Mel Morris new owner

[CapeTownRams]

Not sure it's fully appreciated that the ex ownership group still in fact effectively have an interest in the Club via the significant loans (debt) DCFC still owe them. Will be interesting to see how those outstanding loans affect how the annual statements record the debt and whether it's different now the ex owners perhaps are more keen to actually get a commercial return on the money owed.

[Mostyn6]

White wine, never red

never ever red!

supweyer?

you do realise White Wine gives men moobs?

[Inverurie Ram]

I dunno. It really began to effect Lee Grant's performances 

But has improved Scott Carson's performances, since he's been bathing in it, brushing his teeth in it, and pouring it on his kellogs!

Surely Shirley it's got to be time for another DCFC Official interview with Scott Carson, very entertaining.

[Boycie]

you do realise White Wine gives men moobs?

someone must be feeding me white wine in my sleep.

[Inverurie Ram]

Would that someone, be yourself, c'mon admit it, you are hooked up to one of these, and you fill it up before your little furry friend Ted tucks you in........

A Drip for a Drip.

http://www.wisegeek.org/what-is-an-intravenous-drip.htm

[Boycie]

How dare you!

[Tombo]

Not sure it's fully appreciated that the ex ownership group still in fact effectively have an interest in the Club via the significant loans (debt) DCFC still owe them. Will be interesting to see how those outstanding loans affect how the annual statements record the debt and whether it's different now the ex owners perhaps are more keen to actually get a commercial return on the money owed.

I don't think we do owe them anything, they turned the debt into equity. Which is something I still don't properly understand but I'm sure it means we don't owe them directly. They will have got it back when Mel bought their shares.

[CapeTownRams]

Tombo - no, Brett Wilson told me today that " Mel is the sole equity owner - I am still a lender to the club - and a lifelong fan".

nice guy. Good bloke.

not 100% sure of course what he means specifically when he says he's , " a lender". What else could it mean other than in the strict sense ? That's to say, lend money. Suggestions ?

[G STAR RAM]

Do you believe that young players wouldn't find us an attractive proposition? Have you not seen our training ground? We are Cat 1 so get all the best opposition and players are still breaking into the first team if they are good enough. Hasn't Jamie Hanson just broke into the first team who has been here since 7?

The method we have employed hasn't got us any success though and why wouldn't it be as sweet having a Derby fan as an owner instead of a group of American investors?

Yes I do believe that. I imagine most youngsters are more likely to go to a place where they have a chance of getting into the first team rather than worrying about the quality of the training ground, there again I never reached that level so I don't know.

On Jamie Hanson, no he broke into the first team last season under different management. And, although he played well when given the chance this season, I imagine that he will be making way now for the new players.

It all depends on how you define success? Reaching the play off final with a team built on the cheap was a huge success for me, especially as I really enjoyed the football and atmosphere along the way. Anything other than automatic promotion now, given what we have spent, will be a big failure and I think this is reflected in the reaction of some fans already.

Of course it would be good for a local businessman, who is a fan, to make us a success but for me it has got to be done in the right way. The aftermath the Lionel Pickering and LoG 'successes' are still very fresh in my mind.

 

[nfb]

Impressive interview, i liked when it was said he had just spent 20m, he didnt swallow hard or blink other than normally,  looks a balanced and intelligent guy, and i think it bodes well for us, lets hope he can bring about his vision for the club, unlike the 'Global brand' of the last owners, who did a good job, but fell short of that, and while MM does have Arab style billions he does seeming have a very level head,and is a Ram which i prefer, to idiosyncratic, scarf wearing multi millionaire owners.....

 

Onwards and Upwards MM

[sage]

Isn't it weird that is virtually right where sage sits?

ssshhhhhhh

[ramblur]

Tombo - no, Brett Wilson told me today that " Mel is the sole equity owner - I am still a lender to the club - and a lifelong fan".

nice guy. Good bloke.

not 100% sure of course what he means specifically when he says he's , " a lender". What else could it mean other than in the strict sense ? That's to say, lend money. Suggestions ?

Think I can clear this one up.I reported some time ago that £12m worth of preference shares were issued last year and suggested that this may have been ,along with £3m cash,to clear the Co-op loan (which I now believe to have been the case).NAP (including Brett) took up £9,532,888 worth,with Mel subscribing to £2,467,112 worth. So effectively,instead of owing the Co-op £15m,we now owe NAP and Mel the above figures.

Years ago preference shares were classed as equity,but are now classed as debt.They can often be long dated (redemption date a long time in the future),but in view of unfolding events,I suspect they will be fairly short dated with a very low coupon (interest rate).Mel will have bought out NAP's equity and there would have been no imperative to sort out the preference shares at this time.It's really nothing to worry about and is small beer compared to recent events.The large NAP loans you refer to were converted to equity some time ago.

On the subject of the stadium loan ,I'd earlier suggested that a charge taken in Jan of this year by Barclays might have suggested a remortgage.I now believe that they are simply our new bankers and that the charge may simply relate to an overdraft facility.Good news for me because someone had a dig at me on 'Popside' a few months ago,suggesting it was common knowledge that a remortgage took place in Jan 2015. Now exposed as the chancer he probably is.

[Animal is a Ram]

@ramblur, any idea how much of the stadium loan/mortgage is left?

[Cam the Ram]

Think I can clear this one up.I reported some time ago that £12m worth of preference shares were issued last year and suggested that this may have been ,along with £3m cash,to clear the Co-op loan (which I now believe to have been the case).NAP (including Brett) took up £9,532,888 worth,with Mel subscribing to £2,467,112 worth. So effectively,instead of owing the Co-op £15m,we now owe NAP and Mel the above figures.

Years ago preference shares were classed as equity,but are now classed as debt.They can often be long dated (redemption date a long time in the future),but in view of unfolding events,I suspect they will be fairly short dated with a very low coupon (interest rate).Mel will have bought out NAP's equity and there would have been no imperative to sort out the preference shares at this time.It's really nothing to worry about and is small beer compared to recent events.The large NAP loans you refer to were converted to equity some time ago.

On the subject of the stadium loan ,I'd earlier suggested that a charge taken in Jan of this year by Barclays might have suggested a remortgage.I now believe that they are simply our new bankers and that the charge may simply relate to an overdraft facility.Good news for me because someone had a dig at me on 'Popside' a few months ago,suggesting it was common knowledge that a remortgage took place in Jan 2015. Now exposed as the chancer he probably is.

While you're here ramblur, apologises if you've explained before (I'm sure you probably have), but do you expect us to be under an embargo next season or in a few years after this FFP period? (I'm still not 100% sure how the new FFP rules work) After watching Mel's interview it seems he's confident we're fine financially and even said he'd be willing to show their finances to fans who have concerns. However, Fawaz tweeted this today in response to a Derby fan:

And of course, you can never be certain whether Fawaz knows what's going on or if he's just trying to wind people up. 

[ramblur]

I don't think we do owe them anything, they turned the debt into equity. Which is something I still don't properly understand but I'm sure it means we don't owe them directly. They will have got it back when Mel bought their shares.

Think I can help you out here,Tombo. As long as you appreciate that injecting equity into a business usually means injecting cash into same,you should be fine.Now let's look at a situation where owners lend a club a certain amount -the club then owes the owners (who are also equity holders) this amount. Imagine then that these same owners then issue themselves new shares to this amount and inject the proceeds into the club.This could then be used to repay the loan,with the proceeds going to........the party/parties having just injected the cash.All a bit pointless when a simple book entry could convert the debt into equity.

On a separate note,and nothing to do with your post,I said sometime ago that there appeared to be shares denoted in a foreign currency.This arose because a continuation sheet (for shares issued in foreign currencies) was used,but the currency wasn't entered.On the latest return,the same continuation sheet has been used,but this time 'Pounds Sterling' has been entered.It's now obvious to me that we didn't have a PS continuation sheet in either case,and so used the other one.The upshot is that we never had shares in other currencies -must admit I found it a bit odd at the time.

[ramblur]

@ramblur, any idea how much of the stadium loan/mortgage is left?

See the last sentence of my first paragraph,AR!

[Animal is a Ram]

See the last sentence of my first paragraph,AR!

D'oh, didn't realise they were one and the same thing... my bad. Thanks.

[ramblur]

While you're here ramblur, apologises if you've explained before (I'm sure you probably have), but do you expect us to be under an embargo next season or in a few years after this FFP period? (I'm still not 100% sure how the new FFP rules work) After watching Mel's interview it seems he's confident we're fine financially and even said he'd be willing to show their finances to fans who have concerns. However, Fawaz tweeted this today in response to a Derby fan:

And of course, you can never be certain whether Fawaz knows what's going on or if he's just trying to wind people up. 

Did a post earlier on this.Whilst I (like Farwaz) can't possibly know what our actual situation is,I can at least see a situation wherein we're probably fine,though I expect it to be tight.If it's tight this year and we're still in the same division next year,then it would almost certainly be tight again then (without player sales or a big income boost from somewhere).Again I'll say that we've only been able to do what we have this year because of what we did in past years,and others are now jealous.I've very little doubt that we'll comply.

[Cam the Ram]

Did a post earlier on this.Whilst I (like Farwaz) can't possibly know what our actual situation is,I can at least see a situation wherein we're probably fine,though I expect it to be tight.If it's tight this year and we're still in the same division next year,then it would almost certainly be tight again then (without player sales or a big income boost from somewhere).Again I'll say that we've only been able to do what we have this year because of what we did in past years,and others are now jealous.I've very little doubt that we'll comply.

Good to hear, thank you very much, ramblur.

[ramblur]

As far as future years go,I can tell you that from next year we'll have to supply the League with evidence of ongoing secure ownership funding (whatever form that takes,but I'm sure there'd be no problems there) along with financial forecasts for 2 years thence. I'd be pretty confident that we've been doing the latter as a matter of course anyway -we're not a Mickey Mouse organisation.

I'll give you a possible example,given that the FFP result derives from the P/L result and that players' wages/signing on fees and amortisation are significant factors.Imagine a spreadsheet with the pro playing staff listed vertically and ongoing years in horizontal columns,and let's say that these columns are split in 2 (Wages/signing fees +amortisation).You can simply slot in the figures and amend for new signings/sales and contract renewals,so you always have a feel for what's lying ahead and what scope might be available.You can even do this at home,though you'd have a better chance with amortisation (divide all in fee by contract length) than you would with wages.From what I've seen from past guesstimates,there'd be some pretty huge wage bills emerging!

As far as cash forecasts are concerned,amortisation would simply be replaced by instalments due on the capital expenditure side. I know full well that all of these things will be constantly monitored by the club.

Don't know what Fawaz does -probably uses the back of a fag packet ,LOL