Bris Vegas Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Nice avatar bris. Suits you. I don't even know who the geezer is.. Or which wisecrack made him my avatar.. Or why.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorneoRam Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Victor Meldrew - google away and all shall become clear..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Game 7 of the season... Blackpool 1-3 Huddersfield.. They just collected 14 points from 7 and were in second place.. Since then.. They've gone on to collect 22 points from the next 23 with a record of... Played 23 W5 D7 L11 GD -24 And you're saying that isn't rubbish Albert? I'll even do a wager with you.. I garauntee that if you take away the first 7 games of the season Huddersfields record over the rest of the 39 games sees them in the bottom 5.. What do you think? No money involved or anything daft, just admit you're wrong and I'm right or vice versa It's very poor yes, but it doesn't mean that they are a terrible team overall. There is nothing to say that they won't recover and finish comfortably mid table. I'm not moving any goalposts... I said Huddersfield are rubbish and you're trying to deny it using little bad runs of previous clubs that have made the top 6.. I've clearly pointed out that you're thinking is flawed because Huddersfield aren't just in a bad run of form.. A bad run of form would be over 6, 8, 10 even 12 games.. Huddersfield have been rubbish for over half the NPC season, having collected only 22 points since September in 23 games.. Why are you trying to deny they've been rubbish? They got off to a flyer and since then have played like a bottom 4 club over the past 5 months of the season, 23 games.. That's a fact, why are you trying to deny a fact? Now, speaking of your moving the goal posts, you started by talking about them being a poor team because: "You don't go 12 games at this level without a win if you're not a poor side". Since this was in any way challenged you've trotted out 22 points from 23 games without any sense of context, and this is what you feed off of. Offering statistics is completely worthless without some sense of context, and you've offered none beyond saying that 22 points in 23 games is relegation form. This may be the case, but teams who have done worse have survived before. I offered the stats on those teams that finished top 6 or promoted to put into context that even teams who have very good seasons can have bad runs, that included bad runs of 12 to 16 games, but since you want to still keep this going I'll be more than happy to offer some more context for your comments: Hull City, 2011-12: 29 points in last 24 games, finished 8th, with a run of 19 points in 19 games in the middle of that run Brighton & Hove Albion, 2011-12: 18 points in 16 games in the second half of the season, finished top 10 Watford, 2011-12: 30 points in their first 27 games saw they sat outside the bottom 6 only on goal difference, having been on 16 points from 16 games earlier in the season and 10 from 13, they finished 11th Leeds, 2011-12: 27 points from 26 games saw they slip, but they still finished comfortably midtable Hull City, 2010-11: 15 points from 16 isn't exactly a pretty look, but a top half finish isn't bad Middlesbrough 2010-11: 21 points from 22 isn't nice, nor is 37 from 34, but hey, top half isn't too shabby Ipswich, 2010-11: 18 from 21 games... sounds nice eh? Just slipped out of the top half on the final day of the season Please keep in mind this is in no way exhaustive, this is just me going from the top of my head and checking the actual numbers. I'm sure if I went looking I could find a lot more and potentially better examples. Basically, teams can have rotten runs and do fine in the end, but I do await to see how this in fact completely proves your point... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Bris, you don't post facts, you take small irrelevant points, spin them with your opinions and repeat them ad nauseum as though repeating an irrelevant point will suddenly make it relevant. When challenge, or when points are put in context you just realign your "argument" such that you were "right all a long". It gets very tedious after a while. pot....kettle....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 double post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 It's very poor yes, but it doesn't mean that they are a terrible team overall. There is nothing to say that they won't recover and finish comfortably mid table. Now, speaking of your moving the goal posts, you started by talking about them being a poor team because: "You don't go 12 games at this level without a win if you're not a poor side". Since this was in any way challenged you've trotted out 22 points from 23 games without any sense of context, and this is what you feed off of. Offering statistics is completely worthless without some sense of context, and you've offered none beyond saying that 22 points in 23 games is relegation form. This may be the case, but teams who have done worse have survived before. I offered the stats on those teams that finished top 6 or promoted to put into context that even teams who have very good seasons can have bad runs, that included bad runs of 12 to 16 games, but since you want to still keep this going I'll be more than happy to offer some more context for your comments: Hull City, 2011-12: 29 points in last 24 games, finished 8th, with a run of 19 points in 19 games in the middle of that run Brighton & Hove Albion, 2011-12: 18 points in 16 games in the second half of the season, finished top 10 Watford, 2011-12: 30 points in their first 27 games saw they sat outside the bottom 6 only on goal difference, having been on 16 points from 16 games earlier in the season and 10 from 13, they finished 11th Leeds, 2011-12: 27 points from 26 games saw they slip, but they still finished comfortably midtable Hull City, 2010-11: 15 points from 16 isn't exactly a pretty look, but a top half finish isn't bad Middlesbrough 2010-11: 21 points from 22 isn't nice, nor is 37 from 34, but hey, top half isn't too shabby Ipswich, 2010-11: 18 from 21 games... sounds nice eh? Just slipped out of the top half on the final day of the season Please keep in mind this is in no way exhaustive, this is just me going from the top of my head and checking the actual numbers. I'm sure if I went looking I could find a lot more and potentially better examples. Basically, teams can have rotten runs and do fine in the end, but I do await to see how this in fact completely proves your point... Albert.. Did any of those sides go 12 games without a win? Did any of those sides after 23 games of the season after the initial '6 game start where anything can happen' take less points than games? And doing so with a GD of -24.. Did any of those sides look like they were sliding down the table rather than moving up it? Did any of those sides get hammered in consecutive away games 6-1, 4-0 and 3-0? I appreciate the effort you piut into your posts and I like the way you illustarte them too.. I have no problems with that.. But you're posts still aren't denying the fact that Huddersfield are a rubbish NPC side on the slide who for the majority of the season are playing like relegation fodder.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Also Albert, one last question.. Were Derby County for the last 6 months of the season of the 2010-11 season a good side or a rubbish side? Given that we had 30 points from 18 games with a GD of plus 11... We finished the season with 49 points... Taking 19 points from the remaining 28 games, with a GD of -24.. For 18 games we were good but for the remaining 28 games we were feckin dire and were relegation fodder... Similar to Huddersfield now. Do you think during that season when we played Norwich away with about 6 or 7 games remaining they said 'Well that Derby can hardly be rubbish given they're around 17th in the table' I also see abit of irony given Huddersfield sacked their manager whilst Derby despite going on an even worse run didn't.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Hate to say it but I'm with Bris on this one, Huddersfield are awful. Even when they beat us at there place during there good run we were all over them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Our season was over last week, who should replace Clough, will he walk. After beating Huddersfield we're looking at the top 6 again, is the season back on now? even me missus moods don't swing this quickly. Put a piece of paper over the left side of the posts so you can't see the username and you might find someone is actually making a bit of sense. Whilst I don't always agree with the grumpy South American (not mentioning any names) he has a point. Still think that person should look up the word banter before he steps back into the Forest thread tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Last season's achievement by Reading give the lie to the nonsensical 'Team X are rubbish because they only obtained Y points from Z games'. After 6 games they had - 4 points. They had a run of 13 successive games when they achieved a total of - 13 points. People were saying in September, after they went down to successive defeats by Portsmouth, Barnsley, Hull and Watford, that they were certainties for relegation. At the start of November they were still flirting with the relegation zone, barely struggling a point a game. They WON the Championship with a week to spare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rynny Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 I think what Albert is trying to say is that just because a team is on bad run don't assume they are a bad team. I think both are making valid points, and both have things correct, but both are wrong on some points, and neither of Bris or Albert will admit (to each other at least) that they are not perfect 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Also Albert, one last question.. Were Derby County for the last 6 months of the season of the 2010-11 season a good side or a rubbish side? Given that we had 30 points from 18 games with a GD of plus 11... We finished the season with 49 points... Taking 19 points from the remaining 28 games, with a GD of -24.. For 18 games we were good but for the remaining 28 games we were feckin dire and were relegation fodder... Similar to Huddersfield now. Do you think during that season when we played Norwich away with about 6 or 7 games remaining they said 'Well that Derby can hardly be rubbish given they're around 17th in the table' no but they might have said "they have hit a bit of form now there injuries have subsided" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorneoRam Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 They beat Palace last week and we have not exactly been in a rich vein of form ourselves although admittedly not. As bad as them. Fact is, and think Bris has made this point himself, there are no real standouts in this league, it is all a bit dog eat dog so even if another team are playing crap it is nice we were able to kill them off with minimum fuss because that is not always the case. It is one win, we really need to start stringing a few together or this forum will continue to be promotion or prozac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boycie Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 So are we good or not? 9th would surgest we are above average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asanovic Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Also Albert, one last question.. Were Derby County for the last 6 months of the season of the 2010-11 season a good side or a rubbish side? Given that we had 30 points from 18 games with a GD of plus 11... We finished the season with 49 points... Taking 19 points from the remaining 28 games, with a GD of -24.. For 18 games we were good but for the remaining 28 games we were feckin dire and were relegation fodder... Similar to Huddersfield now. Do you think during that season when we played Norwich away with about 6 or 7 games remaining they said 'Well that Derby can hardly be rubbish given they're around 17th in the table' I also see abit of irony given Huddersfield sacked their manager whilst Derby despite going on an even worse run didn't.. Bris - there's quite a grey area between 'good' and 'feckin dire, relegation fodder'. I can think of several games beyond the first 18 of that season where we played well. Yep, Huddersfield sacked their manager whilst we stuck by Clough. Maybe in a couple of seasons time they could be loitering outside the play offs in February if they'd stuck with him... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boycie Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 I hope we lose next game, I'm sick of all this ******. We won, forest lost, forest were made to look foolish all last week. Bris has got everyone arguing. Hmmmmmmm? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladyram Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 I'm not. I sit laughing. Peace man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 I hope we lose next game, I'm sick of all this ******. We won, forest lost, forest were made to look foolish all last week. Bris has got everyone arguing. Hmmmmmmm? Hmmmmmmmmm indeed............he really didn't like the Hudders lads praising Derby did he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOB BIGGS Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Hmmmmmmmmm indeed............he really didn't like the Hudders lads praising Derby did he? Wow, just back home in the North East after 3 days in Derby. I didn't expect to see this kind of thing. Here's my take on it Hendrick has changed in all ways since I last saw him play. My MoM. He could go a very long way. People near me moaning about Sammon. Clearly it's the "thing to do". I suspect they know very little about football. O'Brien's heading was remarkable. I see nothing to change my mind that we are a mid table team, about 3 quality players short of play offs. Most of the team did well on Saturday but I don't think anyone is getting carried away. I can well understand why other teams look at Clough and say that he's done pretty well. So there! Now then, everyone settle down and get ready for the moaning and groaning over the next 10 days I'll start.. .Clough Out 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froggg Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 [size=4]« Reply #18 Yesterday at 12:33pm » One thing Dean Hoyle might have come away from that shambles with is Derby showing that nurturing young talent can produce a team capable of holding their own in this league. Prem is a whole different ball game but that was a good young side put out by Clough yesterday, don't think any were over 25 and a lot were through the youth system at Derby. [/size] [size=3]Read more:[url=http://downatthemac.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=81131#ixzz2JwlSe4SX]http://downatthemac....1#ixzz2JwlSe4SX[/size] [size=3]Good points well made fella[/size] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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