StantonRam

Perhaps I should have prefaced each of my comments with IMO, which I did towards the end.  I stand by my OPINION that unless we are back in the top 10, and not too many points off the top 6, by 6pm on Saturday, having taken at the very minimum 3 points, or preferably 4 or 6 points, from the next 2 games, then Clowes will, with reluctance, in my OPINION, have to make a change.  Even 2 draws and remaining in 11th won't be enough.  In my opinion.
No one expects to win every game, but to be surprised week after week by teams that PW supposedly knows inside out as a "League 1 expert", is both disturbing and depressing.  I thought the idea of hiring a League 1 expert was that this person would usually have an answer to the players, formation and tactics of most opposing teams.  If that's the case, then where is that expertise and why do we see so few signs of it week in week out?
I for one would like to see what someone like Steve Mac would get out of this bunch.

This season so far is shaping up to be similar to last season.
On current form, we'll get very little from the top 6 teams but should be able to take 4 points from the 17 teams below 7th place.
17 teams x 4 points = 68.
In other words...erm...7th place again.

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

Am in agreement with most of the above, and am not suggesting that he be jettisoned, just that he seems slow to learn from his mistakes.  Most L1 managers simply don't get the kind of interest and coverage that he now does, and I stand by my central point that it really matters what you say about players on the national stage (and managing Derby does put you on the national stage whether you like it or not), rather than on the back page of the Rotherham Bugle & Dubious Advertiser (circulation 94).
"One of the lads" sums it up.  When you become a manager you have to learn to distance yourself a bit.  In my years in Senior Management I would never accept invitations to go down the pub, because that's exactly where they can let off steam by complaining about YOU.  PW would accept, buy drinks for everyone, talk too much, and leave his people griping even more because they still hadn't been able to let off steam and complain about him.
Promoted 3 times yes, but you could argue that the 2nd and 3rd promotions only became necessary because, erm, he couldn't keep them in the Championship.  Can he deliver the one (promotions) without the other (relegations back to L1)?  In that respect he is, one could argue, as yet untested.
I'm not qualified to critique his football knowledge, but I am qualified to critique his approach to people, especially his players.  TBH, despite all the bonhomie, I just don't buy it, and I think some players don't buy it either.  Furthermore, I think that to some prospective signings PW's verbal diarrhoea is actually a reason NOT to sign.  I suspect that most players would prefer an honest b******ing where needed rather than all this passive-aggressive "I'm just a normal bloke, me" rubbish.

Am in agreement with most of the above, and am not suggesting that he be jettisoned, just that he seems slow to learn from his mistakes.  Most L1 managers simply don't get the kind of interest and coverage that he now does, and I stand by my central point that it really matters what you say about players on the national stage (and managing Derby does put you on the national stage whether you like it or not), rather than on the back page of the Rotherham Bugle & Dubious Advertiser (circulation 94).
"One of the lads" sums it up.  When you become a manager you have to learn to distance yourself a bit.  In my years in Senior Management I would never accept invitations to go down the pub, because that's exactly where they can let off steam by complaining about YOU.  PW would accept, buy drinks for everyone, talk too much, and leave his people griping even more because they still hadn't been able to let off steam and complain about him.
Promoted 3 times yes, but you could argue that the 2nd and 3rd promotions only became necessary because, erm, he couldn't keep them in the Championship.  Can he deliver the one (promotions) without the other (relegations back to L1)?  In that respect he is, one could argue, as yet untested.
I'm not qualified to critique his football knowledge, but I am qualified to critique his approach to people, especially his players.  TBH, despite all the bonhomie, I just don't buy it, and I think some players don't buy it either.  Furthermore, I think that to some prospective signings PW's verbal diarrhoea is actually a reason NOT to sign.  I suspect that most players would prefer an honest b******ing where needed rather than all this passive-aggressive "I'm just a normal bloke, me" rubbish.

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

hi all
What most concerns me about PW is his inability to just shut up when necessary.  Rambling interview answers, accidental revelations of what should be confidential and kept within the squad - he does seem to be verbally incontinent TBH and this needs to change.
In your workplace, if your boss (who after all is responsible for your career) wanted you plaster your cubicle with photos of your family and asked inappropriate questions about them all the time, how long would it be before you reported that boss to HR?  Players are entitled, as professionals in the public eye, to a private life and to confidentiality.  Some of the stuff he says on the radio makes even me squirm, so I wonder how some players must feel?
At what point does concern for his employees well-being morph into just David Brent-isms?  I wonder if we have now passed Peak Warne?  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.  A footballer who has read a few Psychology books is also a dangerous thing.  This, remember, is a profession in which Roy Hodgson is regarded as a high level intellectual and Eric Cantona is apparently a philosopher by virtue of having a French accent and talking b******s.
I'm not accusing PW of any malice at all, but I do accuse him of naivety in the extreme.  There is a reason why most managers choose their words carefully in interviews.  Also, an apparent lack of verbal and cognitive discipline in public makes one wonder if he isn't actually similarly disorganised in other respects and relying on his staff to make the difficult calls behind the scenes.  Note also the "election" of the team captain, which is actually a complete abdication of his own responsibility to decide who has the necessary leadership qualities to wear the armband, accept the responsibility for that choice, and appoint the right player.  A football team is not a democracy.  
PW is very typical of the modern zeitgeist, in which everyone is all nicey-nicey on the surface, but underneath lurks a refusal to (a) grow up and accept the passing of time, (b) accept adulthood and the burdens and tough decisions that go with it and (c) accept that we can't be all things to all people all the time.
At this club, bobble hats and bull***t will only take you so far.  He has adjusted badly to being at a larger club with much more press and public scrutiny, and the signs are that it's gone to his head.  Time to cut the c**p and focus on delivery IMO.
"Popularity is a crime from the moment that it is SOUGHT".  No employer can ever keep everyone completely happy all the time, it just isn't possible, especially when you have 22 players competing for 11 starting places.  Gaining respect is more important to a manager than cultivating popularity, and respect lasts longer than popularity too.  In seeking popularity, my thesis is that PW has actually lost the respect of many people, hence the flat performances.  And a desire to be universally popular is nothing more than the manifestation of his own inner insecurity, and if he is to address that properly then he needs to take a sabbatical.  Failing that, just rig him up to a machine that delivers an electric shock if any answer to a question goes on longer than 30 seconds.  A few days of that should do it LOL.
If PW lived up to his own hype, we should see (a) a team greater than the sum of the parts, (b) in an appropriate formation, (c) busting a gut for the manager and the club.  So what happened?  Last seasons' tropes are already evident again this season - lack of imagination, fragile under pressure, losing games in the last 15 minutes, wrong formation for the strengths of the available players etc etc.
Warne lovers, by all means disagree or tell me I'm wrong.  However, when he was appointed we were 7th and we finished...7th.  Not a disaster, but not earth-shattering either.  

The title of this thread is ambiguous.  Is it inviting us to think of a "worse" manager than those listed (a relativistic judgement and matter of opinion, comparing one manager with another), or was the title a mistake and the intention was in fact to ask for who was the "worst" manager (in which case, only one name is needed to fulfil the request)?
"Those whom the Gods wish to destroy they first make mad".  And those whom they wish to make mad they first make managers.  As soon as any human being acquires power over others there will be problems.  Add to that the deadly cocktail of money, publicity and pressure to win that applies in football, and factor in the mostly under-educated nature of most footballers (with a few exceptions such as Roy Hodgson), and only those with either a huge ego or a vast inferiority complex or both would willingly step up.
I'm not sure if our history of eccentrics, egomaniacs, overachievers and underachievers is all that different from that of other clubs really, it's just that we know more about ours than about anyone else's.  Anyway, for what it's worth, here are my nominations.
Worst ever - Docherty, for all the reasons stated above.
Best ever - Cloughie, and you'll never be able to tell anyone of my generation any different.
Honourable mentions - Shteve Mac, Jim Smith & George Burley.
Dishonourable mentions - most of the rest for many different reasons.
 

The title of this thread is ambiguous.  Is it inviting us to think of a "worse" manager than those listed (a relativistic judgement and matter of opinion, comparing one manager with another), or was the title a mistake and the intention was in fact to ask for who was the "worst" manager (in which case, only one name is needed to fulfil the request)?
"Those whom the Gods wish to destroy they first make mad".  And those whom they wish to make mad they first make managers.  As soon as any human being acquires power over others there will be problems.  Add to that the deadly cocktail of money, publicity and pressure to win that applies in football, and factor in the mostly under-educated nature of most footballers (with a few exceptions such as Roy Hodgson), and only those with either a huge ego or a vast inferiority complex or both would willingly step up.
I'm not sure if our history of eccentrics, egomaniacs, overachievers and underachievers is all that different from that of other clubs really, it's just that we know more about ours than about anyone else's.  Anyway, for what it's worth, here are my nominations.
Worst ever - Docherty, for all the reasons stated above.
Best ever - Cloughie, and you'll never be able to tell anyone of my generation any different.
Honourable mentions - Shteve Mac, Jim Smith & George Burley.
Dishonourable mentions - most of the rest for many different reasons.
 

It seems to me that over his tenure many players emerged who made an impact in the 1st team &/or were sold on &/or played at the top level.  To name but a few - Hughes, Hendrick, Bogle, Lowe, Knight, Bird, Sibley.  It also seems to me that we owe him a big debt of gratitude for unearthing so much talent over the years, and for providing young players with a stable environment during the years of turbulence.  I for one would be sorry if the steady flow of Academy players into the 1st team were to end, and I hope that it doesn't.  Thank you Darren for everything and good luck in the future.

It seems to me that over his tenure many players emerged who made an impact in the 1st team &/or were sold on &/or played at the top level.  To name but a few - Hughes, Hendrick, Bogle, Lowe, Knight, Bird, Sibley.  It also seems to me that we owe him a big debt of gratitude for unearthing so much talent over the years, and for providing young players with a stable environment during the years of turbulence.  I for one would be sorry if the steady flow of Academy players into the 1st team were to end, and I hope that it doesn't.  Thank you Darren for everything and good luck in the future.

It seems to me that over his tenure many players emerged who made an impact in the 1st team &/or were sold on &/or played at the top level.  To name but a few - Hughes, Hendrick, Bogle, Lowe, Knight, Bird, Sibley.  It also seems to me that we owe him a big debt of gratitude for unearthing so much talent over the years, and for providing young players with a stable environment during the years of turbulence.  I for one would be sorry if the steady flow of Academy players into the 1st team were to end, and I hope that it doesn't.  Thank you Darren for everything and good luck in the future.

It seems to me that over his tenure many players emerged who made an impact in the 1st team &/or were sold on &/or played at the top level.  To name but a few - Hughes, Hendrick, Bogle, Lowe, Knight, Bird, Sibley.  It also seems to me that we owe him a big debt of gratitude for unearthing so much talent over the years, and for providing young players with a stable environment during the years of turbulence.  I for one would be sorry if the steady flow of Academy players into the 1st team were to end, and I hope that it doesn't.  Thank you Darren for everything and good luck in the future.

It seems to me that over his tenure many players emerged who made an impact in the 1st team &/or were sold on &/or played at the top level.  To name but a few - Hughes, Hendrick, Bogle, Lowe, Knight, Bird, Sibley.  It also seems to me that we owe him a big debt of gratitude for unearthing so much talent over the years, and for providing young players with a stable environment during the years of turbulence.  I for one would be sorry if the steady flow of Academy players into the 1st team were to end, and I hope that it doesn't.  Thank you Darren for everything and good luck in the future.

Nearly went under 
Nearly ceased to exist
Nearly didn't have a squad at the start of the season
Nearly lost the chance to sign any decent players due to restrictions
Nearly had some kind of a pre season but didn't
Nearly drew several games that we lost
Nearly won several games that we drew
Nearly finished 6th
SO
Thank you to The Nearly Men for at least playing like they cared and for giving us a season where we had some hope for a while
Now the next rebuild begins
And now PW knows that this time Nearly won't be good enough
See you in August folks

Nearly went under 
Nearly ceased to exist
Nearly didn't have a squad at the start of the season
Nearly lost the chance to sign any decent players due to restrictions
Nearly had some kind of a pre season but didn't
Nearly drew several games that we lost
Nearly won several games that we drew
Nearly finished 6th
SO
Thank you to The Nearly Men for at least playing like they cared and for giving us a season where we had some hope for a while
Now the next rebuild begins
And now PW knows that this time Nearly won't be good enough
See you in August folks

Be of good cheer gentlemen and ladies!
For yaaaaay, I bring you good tidings of great joy...erm...maybe...???
If we win, we're 5th or 6th whatever Posh do.
If we win and Bolton lose, we finish 5th and avoid the Owls in the playoff semis.
Since the Owls are 3rd whatever happens, I suspect they will rest some first choice players ready for the playoffs.  That might give us an opening.
If we draw, Posh still need to beat Baaaaarnsley away by 3 clear goals.  Yeah, right.  The odds are in our favour.  Let's just hope that Baaaarnsley don't rest too many first choice players for that one.
If we lose, Posh still need to win to overtake us.
In the first 3 scenarios we finish 5th or 6th.  In the last 2 we finish 7th.
Any probability experts or Actuaries out there want to have a go at calculating the odds on the above?  Or maybe the bookies already have...
It's another end of season squeaky bum nail biter.  Ears will be glued to phones, goals scored against Posh will provoke louder cheers than if we score ourselves, substitutions will be crucial, teams will go from rushing to take throw ins to out and out time wasting in a matter of seconds depending on how the scores change.
Watch out for the substitution of Collins for McGoldrick at half time if all the results are going our way.  McGoldrick will then be placed in a crate packed with cotton wool, put into storage away from anything even remotely hazardous, and fed and toileted via tubes like a spaceman.  At a secret location.  Guarded by men in dark suits with earpieces and Kalashnikovs.

Be of good cheer gentlemen and ladies!
For yaaaaay, I bring you good tidings of great joy...erm...maybe...???
If we win, we're 5th or 6th whatever Posh do.
If we win and Bolton lose, we finish 5th and avoid the Owls in the playoff semis.
Since the Owls are 3rd whatever happens, I suspect they will rest some first choice players ready for the playoffs.  That might give us an opening.
If we draw, Posh still need to beat Baaaaarnsley away by 3 clear goals.  Yeah, right.  The odds are in our favour.  Let's just hope that Baaaarnsley don't rest too many first choice players for that one.
If we lose, Posh still need to win to overtake us.
In the first 3 scenarios we finish 5th or 6th.  In the last 2 we finish 7th.
Any probability experts or Actuaries out there want to have a go at calculating the odds on the above?  Or maybe the bookies already have...
It's another end of season squeaky bum nail biter.  Ears will be glued to phones, goals scored against Posh will provoke louder cheers than if we score ourselves, substitutions will be crucial, teams will go from rushing to take throw ins to out and out time wasting in a matter of seconds depending on how the scores change.
Watch out for the substitution of Collins for McGoldrick at half time if all the results are going our way.  McGoldrick will then be placed in a crate packed with cotton wool, put into storage away from anything even remotely hazardous, and fed and toileted via tubes like a spaceman.  At a secret location.  Guarded by men in dark suits with earpieces and Kalashnikovs.

Be of good cheer gentlemen and ladies!
For yaaaaay, I bring you good tidings of great joy...erm...maybe...???
If we win, we're 5th or 6th whatever Posh do.
If we win and Bolton lose, we finish 5th and avoid the Owls in the playoff semis.
Since the Owls are 3rd whatever happens, I suspect they will rest some first choice players ready for the playoffs.  That might give us an opening.
If we draw, Posh still need to beat Baaaaarnsley away by 3 clear goals.  Yeah, right.  The odds are in our favour.  Let's just hope that Baaaarnsley don't rest too many first choice players for that one.
If we lose, Posh still need to win to overtake us.
In the first 3 scenarios we finish 5th or 6th.  In the last 2 we finish 7th.
Any probability experts or Actuaries out there want to have a go at calculating the odds on the above?  Or maybe the bookies already have...
It's another end of season squeaky bum nail biter.  Ears will be glued to phones, goals scored against Posh will provoke louder cheers than if we score ourselves, substitutions will be crucial, teams will go from rushing to take throw ins to out and out time wasting in a matter of seconds depending on how the scores change.
Watch out for the substitution of Collins for McGoldrick at half time if all the results are going our way.  McGoldrick will then be placed in a crate packed with cotton wool, put into storage away from anything even remotely hazardous, and fed and toileted via tubes like a spaceman.  At a secret location.  Guarded by men in dark suits with earpieces and Kalashnikovs.