The Politics Thread 2019

[eddie]

5 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

At the expense of sounding stupid here, I don't see any insurmountable issues above.

Aren't trade deals reciprocal? You make it sound like we are over a barrel with anyone that we enter into negotiations with.

We don't have any trade deals at the moment. If we exit on 'WTO terms', then enjoy paying 30% more for many of your imported foodstuffs. So far as the stuff we sell is concerned, that would also make our similar exports 30% more expensive, so people will look elsewhere.

It's the reason why Trump's insane trade war with China has wiped out the American soya bean growers.

[G STAR RAM]

3 minutes ago, eddie said:

We don't have any trade deals at the moment. If we exit on 'WTO terms', then enjoy paying 30% more for many of your imported foodstuffs. So far as the stuff we sell is concerned, that would also make our similar exports 30% more expensive, so people will look elsewhere.

It's the reason why Trump's insane trade war with China has wiped out the American soya bean growers.

I'd buy British. May even be good for our economy.

Obviously tongue in cheek.

I'm pretty certain though that 30% on the price of BMWs, Mercedes, wine and the likes would soon drive down sales and give the EU something to think about.

[Curtains]

2 hours ago, eddie said:

 

Joking apart, I went into a Wetherspoons in Watford on Monday night after the playoff defeat. I had a baked potato with 5 bean chilli (gammon wasn't on the menu ? ), and it was pretty good. The beer was excellent too. Can't remember what stout it was - a local brew I think.

Always think Wetherspoons is a good option for food to be honest. 

Meal and a drink is good value.  

I like the Standing Order in Derby and the Yarborough in Grimsby and there is a good new one in Blackpool lol. 

[Van der MoodHoover]

34 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

I'd buy British. May even be good for our economy.

Obviously tongue in cheek.

I'm pretty certain though that 30% on the price of BMWs, Mercedes, wine and the likes would soon drive down sales and give the EU something to think about.

Dunno how old you are mate, but the single market only really existed when Thatcher and Delors signed it all up so in the late 1980s - if you remember the early '80s when BMWs etc were really "expensive" and you didn't see many of them around thats what I reckon it might be like.

Wasn't Fox supposed to be cutting the deals and hes done a really poor job so far, only signing up a handful of tiddly ones?

Basically unless someone wants to buy spivvy financial services, high-end aero engines or weaponry what would they buy from us?

[eddie]

58 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

I'd buy British. May even be good for our economy.

Obviously tongue in cheek.

I'm pretty certain though that 30% on the price of BMWs, Mercedes, wine and the likes would soon drive down sales and give the EU something to think about.

Well, the components which go into British-built cars also come from overseas, and they will carry the same (or in some cases, higher) tariffs - so the price of domestic cars is going to see widespread price increases of a similar level.

This whole idea that "It will hurt them as much as it hurts us" is a complete misnomer. The EU is 10 times bigger, already has trade agreements which we will never be able to better and is in a far better position to withstand what, for them, will be a minor hit.

'Buying British' is great - assuming we make the stuff you want to buy. Pineapples, bananas and even tomatoes when there is an 'R' in the month, not so much. On the bright side, we can always learn to love turnips. After all, enough people voted for them.

 

[eddie]

1 hour ago, Curtains said:

Always think Wetherspoons is a good option for food to be honest. 

Meal and a drink is good value.  

I like the Standing Order in Derby and the Yarborough in Grimsby and there is a good new one in Blackpool lol. 

The Velvet Coaster.

I used to drink and eat in there, and they used to sell about 7 or 8 Belgian beers. The last time I went in, about a year ago, I asked what Belgian beers they had. The reply was "Just Stella Artois". I took my custom elsewhere.

[eddie]

At the moment, only one country in the world operates solely under 'WTO rules' - Mauritania (or it did in October 2017, the last figures I could find).

Its GDP is approximately 0.2% of Britain's, its principal export (amounting to around 50%) is iron ore, and approximately 10% of its population are actually slaves.

We're going to be in good company, it seems. The slavery is quite possibly the thing that has encouraged the likes of Rees-Mogg and Boris to advocate that particular model.

[McRamFan]

6 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Don't worry, I know you'll just ignore the point and just say that it was TR that incited it. 

You are the one who ignores questions,, and fail to back up the facts you claim.

The only video from Oldham are ones posted by his supporters, probably some have been removed. 

However the picture here kinda makes me think that there where twits on both sides, looking for trouble.  That kinda thing happens when you have extremists ralllying in the street.

The reason why the Muslem Defence League exists is because of years and years of Islamophobia, spouted by TR.

But hey, don't worry, it must be photoshopped.

[G STAR RAM]

29 minutes ago, McRamFan said:

You are the one who ignores questions,, and fail to back up the facts you claim.

The only video from Oldham are ones posted by his supporters, probably some have been removed. 

However the picture here kinda makes me think that there where twits on both sides, looking for trouble.  That kinda thing happens when you have extremists ralllying in the street.

The reason why the Muslem Defence League exists is because of years and years of Islamophobia, spouted by TR.

But hey, don't worry, it must be photoshopped.

I will always try and answer a question honestly, even if I know it will make me look a prat or a racist or whatever labels get thrown at me. That's mainly because I understand that people come across different on a forum than in real life. I like to think if people met me in real life they'd realise I'm a hard working, decent guy who just wants what he believes is best for his family. (Of course that is open to opinion!)

Regarding the videos, do a bit more research and you may find a few videos taken from within The Muslim Defence League.

I'm happy for you to post a video of the twits at the rally who were looking for trouble as I've genuinely not seen any yet. Upon the production of this evidence I will rightly condemn them rather than saying it's ok because the Muslims were looking for trouble too. I was brought up to believe that 2 wrongs don't make a right. 

I understand why the Muslim Defence League exists and I am glad it does. They must now be given a platform to educate people why what TR is saying is incorrect. There's a lot of material out there for them to dissect and correct where it is wrong.

Out of interest why do you think Islamophobia exists? Do you think anything is happening to contribute to the rise? Or do you think it is all because of you know who?

[Norman]

55 minutes ago, eddie said:

At the moment, only one country in the world operates solely under 'WTO rules' - Mauritania (or it did in October 2017, the last figures I could find).

Its GDP is approximately 0.2% of Britain's, its principal export (amounting to around 50%) is iron ore, and approximately 10% of its population are actually slaves.

We're going to be in good company, it seems. The slavery is quite possibly the thing that has encouraged the likes of Rees-Mogg and Boris to advocate that particular model.

Deals with USA, Australia, Switzerland, New Zealand, the Carribean, some of Africa are done. Japan is close.

All free trade deals. No tarrifs.

We are down the EU and China. And the EU wont start trade talks with us.

[eddie]

It's interesting, at least to me, that the Labour Party 'institutionalised anti-semitism' and the Conservative Party 'institutionalised islamophobia' are treated differently in the newspapers today, and yet to me they are two sides of exactly the same racist coin.

 

[eddie]

20 minutes ago, Norman said:

Deals with USA, Australia, Switzerland, New Zealand, the Carribean, some of Africa are done. Japan is close.

All free trade deals. No tarrifs.

We are down the EU and China. And the EU wont start trade talks with us.

How can you honestly suggest that we have free trade deals with the USA, Australia and New Zealand? What we have signed with those three countries are "Mutual Recognition Arrangements"  - they are about recognising product standards (such things as the labelling of wine), and not about free trade at all.

Edit: And all three are just extending the pre-existing MRAs the three countries have with the EU.

[GboroRam]

12 minutes ago, Norman said:

Deals with USA, Australia, Switzerland, New Zealand, the Carribean, some of Africa are done. Japan is close.

All free trade deals. No tarrifs.

We are down the EU and China. And the EU wont start trade talks with us.

Not heard any deal agreed with the US. I've heard they would be open to the idea, but they put a lot of things they want on the table, including accepting US food standards (so much for sovereignty - presumably they will want some arbitration where standards get adjudicated upon), and opening up the health service to US medical companies (privatised NHS anyone?). There's more, but I don't remember. 

[Norman]

11 minutes ago, eddie said:

How can you honestly suggest that we have free trade deals with the USA, Australia and New Zealand? What we have signed with those three countries are "Mutual Recognition Arrangements"  - they are about recognising product standards (such things as the labelling of wine), and not about free trade at all.

Edit: And all three are just extending the pre-existing MRAs the three countries have with the EU.

'On top of this, the UK and Australia have both committed to seeking a new ambitious, comprehensive free trade agreement that will allow UK and Australian companies to enjoy an even closer trading relationship after the UK leaves the European Union'.

From the government website on the MRA.

Same with New Zealand. 

Amazing that people think we have only done a deal with the Faroes.

[GboroRam]

2 minutes ago, Norman said:

'On top of this, the UK and Australia have both committed to seeking a new ambitious, comprehensive free trade agreement that will allow UK and Australian companies to enjoy an even closer trading relationship after the UK leaves the European Union'.

From the government website on the MRA.

Same with New Zealand. 

Amazing that people think we have only done a deal with the Faroes.

You think that means anything has been agreed? 

[G STAR RAM]

I thought we could not sign trade deals whilst we were still a member of the EU? 

[Highgate]

5 hours ago, Norman said:

But it was a multi-party, multi-platform vote. 

It is a big step, but to say the Leave side has no idea what they have or would vote for obviously isn't true. That is all I am saying.

But who is saying the Leave side had no idea?  Some surely had a very clear idea of what they wanted and some had a less concrete idea.  A spectrum of views and motivations like you'd get with any group of millions of voters.  However I think it's fair to say, that opinion in the Leave camp has solidified around a No Deal Brexit in response to the Tory shambles and betrayal (as they perceive it) on display since the referendum took place.

It's no criticism of the Leave voter to say that the design of the referendum was flawed from Day 1. Asking people to Leave or Remain before the manner of the Leaving was understood was always likely to cause huge problems in the event of a Leave victory. 

[Van der MoodHoover]

1 hour ago, Norman said:

'On top of this, the UK and Australia have both committed to seeking a new ambitious, comprehensive free trade agreement that will allow UK and Australian companies to enjoy an even closer trading relationship after the UK leaves the European Union'.

From the government website on the MRA.

Same with New Zealand. 

Amazing that people think we have only done a deal with the Faroes.

Now I read somewhere that when we joined the eec in 1973, New Zealand instantly lost 80% of its export market virtually overnight. 

If I was them I'd see this as payback time......

[G STAR RAM]

Boris Johnson in court for telling a lie...must be a lot of very worried politicians out there right now.

Anyone know what the sentence is for telling the same lie over 100 times?

[Van der MoodHoover]

12 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Boris Johnson in court for telling a lie...must be a lot of very worried politicians out there right now.

Anyone know what the sentence is for telling the same lie over 100 times?

Usually a peerage I think ?