F1 2022

[RadioactiveWaste]

https://racingnews365.com/red-bulls-f1-cost-cap-breach-was-in-four-main-areas

Interesting article on the red bull costcappen situation.

It's not possible to really say if this is reliable, reads like someone is putting the RBR side out in this article.

Key things being:

A change in the exemptions on carry over parts. (No one else had a problem?)

An expected HMRC rebate (should be able to prove if that was the case, however if HMRC say no, I think they're screwed)

Gardening leave costs (Think they were trying to be "clever" by moving the employee to a different part of the business)

Catering (apparently true, although can't accept this isn't something all the teams account for without controversy)

Total overspending of about $1.8m.

Having watched our beloved DCFC be tried in the court of public opinion for two years, I'm not surprised Red Bull have their side of the story as well.

We'll have to see if Red Bull accept the Accepted Breach Agreement or insist on a hearing to determine the penalty. Certainly this article reads like they might go the second route because they think they've got a case and don't want to accept they breached the cost cap.

Personally, I think that Steve Gibson needs to be brought in to determine how much Middlesbrough FC need to sue red bull racing for.

[RadioactiveWaste]

So, Carlos Sainz on pole for the USA edition of Ferrari pole/Verstappen win. Grid pens for Perez and Leclerc put them down the order so seeing which makes better progress is probably going to more fun the watching Carlos and Ferrari contriving to hand Max a victory.

The main interest is really back down the grid with Aston Martin looking to pull clear of Haas, and Sauber looking to score points to keep them ahead of Alpha Tauri.

Albon qualified well again.

In other news, dieter mateschitz of red bull fame passed away. RIP, certainly left a cultural legacy after basically inventing energy drinks and funding many extreme sports, motorsports and so on.

The FIA vs Red Bull's accounts rumbles on with no word yet on punishment.

logan sargeant will drive for Williams as long as he gets his superlicense.

 

[RadioactiveWaste]

Oh Georgie boy, you ruined it at turn 1.

Still, feelgood for Yuki, K-mags, Seb and pretty magic Alonso.

Good job by Lewis, Charles and Max, and tbf, Lando had a damaged car and did well.

very bad by baby stroll, i'm not sure daddy stroll will tolerate that from his team's second driver much longer.

Best "drive to Survive" storyline: Gunther Steiner is protesting the race result because Perez and Alonso didn't get back and orange flag the way his cars keep getting.

[Alph]

Red Bull may have gone over budget but when you consider they must have bought the entire Ferrari team it's actually good business. 

Ricciardo may as well sit out now. I'm convinced he's doing a Vettel and only interested when an opportunity presents itself. He's consistently bad now

[RadioactiveWaste]

3 hours ago, Alpha said:

Red Bull may have gone over budget but when you consider they must have bought the entire Ferrari team it's actually good business. 

Ricciardo may as well sit out now. I'm convinced he's doing a Vettel and only interested when an opportunity presents itself. He's consistently bad now

Yeah, Ricciardo is washed at this point.

[TigerTedd]

Funny to think the cap is £140m, and comparing that to a premier league club. £140m to develop 2 cars and pay a massive team of staff. Compared to £150m spent by forest, just on fees, not even counting wages, let alone catering. 

I always just assumed F1 was the richest, most glam sport in the world. It’s always had that impression. 

[RadioactiveWaste]

4 hours ago, TigerTedd said:

Funny to think the cap is £140m, and comparing that to a premier league club. £140m to develop 2 cars and pay a massive team of staff. Compared to £150m spent by forest, just on fees, not even counting wages, let alone catering. 

I always just assumed F1 was the richest, most glam sport in the world. It’s always had that impression. 

Football overtook F1 in terms of monies a long time ago now, and even longer with the likes of the NFL etc.

I think that perception is probably more of a hang over from motorsports past when it was (well, if we're honest, still is) the preserve of people rich enough to do it, who were also the people who were rich enough to have a yacht and a pad in monte carlo etc, although it is still an insanely rich and costly sport although it's not quite what it was in the big tobacco days.

The cost cap was a case of ferrari, mercedes and red bull coming down towards, but everyone else was probably not turning over that much for it to be an issue.

I think for me, it puts in a bit of perspective that all staff, R and D, logistics, catering, hospitality are part of that  cost cap.

[Day]

 

[Duracell]

Booooo. They belong at Le Mans, not fannying about in the midfield.

Manufacturers in F1 are annoying. Let the privateers have it out again against Ferrari.

[RadioactiveWaste]

On 26/10/2022 at 14:17, Duracell said:

Booooo. They belong at Le Mans, not fannying about in the midfield.

Manufacturers in F1 are annoying. Let the privateers have it out again against Ferrari.

They need the money to do it through.

Hate em or not, you've got to admire the balls on Karen and Marko to say to Porsche "no, you give us money and we run the racing team how we want or it's no deal"

I'm not massively "excited " for the "Audi brand" to be in F1. Audi in sports cars and endurance racing have a pedigree that's unmatched. But in terms of the Sauber buy out, they've been BMW before and once Audi lose interest they'll go back to being Sauber.

Hopefully, they just build a decent engine program and give Sauber the budget to be a successful racing team - Sauber are a thoroughbred racing team but working with tight budgets has hampered them no end. If they get all VW Group Corporate about the whole thing it'll end up being like the Toyota F1 team was.

In terms of the Mexico grand Prix, well, on the one hand I'd like Checo to win it because it's be nice,but on the other hand, Max giving him a pity win would suck.

But really, the only interest left in the season is Alpine Vs McLaren (or "Lando Norris" as they're known now), Sauber Vs Daddy Stroll and Haas Vs Alpha Tauri for constructors position (and the cash that comes with it).

 

[RadioactiveWaste]

Justice for Fernando! He's been given his P7 back.

Sensible decision to reverse it. The error was race control,and whilst I understand Haas's grievance given the black and orange flag was on speed dial whenever their drivers hot something,it wasn't right to punish Alpine/Alonso for not following an instruction they weren't given.

 

[Day]

 

[Alph]

Good good. Think he can win another Championship?? 

Even if he had a car that's 2nd best to what Max has? Could he do it? Or is Max just the top guy in the top car at this moment in time? 

Not seen Max under pressure for about a year

[Andicis]

2 hours ago, Alpha said:

Good good. Think he can win another Championship?? 

Even if he had a car that's 2nd best to what Max has? Could he do it? Or is Max just the top guy in the top car at this moment in time? 

Not seen Max under pressure for about a year

Max hasn't really got a competitor this year. On courses with long straights, RB is much quicker than Mercedes. His car is completely set up for him, so Perez doesn't have much of a chance either. Ferrari, does anyone really think Leclerc or Sainz are championship material? Neither of them seem to have the air of a champion about them. Too many mistakes. 

Put Lewis is a car that isn't 0.5 seconds off the Red Bull, and I'm positive he can push him and beat him. Look at how much calmer Verstappen has been driving this year without Lewis pushing him the whole way. 

[Andicis]

Not much more than a slap of the wrist, but at the very least they have reduced win tunnel time, which is more of a punishment than I thought they would get.

[Day]

3 hours ago, Alpha said:

Good good. Think he can win another Championship?? 

Even if he had a car that's 2nd best to what Max has? Could he do it? Or is Max just the top guy in the top car at this moment in time? 

Not seen Max under pressure for about a year

Lewis has Max’s pants down in a competitive car, easy.

[RadioactiveWaste]

3 hours ago, Andicis said:

Not much more than a slap of the wrist, but at the very least they have reduced win tunnel time, which is more of a punishment than I thought they would get.

The "Accepted Breach Agreement" - Red Bull agreed they did something wrong in exchange for not actually being punished for it (very much).

Could Lewis win another? If he's given a competetive car of course he can. Once he stoped going down rabbit holes trying to unlock performance in the current car he's been consistently better than Georgie boy. Don't underestimate just how good Max is, he's seemed to mature his driving a bit now that he's won one, although, granted, Ferrari have spent the season bungling a decent car. I'm starting to fear Leclerc might just be a bit of a "what if" - he clearly has the talent to be a champion but doesn't seem to have the aura of one, it may come, but he may be the next Danny Ricciardo (pre-Mclaren).

[Andicis]

14 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

The "Accepted Breach Agreement" - Red Bull agreed they did something wrong in exchange for not actually being punished for it (very much).

Could Lewis win another? If he's given a competetive car of course he can. Once he stoped going down rabbit holes trying to unlock performance in the current car he's been consistently better than Georgie boy. Don't underestimate just how good Max is, he's seemed to mature his driving a bit now that he's won one, although, granted, Ferrari have spent the season bungling a decent car. I'm starting to fear Leclerc might just be a bit of a "what if" - he clearly has the talent to be a champion but doesn't seem to have the aura of one, it may come, but he may be the next Danny Ricciardo (pre-Mclaren).

Max is driving more maturely and sensibly sure, but isn't that probably because he isn't under any pressure. Put Lewis in a good car and he goes back to the headcase from last year I think. 

[Day]

We need to see Max under pressure again, see if he has changed with 2 championships under his belt.

I don’t see the hunger in him to break records, or even go on to match what Hamilton has achieved. Now he’s not chasing his first title, will he be less reckless on track? Hope so. 

[RadioactiveWaste]

I think Verstappen will be much more mature the next time he's in a serious title fight, it'll not have the edge of "I've got to dethrone the driver who has dominated for years" that 21 had. That's not to say he won't get rattled under pressue, even Lewis gets rattled into mistakes under pressure (christ, that's how Rosberg won his title) but I doubt he'll be as OTT as he was in 21.

I had plenty of issues with Max's driving last season (and no, "but Silverstone" isn't a catch all that made anything Max did ok), he's been much better this and I do think he'll be more mature, pick his battles better etc.