Kernow Posted October 29, 2016 Share Posted October 29, 2016 Let's be honest. If it was the other way round we'd be pretty peed off we didn't get a penalty. Deliberate or not, it hit his arm on the goal line. If his arm was behind his back, it goes in the goal. That has to be grounds for a penalty in any game to be honest, deliberate or not. Fouls are committed throughout all games, they don't have to be deliberate so why do handballs? What I don't agree with though is the comments on the Sheff Wed forum basically blaming the decision for them losing the game. This happened at 0-0 and we scored in the 17th minute. Plenty of football to be played after the incident. If they were as good as they have claimed to be over the past 18 months, they should have been able to see off a little old 4th from bottom side anyway. I'm sure they'll get over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo jones Posted October 29, 2016 Share Posted October 29, 2016 Sat right behind it in the north stand, happened so quickly it wasn't obvious it hit his hand, though I did wonder. Dont think it was deliberate, and was down to the interpretation of the ref. I like this ref Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premier ram Posted October 29, 2016 Share Posted October 29, 2016 one of the better refs we have had for a while , he didnt give the penalty , he had a good view , so thats good enough for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StringerBell Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 5 hours ago, rammieib said: If that was the other way around AND we lose the game, we'd all be going crazy at the referee. For me, any defender in that position must put his hands behind his back or in front of his body. Bit like at a wall when the ref tells them where they can put their hands. So for me, it was a pen and red card. Nice to see a bit of honesty from our manager as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StringerBell Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 4 hours ago, sage said: Handball has to be deliberate. It wasn't deliberate. It wasn't a penalty. Any excuse to put some Half Man Half Biscuit on. "H is for handball. Which has to be intentional and very rarely is. If only people would study the rules more." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WystonRam Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 5 hours ago, StringerBell said: Any excuse to put some Half Man Half Biscuit on. "H is for handball. Which has to be intentional and very rarely is. If only people would study the rules more." The rules state that handball is handball. However, referees are given guidance - "Was the arm in an unnatural position to the body" in Keogh's case no it was not, however a penalty could have been given if the referee believed the hand ball stopped a goal- a sending off would be necessary if he deliberately moved his arm to the ball, which he did not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StringerBell Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 30 minutes ago, WystonRam said: The rules state that handball is handball. However, referees are given guidance - "Was the arm in an unnatural position to the body" in Keogh's case no it was not, however a penalty could have been given if the referee believed the hand ball stopped a goal- a sending off would be necessary if he deliberately moved his arm to the ball, which he did not. What is an unnatural position to the body though? That's meaningless. My arms are naturally attached to my shoulder. If they were attached to my face I suppose that would be as nature intended it. Also, I'm pretty sure the rules state that handball is deliberate not some brexit means brexit thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mihangel Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 8 hours ago, Kernow said: Let's be honest. If it was the other way round we'd be pretty peed off we didn't get a penalty. Deliberate or not, it hit his arm on the goal line. If his arm was behind his back, it goes in the goal. That has to be grounds for a penalty in any game to be honest, deliberate or not. Fouls are committed throughout all games, they don't have to be deliberate so why do handballs? Handball has to be deliberate because that's what the law says. Some people on here have listened waaaaay to much to ex player pundits. Expressions like "it's hit his hand it's a penalty" etc are just hogwash. Referees are instructed to consider distance from ball and natural position of arms when calculating 'deliberate', both of which go in Keogh's favour here. Advocating the old arms behind the back really makes me laugh, obviously unnatural, trying diving in for a block with arms behind back.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BramcoteRam84 Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 Definite Penalty, 100%. A red card would have been harsh. Wednesday right to be angry, but to blame that for losing the game?They outplayed us for long periods, didn't take chances and conceded 2 set pieces!! That's why they lost, Wednesday actually reminded me of Derby in the past 3 seasons! Hopefully this Rams team has a new found steel we can build on with attacking football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 I have only just seen the replay. Under the laws of the game a stonewal....excellent clearance, not a penatly. The law is the handball must be deliberate, it states the referee must be certain that the arm or hand is either in an unnatural position, or has made a movement towards the ball. It hit his foot/leg and rebounded into his arm/hand, no way did he move his hand towards the ball.Ref got it right. That said had it been the other way round probably would have been screaming for it and trying to find reasons it should have been given, thats football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 25 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said: Definite Penalty, 100%. A red card would have been harsh. Wednesday right to be angry, but to blame that for losing the game?They outplayed us for long periods, didn't take chances and conceded 2 set pieces!! That's why they lost, Wednesday actually reminded me of Derby in the past 3 seasons! Hopefully this Rams team has a new found steel we can build on with attacking football. They did have a lot of position and I thought looked a very nice footballing team, that said we played very well on the counter attack and could have had two more very good chances in the 2nd half had it not been for very cynical tackles by them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 8 hours ago, Premier ram said: one of the better refs we have had for a while , he didnt give the penalty , he had a good view , so thats good enough for me Had a pretty good game but made 2 big mistakes in not booking Hanson and Bannan who both kicked out at players after they had been beaten, both were ridiculous and dangerous challenges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 2 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Had a pretty good game but made 2 big mistakes in not booking Hanson and Bannan who both kicked out at players after they had been beaten, both were ridiculous and dangerous challenges. The ref had a decent game, same cannot be said for one of his linesmen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ketteringram Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 10 hours ago, Tony Le Mesmer said: Sang for first 15 and once novelty wears off quiet unless an 'incident' happens. Like all other fans that come. Sing for 90 even if your 8-0 down like they do in Germany and Austria otherwise nowt special. Good numbers though. Who does that when losing at the ipro? We don't even do that when we're winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsnip Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 10 hours ago, sage said: Was it deliberate? Is anything Keogh does deliberate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanjwitham Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 I've watched the replay half a dozen times at full speed, and I'm still not 100% sure what part of Keogh it actually hit. So given that, and the fact it was smashed at Keogh from about 5 yards away, there's no way the ref can be sure enough to give a penalty for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 3 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said: I've watched the replay half a dozen times at full speed, and I'm still not 100% sure what part of Keogh it actually hit. So given that, and the fact it was smashed at Keogh from about 5 yards away, there's no way the ref can be sure enough to give a penalty for it. This is the precise argument I have when people produce stills of an incident to prove they are right and official is wrong. I would love to see this technology where you can take a still photo with eyes. Absolutely bang on with your comment sir. What some don't understand is referees make mistakes..... standards are not slipping, English officials are the envy of the world. Apologies to digress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 59 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Had a pretty good game but made 2 big mistakes in not booking Hanson and Bannan who both kicked out at players after they had been beaten, both were ridiculous and dangerous challenges. Yeah, thought he was probably 2 cautions light in the game..... he only gave 13 free kicks. Let the game flow well and have plenty of advantages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIMBAUD Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 And he overruled the Lino who forgot where he was and what he was doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 Does it matter - it was not given, move on! Enjoy the win..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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