BarrowRam Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 Hopefully being manager pearson can bring in the players he wants. Not who the club decide to buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwram1973 Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 3 hours ago, jagerbob said: On one level, since Chris Evans left it has not been clear what our scouting/recruitment process is. So on that level its not a suprise, the appointment of Pearson does sound a tad like Mel is listening to the fans, not that I think that is a good thing. Fan or not, id rather a decent sound businessman who can show to make good strategic decisions be in charge than a fan who lets his heart make the decisions and fire a coach every time we dont get promoted in one season This appointment seems to me we are throwing out our original strategy on having a playing identity. This worries me much more than if or when we get promoted. Allowing a manager who according to averages will be gone in 18 months anyway to completely change the club is a dangerous game if you ask me. I cant see Man City or Chelsea changing their seperate Coach and Recruitment system any time soon. TBH I think Pearson was always going to have the job once PC was sacked, nothing to do with us numpties wanting him. Mels a successful, hard nosed businessman, he's hardly going to be influenced by a few weekend managers on a forum is he?. Pearson sells himself with his CV. Out of all the realistic candidates he was light years ahead of anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 For me, as long as the individual is sensible either can work. Tommy doc was manager as was jewell. And they single handedly masterminded the signing of no end of s***e. On the other hand you could say that the head coach with dof plus scouting /recruitment kept separate leads to unclear responsibilities and accountability. As long as total power is not vested in any individual should be OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramit Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 Am happy Pearson was appointed manager, don't imagine he would have accepted anything less. It's also a statement of self confidence and grabbing the Ram by the horns so to speak. Am all for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 Pearson will not tinker with our side. He will simply start building what he wants and anyone who does not fit in or cannot adapt will be moved on. There will be no sentiment whatsoever. Any Derby fan who thinks that Pearson is going to build the team that we want to watch will be disappointed. He will build a replica of his Leicester team. What did you think that was going to happen? It may take till Xmas then a long unbeaten run to the Play Offs.If he can get nearly all the players that he wants before the season starts then we may get off to a flyer. We know that three or four teams will get off to a flyer Frankly, we need to be one of those teams. It took us six games to win a match last year. Automatic promotion was lost right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 Leicetser's 09/10 Play-off team was more of a 433. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 5 hours ago, t'oldu said: it was explained on Radio Derby Special moan in last evening that the Head Coach shift was to get the most out of McClaren ie. Maximise the coaching which he is good at and strip away the rest of a manager's job which he is NOT good at. PC was a natural progression as was Wassall. Now we have an experienced Manager who can handle all aspects and will take the control back. Normality resumed................... Explained by who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 7 hours ago, David said: Not entirely true, whilst the idea isn't an English one it's becoming more common in England now. A look at last season in the top 2 leagues you had 6 head coaches in the Premier League and 10 in the Championship. Those numbers will increase over the coming seasons, Guardiola for a start will be head coach next season. I prefer the head coach role but it's important the appointments above are right, they should also lose their bullet proof vests when things go tits up. Leicester - Manager Arsenal - Manager Spurs - Head Coach Man City - Manager Man Utd - Manager Southampton - Manager West Ham - Manager Liverpool - Manager Stoke - Manager Chelsea - Head Coach Everton - Manager Swansea - Head Coach Watford - Head Coach West Brom - Head Coach Crystal Palace - Manager Bournemouth - Manager Sunderland - Manager Newcastle - Head Coach Norwich - Manager Villa - Manager Burnley - Manager Boro - Head Coach Brighton - Manager Hull - Manager Derby - Head Coach Shelf Wed - Head Coach Ipswich - Manager Cardiff - Manager Brentford - Head Coach Birmingham - Manager Preston - Manager QPR - Head Coach Leeds - Head Coach Wolves - Head Coach Blackburn - Manager Forest - Manager Reading - Manager Bristol C - Head Coach Huddersfield - Head Coach Fulham - Manager Rotherham - Manager Charlton - Head Coach MK Dons - Manager Bolton - Manager Pochettino signed a new contract to say his job title is manager earlier in the year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 6 hours ago, t'oldu said: it was explained on Radio Derby Special moan in last evening that the Head Coach shift was to get the most out of McClaren ie. Maximise the coaching which he is good at and strip away the rest of a manager's job which he is NOT good at. PC was a natural progression as was Wassall. Now we have an experienced Manager who can handle all aspects and will take the control back. Normality resumed................... Was thinking that the other day, when Schteve was first muted as a candidate, a lot of folk said "He's a great coach but the signings he made at F**est were shocking. If he doesn't have sole responsibility of signings I'll be happy" Hence the head coach/DoF structure. Now we have an experienced wheeler-dealer that Mel can trust with the purse strings we're back to a manager. I can't imagine Big Nige would've come if he had to argue over who he wants to bring in... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said: Pochettino signed a new contract to say his job title is manager earlier in the year I know but looking back over the majority of the season. Benitez is the manager at Newcastle but McClaren head coach, Guardiola is going in as head coach at Man City Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doodle Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 What ever the system. It must be the man in charge who picks the players to buy and sell in my opinion. What ever job you do, you want the right tools at hand to perform the task to the maximum. At work I have my preferred equipment and will take them with me from one job to another. I wouldn't like the thought of being supplied with stuff I don't like or don't need. Waste of money as it proved at Derby this season. I still think Johnson will prove a good buy and Weimann too. Not so sure about Blackman or camara tho. And certain Baird shotton Pearce will be a total waste of money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 31 minutes ago, David said: I know but looking back over the majority of the season. Benitez is the manager at Newcastle but McClaren head coach, Guardiola is going in as head coach at Man City I think the structure's more important than the job title. Southampton's structure's more continental despite Koeman being the manager in title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CornwallRam Posted May 28, 2016 Share Posted May 28, 2016 I think human nature makes the 'head coach' set up intrinsically wasteful. A manager who oversees all footballing activity at a club is likely to feel 'invested' in the players that come in - if he's been the main mover in signing a player or if he's regularly involved in the youth set up and has watched a young player develop until that player is ready for the first team. A manager is likely to persevere with players he feels some attachment to. In fact, if a manager has actually selected the coaches, he's more likely to respect their opinions on players and be more amenable to giving them a good chance. A head coach tasked with looking after the first team and coaching the players he is given is, naturally, far more likely to mark players who other people have given him as 'substandard' and reject them. Young players promoted from the U21s will never be considered 'ready' and incoming transfer will often be 'too foreign', 'too old', 'too young', 'not quite robust enough' etc. It seems to me that the head coach system has a greater 'failure' rate for transfer, and I argue that has little to do with the quality of the players, and everything to do with the natural attitude of the head coaches. Job titles themselves aren't actually important, but I feel that having a single person directing all football activities is essential unless a club is rich enough to be able to being in the very best players who only an idiot would not want to select/coch. I'd say that the key is getting the right manager as he has so much influence - the wrong one can set a club back years. My feeling is that a manager needs to have proven himself (and maybe one day herself) before being risked at a club the size of Derby County - not saying that we are huge, it equally applies to Forest, Leeds, Wednesday, Wolves etc. That 'apprenticeship can have been served a t a lower level, or even abroad, but bigger Championship clubs are not the place for complete rookies to learn, it's just too intense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archied Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Comes down to trust ,, let's be honest there are good coaches out there you just know will be a nightmare with the cheque book but you feel that they are good coaches and motivators so you end up with a team or individual you trust to bring in good players for the club ,, there are good wheeler dealer managers who are good at that and good tactitions but not great coaches but get a good coach alongside them then hey presto ,ala j smith s Mac combo ,,, , my gut feeling is that in Pearson at this stage of his career we have employed one of those rare breed who are good at both and well capable of the work rate and attention to detail to be a manager in the full and proper sense ,,, add to that the fact it's very clear from his comments that he really wants this job , is not scared of it and will work his nuts off to make Derby a success then we all have cause to be very optimistic for the future Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trevor1946 Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 A good post Cornwall,and.briefly covers the.issues,between head coach and manager,responsibility is key. Hiding behind a committee,group decisions,papers over cracks,I think Mel Morris,has listened to advice from, his board,and taken a brave decision,in setting on Pearson has manager,and Powell in the assistant role. After all Mel as the owner,still has the final say,, , how the club is run Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Would still like to know who had the say on transfers in the last few seasons. Was Pearce bought on a free, befoe we thought we would sign Shackell, or anyone else like Dunk. Whilst Bent and Ince had decent half seasons for Derby once Martin was out of the team, they both did not work at all this season. Baird, again on a free, but over time neither PC or DW fancied playing him. Buttefield and Johnson had their moments, but suited different systems to the one we ended up playing later in the season under Wassall. Slightly strange signings in Camera and Blackman if youre not going to play them. I knkow Blackman didnt score and it effected his confidence badly, Camers never appeared as anything more than a sub. Obviously Wassall didnt play them much either. Even stranger decision by Mel to sack Clement when he did. Mel should have either not backed PC in january with these signings, and told him to stick with what we had. or He should have given him the rest of the season. Something major must have broken down between MM and PC from end of jan to mid feb. Way too much guess work in signings last season, IMO. Its never helped by out style and the type of player we have already, where the squad just arent very flexible, and only certain systems suit them, making it very very hard to find the right players to come in and compliment them. Who remembers when it just used to be a simple case of cover in every position in a 4-4-2, in the good old days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 On 28/05/2016 at 19:48, David said: I know but looking back over the majority of the season. Benitez is the manager at Newcastle but McClaren head coach, Guardiola is going in as head coach at Man City Benitez being "manager" was one of the key points to persuading him to stay. He insisted on having full control and say on all transfers according to press reports. The head coach and DOF vs manager debate we have at derby has been more intensive at St James' They have gone down the route of a DOF pretty much since Wise arrived with mike Ashley and it has never worked for them. Like i said earlier, i cant see the man City or Chelsea model changing, the ins and outs of the playing staff at those clubs tend to happen half the time whilst they havent even got a coach. They have extensive scotuing setups and practically farm young players. Both got scores and scores of players out on loan in Europe, and have great youth team squads regularly winning U21 honours in this country, but never get given a chance in the first time. It doesnt seem to matter that they get a new head coach every 2 seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 6 hours ago, jagerbob said: Who remembers when it just used to be a simple case of cover in every position in a 4-4-2, in the good old days? Nope. Not me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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