoted the part of your post of pulling defenders out of position. 

[RoyMac5]

8 hours ago, AdamRam said:

He has been out on loan twice since then, he also didn’t make the first team on either of them occasions on a regular basis.

Because he wasn't fully recovered.

[ThePrisoner]

9 hours ago, AdamRam said:

He has been out on loan twice since then, he also didn’t make the first team on either of them occasions on a regular basis.

Because he was ill! He even said this himself in a pre-season video I'm sure of it. I think even Lampard last season said he was ill and working on getting back to fitness.

[AdamRam]

8 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

Because he wasn't fully recovered.

Have you any links to the timelines he was out for and the cause ?

[RoyMac5]

40 minutes ago, AdamRam said:

Have you any links to the timelines he was out for and the cause ?

No. Google for them.

[AdamRam]

46 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

No. Google for them.

I have, nothing at all comes up. Just wondered how a player that is supposedly recovering from such a bad illness passed two medicals.

[TuffLuff]

1 hour ago, AdamRam said:

Have you any links to the timelines he was out for and the cause ?

There isn’t really much that would be easy to find, but it’s been hinted at many times. On RamsTV I think Martin referenced it himself in a roundabout way, Eric Steele recently mentioned it on Radio Derby as well as it being mentioned on threads here. So, if you can down the ‘official’ route you will not find much but there’s more than enough to say what the cause was. Also there’s no official mention of it for the reason that it’s a private matter, hence why I’m not going to write ‘he had this, it does this’ etc as it’s not my place to say.

This is off the top of my head but I think this is roughly the timeline on which things happened 

->After Rowett mucked him about, he was diagnosed whilst on loan at Reading, after starting off ok he wasn’t played much towards the end of the season

->Thus arrived a week late for pre season last year.Played catch up with the rest and built fitness, worked with u23’s

-> Loan to Hull, ended up being in and out of the side which probably suited him in terms of building himself back up. Was praised by Adkins/Adkins staff that essentially said they had a good player with Martin but they needed to use him right? Essentially they got a player building himself back up rather than a fully fit player. 

->Full preseason and now reintroduced to the first team. 

(Summit like that anyway...)

[TuffLuff]

Just want to point out.

I made this thread about that moment on Friday night and to say it was a good positive moment. I didn’t want this thread to become about whether Martin has a future or not based on six minutes of timid football. Essentially we have a 30 year old footballer who’s got a point to prove, let’s wait and see what happens.

The last thing I want to do is recreate the pro Martin vs no Martin camps on here like we had on here. All it ended up doing was closedown debate and gave a few WUMs some attention. Martin may find his old form, he may not but that’s a debate for a different day. It’s impossible to say at this moment so it’s probably best to see what happens.

[AdamRam]

21 minutes ago, TuffLuff said:

There isn’t really much that would be easy to find, but it’s been hinted at many times. On RamsTV I think Martin referenced it himself in a roundabout way, Eric Steele recently mentioned it on Radio Derby as well as it being mentioned on threads here. So, if you can down the ‘official’ route you will not find much but there’s more than enough to say what the cause was. Also there’s no official mention of it for the reason that it’s a private matter, hence why I’m not going to write ‘he had this, it does this’ etc as it’s not my place to say.

This is off the top of my head but I think this is roughly the timeline on which things happened 

->After Rowett mucked him about, he was diagnosed whilst on loan at Reading, after starting off ok he wasn’t played much towards the end of the season

->Thus arrived a week late for pre season last year.Played catch up with the rest and built fitness, worked with u23’s

-> Loan to Hull, ended up being in and out of the side which probably suited him in terms of building himself back up. Was praised by Adkins/Adkins staff that essentially said they had a good player with Martin but they needed to use him right? Essentially they got a player building himself back up rather than a fully fit player. 

->Full preseason and now reintroduced to the first team. 

(Summit like that anyway...)

Thanks for taking the time out to write that post, given your following post I’ll leave it at that and hope that CM can continue to turn out and perform in a Rams shirt ?

[Steve How Hard?]

1 hour ago, TuffLuff said:

Just want to point out.

I made this thread about that moment on Friday night and to say it was a good positive moment. I didn’t want this thread to become about whether Martin has a future or not based on six minutes of timid football. Essentially we have a 30 year old footballer who’s got a point to prove, let’s wait and see what happens.

The last thing I want to do is recreate the pro Martin vs no Martin camps on here like we had on here. All it ended up doing was closedown debate and gave a few WUMs some attention. Martin may find his old form, he may not but that’s a debate for a different day. It’s impossible to say at this moment so it’s probably best to see what happens.

Well said that man. No point in opening up that old wound. You're right, Friday was a poignant moment for CM and his fan boys like us. Whilst some of the applause may have been for Marriots contributions to the game, it's fair to say that a lot was for the adulation and appreciation of CM. It was an emotive moment that was deserved and regardless of how it plays out, he hopefully now knows that he is appreciated and adored by the majority of the fanbase.