Van der MoodHoover Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 13 hours ago, Derby blood said: You have always been negative of his tactics, and for me Rowett is a brave manager, bringing on forwards with 20 minutes to go and getting goals in the last minute, also he has great knowledge of the game, knowing we had to tightened up the defence if we had any chance promotion this season, also makes some brave decisions in the transfer market, getting rid of Hughes and Ince, and bringing in players like Davis, Huddlestone and Ledley, to give the squad a better balance, for myself Mr Rowett is a very BRAVE manager, long may it continue. Needs to be balanced this talk of what Gary Rowett has and hasn't achieved. I had us down for 11th so he's way ahead of that and fair play to him for introducing greater solidity and getting unexpectedly good results. But let's not pretend he walks on water. Consider..... - our star turn was here already but misfiring and now that a system is in place to suit him looks a good player. But in so doing we have become a team who's swapped reliance on Ince for reliance on vydra. - ledley has proven to be a good signing. But it was pure fluke. Garys planning was taking us in a different direction. - the star signing that Gary claimed he pursued most of the summer (lawrence), has not been a great success yet. I wonder how he is being coached. - Garys game management seems like a bit of a stuck needle. The same points are being made repeatedly by a number of posters who go to the games. - we were having some success with Martin and Thorne as subs and we were generally purring with pleasure when these were being brought on to close games out. Now one's gone and the other is a struggling starter. - his comments yesterday about failing to press etc are smacking of players not being managed through the game. The manager has to work hard to get his instructions across. If he wants us 20 yards up the pitch then give them hell until they do it. Or sub them off. As I said I am not a Rowett hater but 2nd looks increasingly like a false position and simply using that achievement as a blanket defence of all Gary Rowetts actions is naive imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve How Hard? Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 10 hours ago, reveldevil said: Could we have got him back without the offer of an improved contract? Probably not, but it didn't help matters regarding Fulhams intransigence to releasing him during the window. We ended up with a player on an improved contract coming back and not justifying his position to another more pragmatic manager. Not a problem if Mel intended to give Mac this season, but a pretty lousy decision when in the end he didn't. Pretty much hit the nail on the head there. All part of Mels learning curve at the helm of being chairman. Easy for us all to judge him from a mere supporters stance but how many of us can truly say that we'd not make the same or similar mistakes. He's a shrewd self made business man and he's struggled with letting his heart rule his head. People are too quick to judge him imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 10 hours ago, reveldevil said: Could we have got him back without the offer of an improved contract? Probably not, but it didn't help matters regarding Fulhams intransigence to releasing him during the window. We ended up with a player on an improved contract coming back and not justifying his position to another more pragmatic manager. Not a problem if Mel intended to give Mac this season, but a pretty lousy decision when in the end he didn't. Did seem an especially odd move in hindsight when you consider McClaren never was really going to be the long term manager. He was only given an 18 months contract and had been doing a course to get into being a director so I don’t think it’s a stretch to suggest our long term future wasn’t going to be with him as manager (tho he may have moved upstairs of course). Think all the focus around getting Martin back distracted us in the January window myself, and probably in the end cost McClaren his job when he didn’t adapt to what he had. Imo he would still be in charge today had he not been so stubborn to a 433 the players weren’t suited to and switched to a 4231 with Vydra sooner than he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 1 minute ago, Millenniumram said: Did seem an especially odd move in hindsight when you consider McClaren never was really going to be the long term manager. He was only given an 18 months contract and had been doing a course to get into being a director so I don’t think it’s a stretch to suggest our long term future wasn’t going to be with him as manager (tho he may have moved upstairs of course). Think all the focus around getting Martin back distracted us in the January window myself, and probably in the end cost McClaren his job when he didn’t adapt to what he had. Imo he would still be in charge today had he not been so stubborn to a 433 the players weren’t suited to and switched to a 4231 with Vydra sooner than he did. It was an odd period in our recent history, that's for sure. Almost like Mel realised the 'Derby Way' was actually Mac's way, then after backing him to the hilt regarding Martin changed his mind, got shot of Mac and started from scratch. Obviously Martin has done well out of it financially, but I'd bet he wishes he'd just towed the Fulham line and not invested his future to Mac2! Still, Mel hasn't done anything mad since appointing Rowett, so maybe he's learning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 5 hours ago, archied said: Here we go,,,,, we are having a bloody good season , bloody good , and now we have done fantasticaly well to have reached and be in serious competition for second auto spot we have fans on here looking to moan and find fault in the manager because we have slipped to a point off second to villa who have spent spent spent on top of a prem squad already in place I think you will find that some of the comments you complain about are not induced by the events of this weekend but have been consistent comments for months. Some managers say that it is the quality of the performance that counts, as a way of discounting a match lost. For us too often this season the performances have been unconvincing despite winning. Yesterday we played some very good stuff but for what proportion of the whole match? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derby blood Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 10 hours ago, HantsRam said: Needs to be balanced this talk of what Gary Rowett has and hasn't achieved. I had us down for 11th so he's way ahead of that and fair play to him for introducing greater solidity and getting unexpectedly good results. But let's not pretend he walks on water. Consider..... - our star turn was here already but misfiring and now that a system is in place to suit him looks a good player. But in so doing we have become a team who's swapped reliance on Ince for reliance on vydra. - ledley has proven to be a good signing. But it was pure fluke. Garys planning was taking us in a different direction. - the star signing that Gary claimed he pursued most of the summer (lawrence), has not been a great success yet. I wonder how he is being coached. - Garys game management seems like a bit of a stuck needle. The same points are being made repeatedly by a number of posters who go to the games. - we were having some success with Martin and Thorne as subs and we were generally purring with pleasure when these were being brought on to close games out. Now one's gone and the other is a struggling starter. - his comments yesterday about failing to press etc are smacking of players not being managed through the game. The manager has to work hard to get his instructions across. If he wants us 20 yards up the pitch then give them hell until they do it. Or sub them off. As I said I am not a Rowett hater but 2nd looks increasingly like a false position and simply using that achievement as a blanket defence of all Gary Rowetts actions is naive imo. Do not agree at all, we were second for a reason, we do not concede goals, have a great goal difference, and Gary has signed very well, compared with our recent managers, squad is much better balanced, and talking to some inside Derby, a much better atmosphere between all members of the squad, so I am so happy and pleased how well everything is going, and I am also someone who goes to the games, some fans are positive and some will never be positive, that's the modern day fan, and probably always have been, will be enjoying our rise to the prem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 1 hour ago, reveldevil said: It was an odd period in our recent history, that's for sure. Almost like Mel realised the 'Derby Way' was actually Mac's way, then after backing him to the hilt regarding Martin changed his mind, got shot of Mac and started from scratch. Obviously Martin has done well out of it financially, but I'd bet he wishes he'd just towed the Fulham line and not invested his future to Mac2! Still, Mel hasn't done anything mad since appointing Rowett, so maybe he's learning. It was all very bizzare. Personally I think it was A very poor decision to bring McClaren back, he’d made his bed and we’d moved on as a team so to bring him back in some sort of nostalgic move was just wrong. That being said, once he’s in you can’t sack him a few months in when the team is such a mess. Someone needed a summer to sort it out, and tbf Rowett probbaly had more chance, given the team he had to start with was closer to one of his teams than a mac team. But it just meant the whole mac2 period was an expensive waste of time. Like you say though we’ve been pretty calm for a year, so let’s hope we can continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OohMartWright Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 3 hours ago, Steve How Hard? said: You strike me as one of the more rational posters on here but I don't understand your rationale behind not wanting our top goalscorer back at a time when his attributes fitted in with our style of play. Would you care to elaborate on that? Funny, I thought Vydra was our top goal scorer. Or are you doing a Forest and living in the past? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Sam Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 12 hours ago, McLovin said: I'd rather lose than keep this "unbeaten run" going. Losing would require us to try to win subsequent games without players having the mentality we must not lose. That's why we loved McClaren's football when we were at our peak, he would often go for the jugular and play 4-2-4 when required. A win and a loss is better than 2 draws. Draws are fine for the play offs, but for the top 2, we need to start winning at home. keep unbeaten run going Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archied Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 11 hours ago, Owd miner said: Worked down cadley hill , our donkey jackets were never that shiny , you must have worked in the showers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archied Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Well it’s official losing to Sheff weds will do us the world of good and stand us in better stead for auto promotion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 10 hours ago, HantsRam said: Needs to be balanced this talk of what Gary Rowett has and hasn't achieved. I had us down for 11th so he's way ahead of that and fair play to him for introducing greater solidity and getting unexpectedly good results. But let's not pretend he walks on water. Consider..... - our star turn was here already but misfiring and now that a system is in place to suit him looks a good player. But in so doing we have become a team who's swapped reliance on Ince for reliance on vydra. - ledley has proven to be a good signing. But it was pure fluke. Garys planning was taking us in a different direction. - the star signing that Gary claimed he pursued most of the summer (lawrence), has not been a great success yet. I wonder how he is being coached. - Garys game management seems like a bit of a stuck needle. The same points are being made repeatedly by a number of posters who go to the games. - we were having some success with Martin and Thorne as subs and we were generally purring with pleasure when these were being brought on to close games out. Now one's gone and the other is a struggling starter. - his comments yesterday about failing to press etc are smacking of players not being managed through the game. The manager has to work hard to get his instructions across. If he wants us 20 yards up the pitch then give them hell until they do it. Or sub them off. As I said I am not a Rowett hater but 2nd looks increasingly like a false position and simply using that achievement as a blanket defence of all Gary Rowetts actions is naive imo. So you could say, he’s doing a absolutely fantastic job with the squad he has had in the near in year he’s been here? Reading that means he must be overachieving in your eyes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete2 Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 10 hours ago, HantsRam said: Needs to be balanced this talk of what Gary Rowett has and hasn't achieved. I had us down for 11th so he's way ahead of that and fair play to him for introducing greater solidity and getting unexpectedly good results. But let's not pretend he walks on water. Consider..... - our star turn was here already but misfiring and now that a system is in place to suit him looks a good player. But in so doing we have become a team who's swapped reliance on Ince for reliance on vydra. - ledley has proven to be a good signing. But it was pure fluke. Garys planning was taking us in a different direction. - the star signing that Gary claimed he pursued most of the summer (lawrence), has not been a great success yet. I wonder how he is being coached. - Garys game management seems like a bit of a stuck needle. The same points are being made repeatedly by a number of posters who go to the games. - we were having some success with Martin and Thorne as subs and we were generally purring with pleasure when these were being brought on to close games out. Now one's gone and the other is a struggling starter. - his comments yesterday about failing to press etc are smacking of players not being managed through the game. The manager has to work hard to get his instructions across. If he wants us 20 yards up the pitch then give them hell until they do it. Or sub them off. As I said I am not a Rowett hater but 2nd looks increasingly like a false position and simply using that achievement as a blanket defence of all Gary Rowetts actions is naive imo. I haven't heard rowett's post match interview but if he's saying we needed to press further up the pitch why play with two CDMs? I actually think rowetts game management has been good... A factor in the large number of clean sheets. But I think something went wrong against Norwich and maybe we should have brought on subs earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Sam Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 you are not gonna win every game,there is going to be a few blips along the way ,but let's enjoy the ride at the moment,things could be a lot worse just look at that shower down the road ,they can't buy a draw ,let's just enjoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Tbh we are not one of the best two teams in this division. we will find our level. Top 6 but not top 2. We had a poor transfer window which has weakened the team. We were then unlucky with Winnall,but other teams have suffered worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 54 minutes ago, PistoldPete2 said: I haven't heard rowett's post match interview but if he's saying we needed to press further up the pitch why play with two CDMs? I actually think rowetts game management has been good... A factor in the large number of clean sheets. But I think something went wrong against Norwich and maybe we should have brought on subs earlier. For the first time in a long time this season I didn’t think we had the players on the bench to go and get goals at that point, yes tighten the game with ledley or Baird but I saw no spark from the bench coming ( start nugent by any means with Vydra then Jerome can change things around but it won’t help much having nugent on the bench) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Mafiabob said: So you could say, he’s doing a absolutely fantastic job with the squad he has had in the near in year he’s been here? Reading that means he must be overachieving in your eyes? Overachieved relative to my expectations is very likely (can't see us dropping to 11th by end of season). Aspects of his job he has done well in. But "fantastic"? Not for me....not yet. Arguably he is on the way tho. One thing that shapes my view is how many points Carson has saved us. He's having his best season in years. That's benefitted Gary's results. If he'd been merely average we would not be where we are and I don't personally give Gary much credit for that. Maybe that's harsh but it's just my view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Sam Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 3 hours ago, HantsRam said: Overachieved relative to my expectations is very likely (can't see us dropping to 11th by end of season). Aspects of his job he has done well in. But "fantastic"? Not for me....not yet. Arguably he is on the way tho. One thing that shapes my view is how many points Carson has saved us. He's having his best season in years. That's benefitted Gary's results. If he'd been merely average we would not be where we are and I don't personally give Gary much credit for that. Maybe that's harsh but it's just my view. it's a team game not just all about carson,working on your account without Martin's goals we could have been relegated a couple of times in the past,football is a team game as i'm sure Carson would point out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve How Hard? Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 12 hours ago, OohMartWright said: Funny, I thought Vydra was our top goal scorer. Or are you doing a Forest and living in the past? Not living in the past but discussing a past topic. Try and keep up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S8TY Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Some great points on here....I do agree it's hard to watch at times when we let the opposition seemingly dictate the game and we sit back and in truth is not how I would like us to play but GR seems to have got us playing an effective way of picking up points although I agree probably too many draws... I don't know if anyone else has thought this but what if we don't go up this season ? and next season we will still have the older players on contracts. will they be expected to go one better next season but a year older and will we buy some younger players thus bloating the squad which is what GR said he didn't want ? i really think we need to go up this season and turning a few draws into wins could be the difference the game away to Villa will be a massive game and one I think we can win ...Villa are not great Burton scored twice at there place and brum could've scored first yesterday and we are better than both of them... imo team to start against weds would be Carson Baird. Keogh. Davies. Forsyth Ledley. Hudds Weimann. Vydra. Lawrence Nugent I know Lawrence isn't exactly pulling up any trees but Id stick with him for confidence value for now ...Ledley and Baird must come back in and let's get Nugent and Vydra linking up again ...Jerome is a great option to come off the bench when players are tiring ...we have experienced players in our squad and now is not the time to panic but to pull together but I do think changes are required for weds I also think BJ will make a difference coming back from injury and could play in left mid and do think we've missed him a bit .....going to be lots of ups and downs in next couple of months ....we can do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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