Ashz09 Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 7 hours ago, Carl Sagan said: I'd like a secret place on the forum where sane people can discuss things and post sensibly. Just got in and haven't read the 50+page other threads, but can imagine what they're saying. But this one has restored my faith in some kind of silent sensible Derby-loving majority. Carry on! I usually read the 1st 2-3 pages.. Then see the 60+ page part then skip to the end read the last page then choose another thread or if something relevant was said try and find it on the other 55+ pages... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninos Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 9 hours ago, eddie said: Seppuku by spork? I have to read through a lot of Eddiness to find little gems like this. Hehe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninos Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 6 hours ago, jagerbob said: Having reflected on tonight, and hearing the fans views, and what Sam had to say. I now have one question i wish i could ask.... even though the truth probably wouldnt be told and that is... How exactly did Mel and PCs views differ which led to them feeling the need to part company. If PC had only a short term view (ie he wanted promotion this year at all costs), and Mel wants player improvement through coaching, (im guessing our current players to get better) does this point to the January signings which have hardly been used after signing, and which might be tagged "a waste of money". i'd love to know. Not too difficult to answer jäger (if we are to believe Mel and Sam) : If you are to believe Mel then PC wanted to win promotion now by a) playing a super safe patient non attacking style b) just acquiring one player after another to fit needs mostly regardless of whether they'd make premier league players - the last thing he went after was pace and c) keeping untried youth players out of the squad and the player value issue (largely related to letting promising young players play) So it wasn't promotion that was the issue it was the other 3 things - all of which undermined the very things MM rightly yes rightly believes, especially 1 (derby way) and 3 (increasing the value of the players). When he looked at the squad, with the exception of slight improvement for Keogh Thorne and Christie all players probably lost value under PC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEAO Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 I watched the second half from Saturday on Ram player and was highly encouraged by what I saw. For the first time this season we had a mobile midfield which moved the ball forward quickly and accurately. , Martin was at his best as the focus , Ince looked lively and tricky and each time we attacked a goal looked a possibility. If that is Wassall's influence then long may it continue . I really don't understand these people who tell the world that they are angry and not renewing or spit venomous comments at people because they made a mistake. Football is a game which has highs and lows but that's all it is. I go to watch Derby because they are my team and always will be. If they win and win well I am happy and similarly if they lose I am disappointed but there is always the next game or another season to look forward to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ewe Ram Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 30 minutes ago, SEAO said: I watched the second half from Saturday on Ram player and was highly encouraged by what I saw. For the first time this season we had a mobile midfield which moved the ball forward quickly and accurately. , Martin was at his best as the focus , Ince looked lively and tricky and each time we attacked a goal looked a possibility. If that is Wassall's influence then long may it continue . I really don't understand these people who tell the world that they are angry and not renewing or spit venomous comments at people because they made a mistake. Football is a game which has highs and lows but that's all it is. I go to watch Derby because they are my team and always will be. If they win and win well I am happy and similarly if they lose I am disappointed but there is always the next game or another season to look forward to. Excellent points there. I was at Rotherham and was very pleased with the game for 80 minutes. Some fans have erased that from their minds in order to do a bit more Wassall bashing. Nobody was more gutted than me about the collapse but it's football. Unfortunately there's another 11 players and a manager trying to spoil things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chester40 Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 Is anyone invited to this love-in...? I have some joss-sticks and I'm great at tantric stuff... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOB BIGGS Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 1 hour ago, SEAO said: I watched the second half from Saturday on Ram player and was highly encouraged by what I saw. For the first time this season we had a mobile midfield which moved the ball forward quickly and accurately. , Martin was at his best as the focus , Ince looked lively and tricky and each time we attacked a goal looked a possibility. If that is Wassall's influence then long may it continue . I really don't understand these people who tell the world that they are angry and not renewing or spit venomous comments at people because they made a mistake. Football is a game which has highs and lows but that's all it is. I go to watch Derby because they are my team and always will be. If they win and win well I am happy and similarly if they lose I am disappointed but there is always the next game or another season to look forward to. Far too sensible - yellow card Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 8 hours ago, RamNut said: I think darren got himself into trouble with his various after-match interview comments. i actually stuck up for him and his interview after rotherham because i think in the heat of the moment with adrenalin pumping around etc it is very difficult to be eloquent and dispassionate and rational. I even noted that some of you were over reacting after the match. i think the anger at dropping two points is as OTT after Rotherham as the act of a chairman walking into the dressing room and letting rip after a home draw with Reading. Yes its disappointing etc etc but we've been here before - e.g. two late goals v brum, and sheffield wednesday in recent times. Furthermore whatever the tactical errors, both the first and second goals could easily have been disallowed for fouls. However, i agree with truelou that the decision making is a cause for concern and people are entitled to question what is going on and whether - taking a step back - we are heading in the right direction. Blind faith is all very well but a critical friend is probably of more value ultimately. the best thing about sam's interview was that he acknowledged the doubt and the scepticism and appeared to listen. Absolutely spot on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 8 hours ago, RamNut said: Yes its disappointing etc etc but we've been here before - e.g. two late goals v brum, and sheffield wednesday in recent times Oops, didn't see/read this before posting similar as a thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shang Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 8 hours ago, jagerbob said: Having reflected on tonight, and hearing the fans views, and what Sam had to say. I now have one question i wish i could ask.... even though the truth probably wouldnt be told and that is... How exactly did Mel and PCs views differ which led to them feeling the need to part company. If PC had only a short term view (ie he wanted promotion this year at all costs), and Mel wants player improvement through coaching, (im guessing our current players to get better) does this point to the January signings which have hardly been used after signing, and which might be tagged "a waste of money". i'd love to know. I believe Mel has already hinted at what the differences were. Clement wanted promotion at all costs, at the cost of team harmony (by bringing in other players and bloating up the squad) and playing negatively and too rigidly to grind out results. Apparently also didn't bother with youth and never went to scout another football team before matches (except for Manchester United) which showed that he wasn't really committed as much as he should have been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 I think most people get so wound up because we're sooooooooooo close to getting things right. We reach for the last couple of rungs on the ladder, our footing goes and we slip down ten steps, whacking our chin on each rung on the way down... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 3 hours ago, Ashz09 said: I usually read the 1st 2-3 pages.. Then see the 60+ page part then skip to the end read the last page then choose another thread or if something relevant was said try and find it on the other 55+ pages... Trouble is, it's usually 50+ pages of puns. Does my head in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 I think one of the main factors that has aroused so much bile against Wassell is that he's not a natural at public oratory, he's a bit of a Craig Ramage in that respect. He's passionate, and his enthusiasm and exaspiration get the better of him. If he delivered his after match reaction in a carefully reasoned and school-masterly manner (think PC) maybe his detractors would think better of him, Give me DW's passion anytime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ossieram Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 48 minutes ago, Phoenix said: I think one of the main factors that has aroused so much bile against Wassell is that he's not a natural at public oratory, he's a bit of a Craig Ramage in that respect. He's passionate, and his enthusiasm and exaspiration get the better of him. If he delivered his after match reaction in a carefully reasoned and school-masterly manner (think PC) maybe his detractors would think better of him, Give me DW's passion anytime. I don't listen to most interviews after the game, especially if I have seen the game myself. I tend to make my own mind up about what I've seen and if I haven't seen it and we have the lost the game, I don't want to hear the excuses or bull no matter who the manager is. Occasionally I will listen if I have the radio on and then I either disagree or agree, but I don't seriously believe what they say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 I didn't notice this thread, as being part of the silent sane majority that this thread is inhabited by I wasn't on the forum at all, was dealing with real life things Been a long time since I've gone through a thread agreeing with every post, too long. It's like breathing the fresh air after decades underground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 1 hour ago, Phoenix said: I think one of the main factors that has aroused so much bile against Wassell is that he's not a natural at public oratory, he's a bit of a Craig Ramage in that respect. He's passionate, and his enthusiasm and exaspiration get the better of him. If he delivered his after match reaction in a carefully reasoned and school-masterly manner (think PC) maybe his detractors would think better of him, Give me DW's passion anytime. I don't mind the passion. But when it's paired with unwarranted praise and a lack of accountability it gets a lot of peoples backs up. If he's come out and held his hands up after Saturday's game people might've thought a bit more of him. At least PC held his hands up when he'd made a hash of things... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 3 minutes ago, ramsbottom said: I don't mind the passion. But when it's paired with unwarranted praise and a lack of accountability it gets a lot of peoples backs up. If he's come out and held his hands up after Saturday's game people might've thought a bit more of him. At least PC held his hands up when he'd made a hash of things... did Nigel ever admit he ballsed up?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 Just now, Mostyn6 said: did Nigel ever admit he ballsed up?? I don't remember anything Nigel said, or did. Genuinely. One of the least memorable tenures ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 3 minutes ago, SaintRam said: I don't remember anything Nigel said, or did. Genuinely. One of the least memorable tenures ever. He said "errr" a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 3 minutes ago, SaintRam said: I don't remember anything Nigel said, or did. Genuinely. One of the least memorable tenures ever. I have mixed feelings on this, and it's no way a Nigel dig (before anyone suggests that) but I don't recall him ever admitting to making an error. I sometimes think that position requires a level of defiance and confidence in your own decisions. You often hear managers saying "we are doing the right things... it'll click soon" or similar. There is also a time when the defiance steps over the line and becomes delusion. I'm not sure Wassall genuinely believes the things he's saying and it's a (possibly ill-conceived) attempt at psychology. I similarly didn't think Nigel was deluded, but was old school in regard to thinking the players were professionals and should be capable of following instructions properly. Sooner or later, something will have to give with Wassall, either it'll click and he won't need to be defiant, or he'll speak the truth if it doesn't, or he'll be removed from the firing line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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