At least we still have a club.......yeah but...

[RoyMac5]

12 minutes ago, 8Leeds said:

...I understand why Clowes made the decision he did but I would have liked to have seen what would have happened if Liam had had the full season. Always seemed a bit odd that he was in charge of recruiting a new team, to play in a certain way, only to be replaced shortly after by a manager with an entirely different way of playing which our squad wasn’t set up for. 

I have to say with (the benefit of hindsight admittedly), surely Clowes would know what Warne was aiming for in his team/squad? But interestingly in the press release talking about choosing Warne over Rosenior it only mentions experience and liking how Warne was with the players and journalists.

There was also the bit "With regards to the players we signed and his style, Paul is adaptable, but he was after some of our players in the summer. His teams are running teams and he is happy with the players he has."

I wonder if Clowes still has the same opinion?

[8Leeds]

1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said:

I have to say with (the benefit of hindsight admittedly), surely Clowes would know what Warne was aiming for in his team/squad? But interestingly in the press release talking about choosing Warne over Rosenior it only mentions experience and liking how Warne was with the players and journalists.

There was also the bit "With regards to the players we signed and his style, Paul is adaptable, but he was after some of our players in the summer. His teams are running teams and he is happy with the players he has."

I wonder if Clowes still has the same opinion?

That’s the part that has always confused me, Paul had a set style, he never budged from it unless really forced to like he had to last year with the injuries and realising he also didn’t have what he needed to do things his way, so far, adaptable isn’t a word I’d use to describe him. 

You’d of thought the due diligence would have been done on Paul’s style before hand and assessed against our squad. 

This isn’t a knock on David Clowes, I believe every decision he’ll ever make as our chairman will always be with the club and fans best interest at heart but Liam’s proving himself to at least be a championship quality manager, Paul hasn’t done that yet and I can’t help feel like we let one get away there. 

Edited September 3, 2023 by 8Leeds

[RAM1966]

4 minutes ago, 8Leeds said:

That’s the part that has always confused me, Paul had a set style, he never budged from it unless really forced to like he had to last year with the injuries and realising he also didn’t have what he needed to do things his way, so far, adaptable isn’t a word I’d use to describe him. 

You’d of thought the due diligence would have been done on Paul’s style before hand and assessed against our squad. 

This isn’t a knock on David Clowes, I believe every decision he’ll ever make as our chairman will always be with the club and fans best interest at heart but Liam’s proving himself to at least be a championship quality manager, Paul hasn’t done that yet and I can’t help feel like we let one get away there. 

TBF to both DC & PW, Hull were established and we had been completely decimated.  I think a rebuild can not be expected in one season.  We also have to keep a tight reign on the finances for 2 reasons, firstly we are under a BP.  Secondly, I feel that DC will be keen to at least break even as he's invested double what he wanted too.

I think we may have to temper our expectations....

[RoyMac5]

12 minutes ago, RAM1966 said:

TBF to both DC & PW, Hull were established and we had been completely decimated.  I think a rebuild can not be expected in one season.  We also have to keep a tight reign on the finances for 2 reasons, firstly we are under a BP.  Secondly, I feel that DC will be keen to at least break even as he's invested double what he wanted too.

I think we may have to temper our expectations....

Well you tell that to David Clowes who said that Paul Warne has a budget good enough for promotion from this league.

[RAM1966]

31 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Well you tell that to David Clowes who said that Paul Warne has a budget good enough for promotion from this league.

Hes hardly going to say to the fans we haven't got a pot to piss in is he?  How many players have we paid a fee for? 🤔 

[RoyMac5]

3 minutes ago, RAM1966 said:

Hes hardly going to say to the fans we haven't got a pot to piss in is he?  How many players have we paid a fee for? 🤔 

Would you have paid a fee for Bradley, Elder et al?! 

Or then maybe the free that were around would have been good enough to pay big wages too?

Who has paid 'big money' in this league then mate?

[RAM1966]

9 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Would you have paid a fee for Bradley, Elder et al?! 

Or then maybe the free that were around would have been good enough to pay big wages too?

Who has paid 'big money' in this league then mate?

TBH Ive not paid too much attention to fees paid by other clubs, the fact we've not paid a fee at all suggests we are still on a tight rope.  I applaud DC for his approach, we need to build firm foundations and build from there. 

I'd rather spend another season or 3 in this league, building a squad through a mixture of home grown talent and shrewd feebies than go down the Charlatan route.  This could mean 3 or even 4 seasons, rather than go up and get 11 points like we did in the EPL.

 

 

Edited September 3, 2023 by RAM1966

[RoyMac5]

2 minutes ago, RAM1966 said:

TBH Ive not paid too much attention to fees paid by other clubs, the fact we've not paid a fee at all suggests we are still on a tight rope.  I applaud DC for his approach, we need to build firm foundations and build from there. 

No it doesn't. If most clubs in this league haven't paid a fee it shows you can get players in at this level without a large initial outlay. But as I said who paid how much?

[Andicis]

11 hours ago, IslandExile said:

It's ok to demand more from the manager, the teams on the pitch (not just the first team but especially them).

We should demand exciting, entertaining football that gets results. It does not mean that we won't forever be grateful to David Clowes for saving the club.

What divine right do we have to ''demand'' anything? We demanded things all the time from Mel, and he was as stupid as the fans were, and that was the entire reason we got in the mess. I agree that we shouldn't use ''we still have a club'' as an excuse for everything, but the **EXACT** reason we got where we are is knee jerking firing of managers and changing styles every time. 

[RoyMac5]

7 minutes ago, Andicis said:

What divine right do we have to ''demand'' anything? We demanded things all the time from Mel, and he was as stupid as the fans were, and that was the entire reason we got in the mess. I agree that we shouldn't use ''we still have a club'' as an excuse for everything, but the **EXACT** reason we got where we are is knee jerking firing of managers and changing styles every time. 

Tell Clowes that.

Why shouldn't the fans demand? What 'point' is there to the football club without fans at the ground and/or on TV?

Edited September 3, 2023 by RoyMac5

[Andicis]

Just now, RoyMac5 said:

Tell Clowes that.

Why shouldn't the fans demand? What 'point' is there to the football club without fans at the ground and/or on TV?

Because it's not as simple as saying ''I demand we get promoted playing champagne football on a fruit shoot budget''. 

Tell Clowes what? He hasn't fired anyone. 

[RoyMac5]

3 minutes ago, Andicis said:

Because it's not as simple as saying ''I demand we get promoted playing champagne football on a fruit shoot budget''. 

Tell Clowes what? He hasn't fired anyone. 

"Changing styles" Roooney/Rosenior to Mr 'Adaptable' Warne.

[Andicis]

Just now, RoyMac5 said:

"Changing styles" Roooney/Rosenior to Mr 'Adaptable' Warne.

Rooney had nothing to do with Clowes. Rosenior was an interim to help provide some stability in a time of change, Clowes clearly didn't fancy him and brought in his own man. He hasn't changed style. 

[RoyMac5]

Just now, Andicis said:

Rooney had nothing to do with Clowes. Rosenior was an interim to help provide some stability in a time of change, Clowes clearly didn't fancy him and brought in his own man. He hasn't changed style. 

Many players were no doubt sought out under the Rooney/Rosenior time. Warne most certainly has changed style, oh dear you can't see that?

[Andicis]

Just now, RoyMac5 said:

Many players were no doubt sought out under the Rooney/Rosenior time. Warne most certainly has changed style, oh dear you can't see that?

I don't think there was a huge amount of stylistic decision making in that period no, I think we were trying to bring in whatever players we could, frankly. Especially given that I don't think Rooney or Rosenior had the same approach, most of the players would have been recruited with Rooney's style in mind as a lot of the preparation would already have been done. Warne was a clean slate for Clowes. Not sure what you are trying to blame him for here? 

[RoyMac5]

1 minute ago, Andicis said:

Warne was a clean slate for Clowes. Not sure what you are trying to blame him for here? 

Warne was 'adaptable' with the squad and that was said at the time he was employed. How is that a clean slate.

Edited September 3, 2023 by RoyMac5

[Andicis]

Just now, RoyMac5 said:

Warne was 'adaptable' with the squad and that was said at the time he was employed. How is that a clean slate.

Can you even keep up with your own points? The point being made was that Clowes hasn't flipped from one style to the next with managers. End point. 

[RoyMac5]

Just now, Andicis said:

Can you even keep up with your own points? The point being made was that Clowes hasn't flipped from one style to the next with managers. End point. 

End point, lol.

Can you not bother to see what was said when Warne was employed - he was adaptable to the squad that was there. Why would he need to adapt if the styles where the same?! 😄

"With regards to the players we signed and his style, Paul is adaptable..."

 

[Andicis]

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

End point, lol.

Can you not bother to see what was said when Warne was employed - he was adaptable to the squad that was there. Why would he need to adapt if the styles where the same?! 😄

"With regards to the players we signed and his style, Paul is adaptable..."

 

Okay, going to end the discussion here as you are going off in another circular and tedious monologue about Warne. 

Nothing you actually are adding there is relevant to any of the points I'm discussing. 

[TomTom92]

Rosenior leaving also ended another link to the Mel era. Rightly or wrongly Rosenior’s flaws such as the away games etc. could be held against his time here as 1st team coach under Cocu and Rooney, neither of which were a success. Maybe not fair to link others shortcomings against his, but PW coming in was a clean slate.
 
Warne was a great appointment at the time. Now it’s looking like a mistake, but every appointment is a risk. If PW was to go then I wouldn’t like to say who a good appointment would be.