Palestine

[ariotofmyown]

4 hours ago, Broderick said:

For people that oppose Israel, I'm curious what they think would have been an appropriate response from Israel after the 10/7 attack from Hamas?

Not killing Israeli hostages by bombing Gaza?

How many deaths in Gaza do you feel appropriate in response to the attacks?

[DerbysLane]

11 hours ago, MaltRam said:

I let a lot of what you say on here slide Mostyn, because I feel that, like myself, you may not be the full 9 yards at times...but you should hang your head in crying shame for having typed that. Shame on you.

That is the same ratio of reported/actual deaths I've seen suggested by a world leader for the Gaza hospital bombing.  President Biden doubts the casualty figures in Gaza as a whole.  Are you calling for them to hang their head in shame too?

Personally I believe the Gaza figures.  I also believe the Israel figures.  But I don't believe everything that is reported, for example, I think it is now widely accepted that 40 babies weren't beheaded by Hamas.  However, if you do a search for 'Palestine' on twitter you'll easily come across videos of beheaded babies from Israeli bombing.

[Alph]

8 hours ago, Broderick said:

For people that oppose Israel, I'm curious what they think would have been an appropriate response from Israel after the 10/7 attack from Hamas?

How about to continue what they've been doing for the past 50+ years. 

This is what I mean about Israel telling the story from October 7th. 

"We were attacked"

How many Palestinians died, were brutally beaten, displaced, arrested without charges, shot or severely injured by IDF forces or Israeli settlers (settler violence is common) before the 7th? Even if you only include West Bank and not Hamas controlled Gaza? 

People refer to Gaza as an open air prison/concentration camp/internment camp but I don't think people really think about what life in Gaza is like. What restrictions they face. How desperate life is there. Well, worse than desperate, it's pointless. As time goes by the situation constantly gets worse. And I'm talking about a Palestinians here, not Hamas.

The causality numbers are there to see. 

The illegally occupied land is there to see. 

The number of special military operations in West Bank is there to see. 

The number of protesters killed is there to see (and before anybody says but they aren't innocent... Let's consider these are people having their homes stolen so can we cut them slack for being a bit annoyed?)

The number of assaults on Gaza is there to see. 

Piers Morgan likes very much to start the story on October 7th. And if somebody dares not condemn Hamas within 30 seconds then he starts with the "beheaded babies" (no such independent proof) and says "biggest attack on Jews since Holocaust"

What Israel call an attack, Hamas call a retaliation. And what Israel call a retaliation, Palestinians calls standard procedure. 

[Alph]

4 hours ago, ariotofmyown said:

Not killing Israeli hostages by bombing Gaza?

How many deaths in Gaza do you feel appropriate in response to the attacks?

Bassem Youssef was pretty funny but also quite tragic when he referred to the exchange rate. 

https://youtu.be/tt-CuNzMkFE?si=iFtG5gy5JjfWlwtj

[Alph]

Sorry wrong link. That was some strange reaction 

https://youtu.be/Tc0h32bY67A?si=9cIZqllT4SjhVs07

[Archied]

1 hour ago, Alpha said:

How about to continue what they've been doing for the past 50+ years. 

This is what I mean about Israel telling the story from October 7th. 

"We were attacked"

How many Palestinians died, were brutally beaten, displaced, arrested without charges, shot or severely injured by IDF forces or Israeli settlers (settler violence is common) before the 7th? Even if you only include West Bank and not Hamas controlled Gaza? 

People refer to Gaza as an open air prison/concentration camp/internment camp but I don't think people really think about what life in Gaza is like. What restrictions they face. How desperate life is there. Well, worse than desperate, it's pointless. As time goes by the situation constantly gets worse. And I'm talking about a Palestinians here, not Hamas.

The causality numbers are there to see. 

The illegally occupied land is there to see. 

The number of special military operations in West Bank is there to see. 

The number of protesters killed is there to see (and before anybody says but they aren't innocent... Let's consider these are people having their homes stolen so can we cut them slack for being a bit annoyed?)

The number of assaults on Gaza is there to see. 

Piers Morgan likes very much to start the story on October 7th. And if somebody dares not condemn Hamas within 30 seconds then he starts with the "beheaded babies" (no such independent proof) and says "biggest attack on Jews since Holocaust"

What Israel call an attack, Hamas call a retaliation. And what Israel call a retaliation, Palestinians calls standard procedure. 

Think we all know Morgan is a twxt, bloke giving it all the big un and telling the plebs what they should be doing during covid whilst off on a nice family Christmas break to the Caribbean 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Alph]

12 minutes ago, Archied said:

Think we all know Morgan is a twxt, bloke giving it all the big un and telling the plebs what they should be doing during covid whilst off on a nice family Christmas break to the Caribbean 🤷🏻‍♂️

He's vile. He seemed a bit uncomfortable when Mohammed Hajib pulled him up on his journalism scandal. I think Morgan thought he'd buried that in a sea of controversy but fortunately it can still be seen. Floating on his "marmite personality". A shining beacon that confirms he is ultimately a massive Bamford

Edited October 27, 2023 by Alpha

[Alph]

It's interesting hearing Israeli press conferences where they seem to be telling the lie that dead Palestinians are collateral damage for a greater cause. I'd like to see what the region looks like with Hamas gone. Is it Netenyahu and Abbas running through wheat fields together surrounded by Jewish and Muslim children? Seriously, Hamas gone. Then what? 

So to be clear, Hamas killing 1,400 Jews in an area under constant surveillance and heavy security near Gaza Strip, carried out this attack because they are evil?

Some might suggest that if we are talking about people like they're pawns on a chessboard that Hamas, who can't possibly defeat IDF in combat, resort to guerilla warfare and/or terrorism (from Roman civil war to Suffragettes, we've seen forcing change has happened this way) knew Israel would respond like this. So why did they do it? 

Some might suggest they did it knowing all this would play out. That with the power of social media and off the back of the Ukraine war people would be able to see beyond their limited news sources. That there would maybe be international pressure on Israel. 

I mean why else kill 1400 civilians? It doesn't put even a dent in Israel's power. So maybe the 1400 were "collateral damage" 

However Israel's collateral damage makes less sense?

Will this eradicate Hamas? Nope. 

Will this bring back hostages? If Hamas are just pure evil then those hostages will be dead either by knife or bomb. So no. 

One could argue even further that Hamas took hostages to release them during this period to perhaps improve public perception. Especially as some of the hostages are being treated fairly well. Even calling Hamas militants friendly and kind. 

Imagine if what Hamas did on October 7th actually had more of a noble cause than what Israel are doing now. "Collateral damage" they say? Ok let's go with that logic

Edited October 27, 2023 by Alpha

[ramit]

There was movement of troops last evening into Gaza, it is the second time this has occurred, yet no official news of the event.  Word is that it was special ops, a mix of IDF and NATO troops and that it didn't go well.

[ramit]

8 hours ago, ramit said:

There was movement of troops last evening into Gaza, it is the second time this has occurred, yet no official news of the event.  Word is that it was special ops, a mix of IDF and NATO troops and that it didn't go well.

Correction, there are reports now, but conflict with others as happens with fog of war

 

[DerbysLane]

This conflict has exposed how morally bankrupt the leaders in this country are.  Not just politicians (my voting intention for the general election has now changed), but religious leaders too. 

You'd think it would be the natural position for the head of the Church of England to seek out peace, to minimize the loss of life, but no, Welby talks about Israel having a right and duty to defend itself.  Hamas is described as evil, but the same description is not applied to Israel when they kill thousands of children.  

ITV news last night had an interview with the Chief Rabbi.  While we may bend over backwards to make a distinction between the Jewish faith and Israel, it was obvious last night that the rabbi makes no such distinction.  Rather than trying to calm anxiety, he ramps it up, describing the protestors as thousands of Hamas supporters.  Again the conflict is described in terms of good vs evil.  No concern shown for the Gaza civilians (although I accept this maybe due to editing).

The vast majority of protestors just want an end to the violence/deaths.  Why not focus on that?

[Alph]

Netenyahu says revenge starts tonight. 

Terrorist scum. War criminal and zionist invader. 

With support from Genocide Joe and of course Britain like a good little doggy follow obediently with whatever America orders. 

The "Hamas Israel War" where thousands of innocent Palestinians are killed by association for not leaving a prison. 

Revenge for 40 beheaded babies (no proof), mass rape (no proof), burning people alive (no proof). The 5,000 dead was not enough for Israel. That was just warming up. 

"But the Holocaust!!" is the defence as they carry Apartheid. 

"But anti-Semitism" is the cry when they go on a genocidal rampage. 

From Atomic bombs to Gulf Of Tonkin incident to Agent Green and Napalm strikes to false WMD claims to proxy wars supporting terrorists to providing arms to IS to funding a $3.8b war via a colony on the Middle East. 

Next time you hear some war monger stood Infront of stars and Stripes in a country with such inequality, such high murder rates, where you can't be sure your children won't be gunned down by an assault rifle.... next time you do hear "democracy and freedom. God Bless America" try to hold in the vomit.

Manifest Destiny isn't over. Empire building isn't dead

[CWC1983]

2 minutes ago, Alpha said:

Netenyahu says revenge starts tonight. 

Terrorist scum. War criminal and zionist invader. 

With support from Genocide Joe and of course Britain like a good little doggy follow obediently with whatever America orders. 

The "Hamas Israel War" where thousands of innocent Palestinians are killed by association for not leaving a prison. 

Revenge for 40 beheaded babies (no proof), mass rape (no proof), burning people alive (no proof). The 5,000 dead was not enough for Israel. That was just warming up. 

"But the Holocaust!!" is the defence as they carry Apartheid. 

"But anti-Semitism" is the cry when they go on a genocidal rampage. 

From Atomic bombs to Gulf Of Tonkin incident to Agent Green and Napalm strikes to false WMD claims to proxy wars supporting terrorists to providing arms to IS to funding a $3.8b war via a colony on the Middle East. 

Next time you hear some war monger stood Infront of stars and Stripes in a country with such inequality, such high murder rates, where you can't be sure your children won't be gunned down by an assault rifle.... next time you do hear "democracy and freedom. God Bless America" try to hold in the vomit.

Manifest Destiny isn't over. Empire building isn't dead

It's all very sad.

Innocent people die and Governments don't care. 

Dread to think what Gaza looks like tomorrow  

 

 

 

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

10 hours ago, Alpha said:

It's interesting hearing Israeli press conferences where they seem to be telling the lie that dead Palestinians are collateral damage for a greater cause. I'd like to see what the region looks like with Hamas gone. Is it Netenyahu and Abbas running through wheat fields together surrounded by Jewish and Muslim children? Seriously, Hamas gone. Then what? 

So to be clear, Hamas killing 1,400 Jews in an area under constant surveillance and heavy security near Gaza Strip, carried out this attack because they are evil?

Some might suggest that if we are talking about people like they're pawns on a chessboard that Hamas, who can't possibly defeat IDF in combat, resort to guerilla warfare and/or terrorism (from Roman civil war to Suffragettes, we've seen forcing change has happened this way) knew Israel would respond like this. So why did they do it? 

Some might suggest they did it knowing all this would play out. That with the power of social media and off the back of the Ukraine war people would be able to see beyond their limited news sources. That there would maybe be international pressure on Israel. 

I mean why else kill 1400 civilians? It doesn't put even a dent in Israel's power. So maybe the 1400 were "collateral damage" 

However Israel's collateral damage makes less sense?

Will this eradicate Hamas? Nope. 

Will this bring back hostages? If Hamas are just pure evil then those hostages will be dead either by knife or bomb. So no. 

One could argue even further that Hamas took hostages to release them during this period to perhaps improve public perception. Especially as some of the hostages are being treated fairly well. Even calling Hamas militants friendly and kind. 

Imagine if what Hamas did on October 7th actually had more of a noble cause than what Israel are doing now. "Collateral damage" they say? Ok let's go with that logic

What it will do is drive thousands of people who wouldn't have thought about it before, straight towards the very organisation that is supposedly being eradicated and they'll be even more hard line and pissed off.  A solution to being made to feel worthless and inadequate is to head straight to the strongest point of support on offer whatever that may be.  It's always been the same way.

[ramit]

Shameless rhetoric, how dare he mention ISIS?  UN calls for ceasefire despicable, he snarls.

 

Edited October 27, 2023 by ramit
Wording

[uttoxram75]

11 hours ago, Alpha said:

Netenyahu says revenge starts tonight. 

Terrorist scum. War criminal and zionist invader. 

With support from Genocide Joe and of course Britain like a good little doggy follow obediently with whatever America orders. 

The "Hamas Israel War" where thousands of innocent Palestinians are killed by association for not leaving a prison. 

Revenge for 40 beheaded babies (no proof), mass rape (no proof), burning people alive (no proof). The 5,000 dead was not enough for Israel. That was just warming up. 

"But the Holocaust!!" is the defence as they carry Apartheid. 

"But anti-Semitism" is the cry when they go on a genocidal rampage. 

From Atomic bombs to Gulf Of Tonkin incident to Agent Green and Napalm strikes to false WMD claims to proxy wars supporting terrorists to providing arms to IS to funding a $3.8b war via a colony on the Middle East. 

Next time you hear some war monger stood Infront of stars and Stripes in a country with such inequality, such high murder rates, where you can't be sure your children won't be gunned down by an assault rifle.... next time you do hear "democracy and freedom. God Bless America" try to hold in the vomit.

Manifest Destiny isn't over. Empire building isn't dead

Oil and gas Alpha, you forgot oil and gas. That's the only thing driving this slaughter now. That's what the Empire was all about, natural resources, robbing and pillaging other countries, we're still doing it but try and pretend its for other reasons.

[Alph]

54 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

Oil and gas Alpha, you forgot oil and gas. That's the only thing driving this slaughter now. That's what the Empire was all about, natural resources, robbing and pillaging other countries, we're still doing it but try and pretend its for other reasons.

America is amazing at branding and advertising. So good. 

They can sell ANYTHING. 

This is what Hitler needed. Just some better PR. Putin. Putin just needs the White House PR team. 

Imagine the crusades with better branding. 

Jimmy Saville! A victim of bad branding. He was sexually liberating children. 

Imagine relentlessly killing inmates in Gaza and being able to convince people this is a cause for good. This is fighting for peace!! 

[ramit]

Seeing truly horrific images from Gaza, way too graphic to post here, entire neighborhoods demolished, residents frantically digging through the rubble in search of survivors, children if they survived intensely traumatized.  War they call this?  Meanwhile my government abstained from voting for a ceasefire at UN because Hamas wasn't properly vilified.  I deplore western politics, we are the evil empire.

[Alph]

21 minutes ago, ramit said:

Seeing truly horrific images from Gaza, way too graphic to post here, entire neighborhoods demolished, residents frantically digging through the rubble in search of survivors, children if they survived intensely traumatized.  War they call this?  Meanwhile my government abstained from voting for a ceasefire at UN because Hamas wasn't properly vilified.  I deplore western politics, we are the evil empire.

Wait for the Hollywood movie in 2035. 

It will be the brave story of Israeli special forces operating in Gaza. You'll get the personal story of each member and how traumatised they are after having to kill a 12 year old boy strapped with a suicide vest. After scores of faceless Arabs are killed while defiantly screaming "death to the west", we will see a brave member of the task force killed while trying to save a baby from a crazed Hamas militant. Obviously the end scenes are the brave Israeli soldiers returning a wedding ring to the dead soldiers wife as she cradles their infant son. 

Damn cave dwellers. Savages they are. Barely human at all. They're like those native American tribes that would randomly attack railway workers on the old frontier. They need American democracy 

 

Edited October 28, 2023 by Alpha

[Alph]

🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣

That's a gem.